Two separate units that require their own service.

 

According to the 1974 jeep cj5 TSM, the transmission and transfer case share oil. That complicates things for me since the trans case and the PTO also share oil.

 

They should be separate. If the fluid from the transmission goes into the transfer case then there is a bad seal. Drain plugs will be on the lowest point on the transfer case and transmission. My D20 the drain plug takes a 3/8 drive extension and is on the bottom of the transfer case. But I do not have a pto.

 

Thanks for the info. It makes since to me that the trans and the transfer case would be separate and have separate oil.

 

To my knowledge there is no output bearing seal on a T14. The T14 and D18 on my 71 shared oil through the transmission output bearing and a passage. I'm pretty sure your set up is the same.
The pan PTO (which is rather rare) uses the same oil as the T case. To remove it you will need a stock inspection plate, gasket, and possibly bolts (I believe the PTO bolts are longer).
So, everything should be sharing the same oil.

 

OK, so if the transmission, the transfer case and the PTO are all sharing the same oil then when I changed the transmission oil I suppose I really didn't accomplish much since the trans is the highest of the three. The PTO is the lowest and it appears to have a drain plug in the bottom and a check/fill plug on the side. At this point I'm confused about how to avoid overfilling the transfer case and PTO if all three are sharing the same oil. It was not really my intention to remove the PTO since it was doing no harm. Incidentally, where the the PTO is mounted to the trans case, is where the trans case bottom pan with drain plug was. As best as I can tell, the only way to drain the trans case oil now is through the PTO drain plug.

 

A little research will answer your questions! Jeep® 1974 TSM online (oljeep.com)

Download it all. You will eventually need most of it.

It doesn't display correctly in my browser.

 

A little research will answer your questions! Jeep® 1974 TSM online (oljeep.com)

Download it all. You will eventually need most of it.

It doesn't display correctly in my browser.

Great source of info. I've been needing that. Thanks.

 

Use gl4 not gl5 rated gear oil also to protect syncros!

 

There is so much contradictory information out there with regards to the correct oil to use. I've read much about using GL 4 as opposed to the GL 5. My impression is that present day GL 5 is OK, but it all depends on which "expert" you want to listen to. The Novak people contend that GL 5 is OK.

 

Ok,....I feel like I'm beating a dead horse but here is where I am. First I drained the PTO. Out drained a small amount of oil that appeared to be fairly clean. Certainly there wasn't enough oil drained that would have supplied the transfer case as well. Keep in mind that with the PTO attached to the bottom of the transfer case (in place of the trans case bottom pan and drain) there is no drain for the transfer case. Next I unscrewed the check/fill plug on the trans case and a "fair" amount of dirty oil ran out. At this point I can't help but believe that there is still oil in the trans case that can't drain out. Next I pulled the drain plug on the transmission and an appropriate amount of oil drained out. Sooo....My plan now is to order a new bottom pan for the trans case and then remove and discard the PTO. This will at least allow me to fill and monitor the oil in the trans case. I'm hoping that removing the PTO will be as simple as unbolting it from the trans case. If all goes well then I will have just the transmission (T14) and the transfer case (dana 20) in which to keep fluids checked and maintained. Simple right? Except it might not be because they share oil. Full disclosure,..I have a long sad history of making things harder and more complicated than they have to be.

 

First, the transfer holes for the oil are higher up in the casings. This keeps the levels higher in both boxes. It can also allow one box to drain (leak) oil out while sitting, causing the level to be lower than the other box or "pump" oil from one box to another if the levels are low in both.

.My plan now is to order a new bottom pan for the trans case and then remove and discard the PTO. This will at least allow me to fill and monitor the oil in the trans case. I'm hoping that removing the PTO will be as simple as unbolting it from the trans case.

Don't "discard" the PTO. D20 pan PTO's are fairly rare and tossing one would be a loss.
That being said, the T case drains from the bottom, regardless of the PTO.
Replacing it with the stock cover is easy. Simply unbolt the PTO, replace the gasket (if needed), and bolt on the cover. I can't remember, but it seems the bolts for the PTO are longer than the cover bolts.

 

OK,....I'm dealing with a number of issues on my 1974 CJ5 project. One minor question that I am presently trying to sort out has to do with the oil for the transmission and the transfer case. As best as I can tell the transmission is a T-14, manual 3 speed and the transfer case is a Dana 20. My question is do each of those have their own oil or do they share the same oil. I've drained and then replaced the oil for the transmission (I used 85w-90 gear oil). If the same needs to be done with the transfer case, I don't know where the check/fill plug is or where the drain is. A small additional complication is a PTO added to the transfer case. The jeep had a PTO powered front wench when I first acquired it but I have taken the wench and PTO shaft off and will not be using those. I assume that the PTO has its own oil but I'm not sure about that either. Lots of questions and would appreciate any helpful info......Thanks

