[Delta0]

I like the air bag idea. Keeps you at ~4" all the time, no matter what the load. Then you can set the driveshaft pinion angles dead on for 4" and minimize the vibes.
The bumpstop extensions may be a bit too long. Try some high dollar offroad shocks that maximize suspension travel, making sure they ride in the sweet spot for 4".

Please will you explain to me how your airbags keep you at 4" all the time H?

 

[HighLonesome]

I was thinking helper springs. The install looks like work. They need 5 psi minimum. I thought they could be deflated entirely. So that is going to change your current ride height.

https://www.etrailer.com/Vehicle-Suspension/Air-Lift/AL60754.html?feed=npn&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google%20%7C%20Shop%20-%20Vehicle%20Suspension&adgroupid=84911362294&campaignid=203667377&creative=404001548639&device=c&devicemodel=&feeditemid=&keyword=&loc_interest_ms=&loc_physical_ms=9030456&matchtype=&network=g&placement=&position=&gclid=CjwKCAiA_omPBhBBEiwAcg7smQXgjCJ83f2DdQA2YjysZEpGbsk0s0Kcq1CpYZU9LEUfz94DQM3wpBoCtiMQAvD_BwE

 

[Delta0]

I was thinking helper springs. The install looks like work. They need 5 psi minimum. I thought they could be deflated entirely. So that is going to change your current ride height.

https://www.etrailer.com/Vehicle-Suspension/Air-Lift/AL60754.html?feed=npn&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google%20%7C%20Shop%20-%20Vehicle%20Suspension&adgroupid=84911362294&campaignid=203667377&creative=404001548639&device=c&devicemodel=&feeditemid=&keyword=&loc_interest_ms=&loc_physical_ms=9030456&matchtype=&network=g&placement=&position=&gclid=CjwKCAiA_omPBhBBEiwAcg7smQXgjCJ83f2DdQA2YjysZEpGbsk0s0Kcq1CpYZU9LEUfz94DQM3wpBoCtiMQAvD_BwE

Ah, you plan to adjust the pressure manually to keep the ride height at 4" then H?

 

[sdg3205]

As other have said, get Airlift. The very reasonably priced and very effective.

 

[HighLonesome]

That could be your plan. Me, I have 2 ZJs. One is a lifted weekend warrior and I just keep it loaded up and have the suspension and driveline tuned for that height. The other is a stock UC ZJ. I'm pondering an Airlift kit though. Looks like all you need extra is the pump and proper spacers for your lift. I like the Airlift because if you lose pressure, you still have the original suspension. I had air adjustable shocks at one time and the pump failed. Driving without shocks is something you don't want to repeat. Anyway, good luck with it.

 

[Delta0]

That could be your plan. Me, I have 2 ZJs. One is a lifted weekend warrior and I just keep it loaded up and have the suspension and driveline tuned for that height. The other is a stock UC ZJ. I'm pondering an Airlift kit though. Looks like all you need extra is the pump and proper spacers for your lift. I like the Airlift because if you lose pressure, you still have the original suspension. I had air adjustable shocks at one time and the pump failed. Driving without shocks is something you don't want to repeat. Anyway, good luck with it.

Have you ever considered taking the load off
your loaded WW's rear springs
by using axle stands at strong points on the frame
just in front of the rear wheel
between trips H?

 

[HighLonesome]

no, and not sure what you're getting at
I think you mean easing the load on the springs to preserve them?

 

[Delta0]

no, and not sure what you're getting at
I think you mean easing the load on the springs to preserve them?

Exactly.
Easing the load on the rubbers at the end of the springs too.

 

[CraigMBAx]

Hi.

With the jeep being loaded with gear/passengers the suspension sags significantly to the point where the bump stops are almost touching in the rear.

Springs carry weight. You need stiffer springs. The question is which ones.

Do you know what exact springs you have?

I want a good suspension setup that handles trails with whoops and rocks even when loaded with gear.

Of course. What you have isn't working. Your Jeep probably has stinkbug squat something fierce.

there has to be something that allows me to drive on these trails at a reasonable speed.

The right spring would fix your problem.

It's a little late to dry weigh your rig pre modified now, but if I were you, I'd check your tire pressure (so it's exactly the same) take your rig to a truck scale and weight the front and rear axles without the camping gear in it, and measure from the ground to a spot on the front and the rear (marked with a piece of tape on the fender or a scribe mark or something) and write it all down.

Then I'd go load the camping gear up, recheck the tire pressure, measure the ride height again, and recheck the ride heights and write that all down

So, it'd be

Tire Pressure Empty (Front/Rear)
Ride Height Empty (Front/Rear)
Axle Weight Empty (Front/Rear)

And repeat loaded.

