Can you remove the outer pinion bearing without taking the carrier out and removing the pinion, say with a bearing puller of some sorts?
D30 Outer Pinion Bearing removal without removing carrier?
Eric90xj
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No accurate way of setting pinion depth and preload doing it that way thous is there.
If you think the pinion bearing is shot, just go ahead and replace them all at the same time IMO.
Martin
If you think the pinion bearing is shot, just go ahead and replace them all at the same time IMO.
Martin
Pinion depth and preload should be the same as before though if you use the same spacers though right?
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Hmmmm, good luck with that mate.
That is dependent on you getting the pinion nut at the EXACT same tightness, and the new bearing being exactly the same thickness as the old one, and sitting in the housing in exactly the same place.
One way to do it right, and I have said it.
Your call, your rig. But a new gearset and master install kit is a lot more expensive than just new bearings last time I looked...
Martin
That is dependent on you getting the pinion nut at the EXACT same tightness, and the new bearing being exactly the same thickness as the old one, and sitting in the housing in exactly the same place.
One way to do it right, and I have said it.
Your call, your rig. But a new gearset and master install kit is a lot more expensive than just new bearings last time I looked...
Martin
Hmm I guess that is true the bearing could vary very slightly, however I can imagain that I would be to a very negligible amount probably less than a shim could take care of. I do have to agree with you completely on the pinion nut tightness however.
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Believe me, bearings can differ a lot more than the thickness of a shim etc....Been there and done it.
You will also never get the pinion nut to exactly where it is right now, so it's a moot point IMO.
Like I said though, up to you as to whether you want it done right and protect a perfectly good R&P, or hack the job and potentially destroy the R&P.
What exactly is stopping you from doing the job the right way?
I know making that initial cost saving is tempting, but in the long run it isn't worth it in this case.......
Just my .02
Martin
You will also never get the pinion nut to exactly where it is right now, so it's a moot point IMO.
Like I said though, up to you as to whether you want it done right and protect a perfectly good R&P, or hack the job and potentially destroy the R&P.
What exactly is stopping you from doing the job the right way?
I know making that initial cost saving is tempting, but in the long run it isn't worth it in this case.......
Just my .02
Martin
Bearings are made to be precision parts, I can't see how a bearing could differ so much to where it would affect the shim, that means that it had been designed that every time a bearing wears out and is replaced, that would require a pricey gear shim job? If it is a replacement bearing it should be the same size I believe. Also, if not adjusting the inner bearing shims at all, changing the outer bearing shims should only effect the preload in the outer bearing I believe, and not having an effect on the gears themselves. That is my reasoning for this case. Could be right or wrong in reality but that's what I am here to figure out.
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x2 ... i say go for it the risk is minimal ...D30 are not exactly examples of high percision
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As I said, your diff, your call.
You asked, I answered.
Martin
You asked, I answered.
Martin
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Well, I guess you meant precision? If that's the case, then I guess you haven't looked inside too many differentials?
A diff is a diff is a diff. From that Dana 30, to the RT40-142's in my big rig. Both need the same exact tolerances to operate for any length of time without going bang. Tolerances differ, as does everything else in different axles, but the one thing that is common is that they all need to be setup correctly.
If that doesn't float your boat and ring true, then by all means go tear your own stuff up. Just try to refrain from giving bad advise, even when the person asks it doesn't want to hear that he shouldn't be taking short cuts......
Martin
I agree I always prefer to do things right, however I question..IS this doing it wrong? I'm talking about using the same shims, the same bearing, everything is the same, and at that, all changes are taking place outside of the diff. I would like to know how this will affect the way the gears mesh at all. I understand that all diffs are precision assemblies, but can someone explain to me how this will disturb the gears?
You would use the same shims as a STARTING point and install everything again followed by measuring backlash and pinion preload. Not every bearing is the same, a hairline difference in size and that throws off everything in the gears.
