the fact you say timing marks on a belt sound fishy to me.............. But if the rotor is pointing to the #1 plug wire that is going to the #1 plug then ... If not rotate the crank one more turn,.
But in all reality, where ever the rotor is pointing as long as it was running fine, as long as the new dist has rotor in same spot, you will be fine. I dont even bother lining up the crank dampener.
Just mark the rotor position and the housing position and poke the other one in same way,

 

Problem is my Jeep is not running. I'm replacing the distributor because I think it aint working right.
So the fact that the rotor is not pointing to the #1 post, makes me wonder if the distributor is good but just outta alignment, or if it is indeed bad.

 

First of all, it does not matter which distributor cap post you select as #1. The rotor moves in a circle, you see. Simply select a #1 and run your firing order from there.

On the other hand, from your description it seems you have forgotten that the rotor only turns one half revolution for each revolution of the crankshaft. The camshaft runs at half crankshaft speed. When you align the crank timing marks, they do not know where the cam is. Rotate the crank one more revolution and the rotor will be pointing to the opposite terminal.

 

A timing light will tell you if the jeep jumped time. Even if it will not run, just get some one to crank it while you point the light. It will still fire close enough to show you. Either the light will flash around the TDC mark on crank and 10degree on the marker tab or it will be way to one side. if that is case the timing chain jumped or you put the clamp on the wrong plug wire...I did that once..

 

There have been a few distributors that were off when installed correctly. #1 tdc happens in compression and ehsaut. Spin the engine with a wrench on the crank. Remove #1 plug and put your finger over the hole. When your finger is feeling the pressure from the compression turn it until you reach tdc. If you need to put a screw driver into the hole so you can see it as it reaches tdc. Then set the distributor. The timing marks should work for you too.

 

The first problem with that way, to 'time' an engine is, the harmonic balancer is a two piece unit. It has an inner and outer section held together with a rubber gasket. They can slip and get out of alignment.

Time the engine mechanically, then check to see where the rotor points.

 

Just following the Chilton manual on how to remove the distributor 1995 YJ Wrangler...

 

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/joopacabra-1563169/index2.html

This is what I was told.

"The timing dots on the timing set when aligned has the engine at TDC firing #6, also at this time the #1 valves should be a "SPLIT OVERLAP" (that means the exhaust is almost closed and the intake is starting to open). Most engine builders use this to rough degree a cam in."

basically what you want is to look at the rotor while you turn the engine over with a 3/4 inch socket. when the rotor is at or near number one the mark should align on the balancer. the balancer will align the marks at 2 points in the firing order. so line it up on number one. then if something is off you will have to determine if it is the balancer that slipped, or if it is only off a little possibly you jumped a tooth on the timing chain. anyway, hopefully the pictures of my engine with the timing cover off will help you see what is going on in there.

 

Great link mustanggarage. thanks.
Well my rotor was neither aligned to number 6 or number 1, so that makes me even more suspicious.
Leme ask you since you are the first person who I know who's actually done the timing chain.
1) Can you do it with the engine in, or does the engine have to be lifted?
2) How hard was it?

 

yes you can do it with the engine in. in fact these jeeps are relatively easy to do. the only hard part is getting the lower seal to stay in place when you put the cover back on. the new seal has to cover the top of the oil pan. so what I did was after I had the timing chain changed and put the new seal in the timing cover, I put the gasket on the cover with rtv on the oil pan part and tied it in place using several pieces of fine thread I "borrowed" from my wife's sewing basket. then I put the new seal in the cover, then put the gasket on the cover with rtv and let it get tacky. once that was tacky I carefully put the cover back on. while it is possible to do with out removing much except the fan and harmonic balancer it is a lot easier to just remove the grill and radiator as one piece then you have easy access to make sure you get it on right. that is a common spot for oil leaks which I hate. but again it is really pretty easy to do. once other little tip if you have never done it before when you take the chain and sprockets off they will come off easy because there will be slack in the chain when you put it back on however you have to basically put both gears on at the same time or there will not be enough slack to get the other started.

good luck.

 

Im betting that your distributor is sitting 180 degrees out. Turn your crank another revolution to the timing marks and see if the rotor is in the same spot.

 

I was thinking that the OP was looking at TDC on the exhaust stroke myself. But he has to verify what he is doing/looking at

 

was just thinking if they spun it once more and found the rotor pointed to #1 with the timing marks lined up again then they would kinda know.. but yes they should pull #1 plug out and go through the motions to know for sure.

 

I'm at a loss and am about giving up. I've been dead in the water for over 2 weeks now.
I don't understand the 180 degrees out thing. How can a rotor go 180 degrees out without taking the distributor out of the vehicle?