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OK,....I'm dealing with a number of issues on my 1974 CJ5 project. One minor question that I am presently trying to sort out has to do with the oil for the transmission and the transfer case. As best as I can tell the transmission is a T-14, manual 3 speed and the transfer case is a Dana 20. My question is do each of those have their own oil or do they share the same oil. I've drained and then replaced the oil for the transmission (I used 85w-90 gear oil). If the same needs to be done with the transfer case, I don't know where the check/fill plug is or where the drain is. A small additional complication is a PTO added to the transfer case. The jeep had a PTO powered front wench when I first acquired it but I have taken the wench and PTO shaft off and will not be using those. I assume that the PTO has its own oil but I'm not sure about that either. Lots of questions and would appreciate any helpful info......Thanks

View attachment 4147354 View attachment 4147355 View attachment 4147356

OK,....I'm dealing with a number of issues on my 1974 CJ5 project. One minor question that I am presently trying to sort out has to do with the oil for the transmission and the transfer case. As best as I can tell the transmission is a T-14, manual 3 speed and the transfer case is a Dana 20. My question is do each of those have their own oil or do they share the same oil. I've drained and then replaced the oil for the transmission (I used 85w-90 gear oil). If the same needs to be done with the transfer case, I don't know where the check/fill plug is or where the drain is. A small additional complication is a PTO added to the transfer case. The jeep had a PTO powered front wench when I first acquired it but I have taken the wench and PTO shaft off and will not be using those. I assume that the PTO has its own oil but I'm not sure about that either. Lots of questions and would appreciate any helpful info......Thanks

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I think you have all the answers but Novak is a great source of information and they generally willing to guide you if you have questions or they did in the past.
I would recommend not discarding the PTO if you remove it. I would sell it to someone out there looking for one. As mentioned kind of a rare piece.

 

OK,.....At present I have removed the PTO and have ordered the bottom pan and new gasket for the Dana 20 (hope to get that delivery later this week). Also will be trying to find new bolts for the bottom pan. Was glad to see that the inside of the trans case, gears ect., looked good. No apparent rust, wear or broken teeth at least not to my untrained eyes. The inside of the PTO unit looked good as well. As an aside, I need to mention that in the process of removing the PTO I discovered a second drain plug that I didn't know existed. The PTO has two drain plugs! Pulling that plug drained the undrained oil from the trans case and part of the PTO. So I finally found out how to drain the trans case. Now, moving along, while I have the trans case emptied of oil and open in the bottom, I want to remove and then reinstall the bearing cover which is located right below the fill/check plug on the back side of the trans case. It appears to be leaking. After having studied a parts diagram I don't understand how that cover is sealed against leakage. The parts diagram shows at least three shims under the cover but no gasket. The cover is held in place by 4 bolts but there doesn't seem to be a gasket or O ring or anything else to seal it. Any ideas?
Now, I've got a PTO and wench system that I've removed from the jeep (1974 cj5). System includes front bumper, wench, PTO shaft and PTO taken off of the Dana 20. Needs a good home.

 

Get it very clean and use rtv(not too much)

 

The cover houses the shim pack for the front output shaft.

Unbolt the four bolts and tap lightly laterally on the cover to loosen it. It will drop off.

Remove all the shims.

Clean the shim pack and the rear of the t case where they ride.

Reinstall the shims and cover.

Check the front output shaft end play. There should be zero end play and a light drag when rotating the yoke. If there is too much end play or the yoke is binding, adjust the shim pack to get it right.

Remove the cover/shims and spray each lightly with copper spray gasket adhesive.

Stack the shims. Assemble on the rear of the cover using two bolts.

Reinstall the cover/shim assembly on the rear of the t case.

Install the other two bolts and tighten.

Done.


You can use any bolts for the t case inspection cover. Don't over tighten them or you run the risk of damaging the gasket.


You might post a picture of the winch/PTO assembly. There is a for sale column, but I suspect you will get more response up here. Might aslo try earlycj5.net. Lots of interest for these things there also.......

 

Ok,..thanks for the guidance. Before I removed the rear bearing cover I checked the front output shaft and there was a little play. So I then removed the bearing cover and shims and then cleaned them all. There were four shims, two .031 shims and two .003 shims. Not having a way to measure the front shaft end play, I decided to repack the shims and cover leaving out the two .003 shims. This seems to have worked. There is now no endplay and shaft rotation seems free enough. I picked up a can of the copper gasket spray and used that so I'm hoping for no leaks. (I've never used that stuff before) Next, I installed my shinny new used bottom pan (from Ebay) on the Dana 20. New gasket and rtv. It all looks pretty good, I hope it remains trouble free and leak free. Thanks for you help!

 

As I had mentioned earlier I have removed a PTO operated wench system from my 1974 cj5. The PTO itself was pulled from a Dana 20 transfer case. I have the PTO, pto shaft, wench, roller guide and front bumper. Bought the jeep about a year ago and never used the wench. It all "looks" to be in serviceable condition. Needs a good home.