If you post up that data, I'll gladly do the calculations for you so you know what your installed spring rate actually is.

Then you can call around and find someone who will sell you the right springs for your loaded application.

Good luck.

 

[Delta0]

I daresay you can get springs wound to suit your need Doc.

However, the big plus with airbags
is that you can adjust your ride height
to suit the terrain in which you are travelling,

 

[Mr. Bitey]

They need 5 psi minimum. I thought they could be deflated entirely. So that is going to change your current ride height.

I have those same bags, and leave 5psi in them as recommended. It's so they don't slide up and down in the spring causing excessive wear. I cannot tell the difference in ride quality until they have over 10psi in them. Ride height at 5psi is negligible.

For my install I put the Shrader behind the filler door, and added a tee to install a gauge in the window visible at the filler door.

 

[Delta0]

I have those same bags, and leave 5psi in them as recommended. It's so they don't slide up and down in the spring causing excessive wear. I cannot tell the difference in ride quality until they have over 10psi in them. Ride height at 5psi is negligible.

For my install I put the Shrader behind the filler door, and added a tee to install a gauge in the window visible at the filler door.

View attachment 4133025 View attachment 4133026

What were your reasons for not having an onboard pump please Mr B?
Also, why didn't you fit an electric valve
so you could reduce airbag pressure while you drive please?

 

[Mr. Bitey]

What were your reasons for not having an onboard pump please Mr B?
Also, why didn't you fit an electric valve
so you could reduce airbag pressure while you drive please?

Cost, and really no need for either in my case. I added the bags for load assist. Load gear, add air. Unload, dump the air. I do always carry a 12v pump, but that is more for a roadside flat tire repair. I can't say I've ever had to refill or add air to the bags on the road - there is just no need, since the load doesn't change while I am enroute. I also generally have the bags empty (5psi) or full (30psi) - never really played around in the middle. The gauge I added is just to prevent overfilling, and to monitor for leaks.

 

[Delta0]

Cost, and really no need for either in my case. I added the bags for load assist. Load gear, add air. Unload, dump the air. I do always carry a 12v pump, but that is more for a roadside flat tire repair. I can't say I've ever had to refill or add air to the bags on the road - there is just no need, since the load doesn't change while I am enroute. I also generally have the bags empty (5psi) or full (30psi) - never really played around in the middle. The gauge I added is just to prevent overfilling, and to monitor for leaks.

Thank you very much Mr B.

 

[CraigMBAx]

I daresay you can get springs wound to suit your need Doc.

Just order the right springs! If he knew what the axle weighed it'd be a snap.

 

[Delta0]

Just order the right springs! If he knew what the axle weighed it'd be a snap.

What have you got against a system
that adapts the suspension
according to the terrain please Craig?

 

[skain8]

Springs, as mentioned. You need a higher spring rate. There is a thread (or threads) that discuss and confirm spring rate for the various manufacturers. IRO makes softies. I believe they offer (or offered) an HD version that carried a higher spring rate. IIRC, there are other manufacturers at 4" besides IRO and Clayton -- perhaps BDS, etc. If you go with new higher-rated springs, make sure your shocks are valved to match so they effectively control the spring.

 

[CraigMBAx]

What have you got against a system
that adapts the suspension
according to the terrain please Craig?

All the air bag does is raise the spring rate. More air = more spring rate.

It DOES NOT adapt unless you change the pressure.

I worked in medium truck for a while and they use airbags on trailers and rear axles, or at least they did when I was around them. Not two springs.

Why not just put the right spring in it and be done?

 

[CraigMBAx]

If you go with new higher-rated springs, make sure your shocks are valved to match so they effectively control the spring.

Airbags (air springs) need a different shock valving than a regular coil spring.

 

[Delta0]

All the air bag does is raise the spring rate. More air = more spring rate.

It DOES NOT adapt unless you change the pressure.

I worked in medium truck for a while and they use airbags on trailers and rear axles, or at least they did when I was around them. Not two springs.

Why not just put the right spring in it and be done?

Thanks Craig.

Are there ever "Right" springs
when the parameters change please Craig?

Briefly: -

Highway touch release valve button

- lower pressure & ride height.​

Off road, touch the pump button

- raise pressure 1/2 way & ride height 1/2 way​

Really rough stuff, touch pump button

- Raise pressure all the way, ditto ride height.​

On the way back,
thanks to reduced quantities of grub, booze, etc
lower pressures.

For really cool, air bag the front too.

Didn't the men using your trailers
change pressure in their airbags
to suit the parameters applying at the time?