 

Because you were probably not on the intake stroke but on the exhaust stroke.....that is why timing it mechanically is the only way to know for sure where you are

 

If you have fuel and spark it can only be timing.

 

ok ladyback. I get it, so being off 180 doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the rotor, just I was at the wrong point to judge the position of it...

 

@ Que89YJ any way I can test the timing without pulling everything to get at the chain?

Correct!

See post #6

 

@ Que89YJ any way I can test the timing without pulling everything to get at the chain?

 

first of all what I would suggest is you make sure you are at top dead center on the compression stroke of number 1 cylinder. to do that take out the spark plugs so the engine turns over easier. then put your finger over the spark plug hole and have someone slowly crank the engine around by using a ratchet on the harmonic balancer bolt. as they crank it around you will feel pressure build up under your finger. when that happens you will know you are on the compression stroke. then you can align the groove in the balancer pulley with the alignment marks on the timing cover. the groove is sometimes hard to see. I usually take a bit of white paint and paint a mark on the outer edge of the pulley at the same spot so it is easier to see. then once the timing marks are aligned you should be at tdc on number one, then I like to use a clean drinking straw. put it down the spark plug hole till it touches the piston. then rotate the engine forward and back just a few degrees to make sure the piston is exactly tdc. if the piston is at tdc and the timing marks lined up properly you can be pretty sure the harmonic balancer hasn't slipped and you can then trust the timing mark. at this point look at the position of the rotor. it should look like the second picture. if it is then the distributor is in pretty much correctly, it is possible it could be off one tooth but it will be close. at that point if it won't fire at all you either have a problem with the timing chain having slipped a cog, a bad crank position sensor or an unrelated problem. so do these things so we can get an idea where you are at. then give us a bit more information about how this all started.

 

honestly when I review what you said at the beginning you said the jeep wasn't running. what led you to think it was the distributor? in a 4.0 jeep engine with a sudden or intermittent crank but no fire problem my first bet would be the crank position sensor, have you checked that? basically how did you get to the point you thought the distributor is bad? this will help some of the experts on here that know a lot more than I do figure out what the problem is.

 

That is a good question and a good supposition concerning the cranks sensor as the prime suspect BUT it appears the OP has already messed with the dizzy. Once we can believe that the dizzy is in properly IF it doesn't start then maybe we will start looking at bad sensors.

Assumption is the mother of all fawkups

 

CPS was the first thing I replaced.

 

crank sensors..aftermarket ones are known to be have quality issues. Did you buy an OEM unit that had the plug on it already?

 

@ mustang I can see the timing marks labeled 0 - 20 on the lower piece #2 in the diagram but don't see any other marks... right now the engine is in the jeep and everything is buttoned up. thanks for the help by the way.

 

Do this first. It is imperative that the timing can be verified to be right.

Here is a write up I put together to attempt to help anyone who pulled their dizzy and now got a bit confused.

Mark the base of your distributor below the cap where #1 tower is on your distributor cap. Pull #1 spark plug. Insert finger in #1 spark plug hole.

Turn engine with socket and breaker bar until you feel a whoosh of air pushing past that finger in #1 cylinder. Remove finger and drop a long bladed screwdriver or wooden dowel into #1 cylinder.

Slowly bring #1 piston up to TDC. That is where #1 piston is at its highest point. You are now at TDC on the compression stroke of #1 piston.

Now check your timing marks. It should be at TDC also. Pull your distributor cap. Your rotor should be at or just before #1 tower of that mark you made noting the position of #1 tower on your distributor cap.

If not, something is not right….obviously. That could be a jumped timing chain, or a bad distributor gear. If the timing marks are off but it runs fine then the most likely culprit is the harmonic balancer which is a two piece affair has had the outside layer ‘slip’ so the marks are off but the timing is correct.

 

I assume you know this but just to make certain. there is a groove in the harmonic balancer you can see it in that first picture. it is difficult to see from the top so what I do is get under the jeep and rotate the engine around with a ratchet until you can see that groove. again it is hard to see and there are sometimes other marks that look like it but this will be a straight groove . once you find that mark it on the outside edge with white paint. that way when you rotate it around you will be able to see it better. look at this picture. you will see the very difficult to see timing mark on the inside with white paint to highlight it and the second mark on the outside of the pulley. is that the mark you used when you set the engine to tdc?

 

PM sent to the OP and he replied. When he digs into it tomorrow he knows he can call me

 

@ mustang yes. that is the groove I used to check the rotor, but when that mark on the harmonic balancer was brought around to the 0 timing mark on the other side, I did not check the position of cylinder #1. I'll do that tomorrow, and see where I'm at. thanks again to all.