I'm literally going through the exact same issue with my 30 (at least i think i am), your pinion bearing is shot? Mine is literally DONE, in and out play, horizontal, and lateral also. It leaks like crazy and it makes insane noises, I'm either buying a set of rebuilt/geared axles or a shop is going to rebuild and regear mine with master overhaul kits. I think a master overhaul kit is less than a hundred, if that pinion bearing is done I'll bet a lot on the carrier bearings being almost gone also. Pull the driveshaft, save some cash up and just have a shop rebuild it with an overhaul kit. You get all new bearings and new seals, how much would it suck to get that new pinion bearing pressed on and setup just to find out a few months from now that your carrier bearings are gone also because of miniscule shavings that the eye cant catch floating around in the gear oil. Just because you caught the play now doesnt mean that the bearing has been bad for a year or so, my thoughts for my situation which is similar to urs is to grab a jy 30, rebuild mine (my gears must be done by now tho), regear with a rebuild, or buy geared and built axles. These guys are right you cant just slap some new bearings in and call it good.
I'm literally going through the exact same issue with my 30 (at least i think i am), your pinion bearing is shot? Mine is literally DONE, in and out play, horizontal, and lateral also. It leaks like crazy and it makes insane noises, I'm either buying a set of rebuilt/geared axles or a shop is going to rebuild and regear mine with master overhaul kits. I think a master overhaul kit is less than a hundred, if that pinion bearing is done I'll bet a lot on the carrier bearings being almost gone also. Pull the driveshaft, save some cash up and just have a shop rebuild it with an overhaul kit. You get all new bearings and new seals, how much would it suck to get that new pinion bearing pressed on and setup just to find out a few months from now that your carrier bearings are gone also because of miniscule shavings that the eye cant catch floating around in the gear oil. Just because you caught the play now doesnt mean that the bearing has been bad for a year or so, my thoughts for my situation which is similar to urs is to grab a jy 30, rebuild mine (my gears must be done by now tho), regear with a rebuild, or buy geared and built axles. These guys are right you cant just slap some new bearings in and call it good.
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If the new bearing is not the exact same thickness then the pinion will be positioned closer or further away from the ring gear, this distance is critical and the only way to tell that is to remove the diff and measure the distance with a depth gauge, end of story. I can't believe you are actually arguing with everyone over why you can't do it wrong, this is funny but a bit troubling at the same time. Do it your way if you want and tell us how it works out a year or two down the road.
Well I admit that it is not what I wanted to hear but I am arguing my point because until the most recent posts I have gotten a lot of simply you are doing it wrong sort of answers but am I not allowed to question further into the reasoning behind it?
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The only thing that can possibly change when you change the outer pinion bearing is pinion bearing preload. With that said, setting pinion preload to be within spec on a Dana 30 or 44 usually winds up needing a shim down to the nearest 0.001". So it's always a scramble to find some combination of shims to get that number. I have found that 0.002" will take you from one end of the preload spec past the other end. So setting preload is twitchy. The idea of having to set the exact same torque as before on the pinion nut is only something to worry about with a crush sleeve type pinion preload setup. If you torque down a pinion nut all the way and don't have enough preload shims in, you will crush the bearing and have to throw it away.
So you could get lucky just swapping that one bearing but the risk is fairly high that the preload shims won't be exactly the same for the new bearing.
So you could get lucky just swapping that one bearing but the risk is fairly high that the preload shims won't be exactly the same for the new bearing.
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Just FYI, changing the outer pinion bearing will NOT have any effect on the pinion depth. That was wrong info.
So basically, the risk is setting an incorrect bearing preload and premature wear and/or failure of the bearing?
Just out of curiosity, if I changed the inner bearing too, would I be compromising pinion depth here to the point where it should be professionally re shimmed?
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No I beg to differ, the bearing itself play just as much of a part in overall depth as the shims themselves. That's why they have shim kits in the first place, if every part was made exactly the same in every way every time then we wouldn't need shim kits, you could just torque it to spec and it would be perfect every time. That's not the case in the real world here though of course.
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