[Mongo228]

That's off the bumper; fair game.

I'm talking literally OFF THE TAILGATE.

Like this ...

Edit:

Klooge was used as a "hunting" rig ... story goes, there was a feeder or something hanging off the tailgate. That's what it did.

SMDH.

 

[John Strenk]

I am curious what was attached there...

This is the only thing I think should be added to the tailgate:

http://www.ewillys.com/?s=bed+extender

 

[Chowlie]

Today's progress: Started replacing the fuel lines and cranked it.

The sediment bulb was completely covered with grime, which I removed. Inside was a bit of crud, but no so much I'm too concerned. I do think getting the sediment bulb to seal will be a problem, though. Does it typically use a gasket or O ring? There's a lot of corrosion where it sits on the fuel pump. I bought several feet of 1/4" fuel line and a new fuel filter. The filter I removed was between the pump and the supply line to the carb and looked... very old, to say the least. lol

I tried manually turning the engine over with the fan, but had no luck there. The generator is kinda loose (and not even wired in) and the belt was very rotten and slack. So I just went ahead and cranked it with the starter, which it did happily. I put the plugs back in and cranked but didn't get a hint of fire. Holding the coil wire close to the body I didn't get any spark, so I ordered a new coil along with a set of wires. There is a hot wire going straight from the hot terminal of the battery to the + side of the coil due to the generator being disconnected.

I removed the distributor cap and everything looked surprisingly good inside, which I was thankful for. I think if I can figure out how the distributor is clocked I'll be in good shape to test fire it with some gas down the carb.

 

[jeepdaddy2000]

I put the plugs back in and cranked but didn't get a hint of fire. Holding the coil wire close to the body I didn't get any spark, so I ordered a new coil along with a set of wires. There is a hot wire going straight from the hot terminal of the battery to the + side of the coil due to the generator being disconnected.

I removed the distributor cap and everything looked surprisingly good inside, which I was thankful for. I think if I can figure out how the distributor is clocked I'll be in good shape to test fire it with some gas down the carb.

No spark? Lets troubleshoot.......
Use a test light.

Remove the ignition wire from the coil and turn the key on.
Do you have power at the wire? If not, then you have an issue between the battery and the coil.
If so, install the wire back on the coil and remove the wire from the dist side. Do you have power at the - coil post? if not, you have a coil issue.
If so, reinstall the dist wire and open the points. Do you have power at the point arm? If not, then you have an issue between the coil and the points.
If so, then file and regap the points. You should have spark every time you open the points with your finger. If not, check the points ground and the condenser.
The dist connects to the oil pump with a beveled drive. It will only go back one way. You will need to readjust the timing once you get it stuck.

 

[Chowlie]

No spark? Lets troubleshoot.......
Use a test light.

Remove the ignition wire from the coil and turn the key on.
Do you have power at the wire? If not, then you have an issue between the battery and the coil.
If so, install the wire back on the coil and remove the wire from the dist side. Do you have power at the - coil post? if not, you have a coil issue.
If so, reinstall the dist wire and open the points. Do you have power at the point arm? If not, then you have an issue between the coil and the points.
If so, then file and regap the points. You should have spark every time you open the points with your finger. If not, check the points ground and the condenser.
The dist connects to the oil pump with a beveled drive. It will only go back one way. You will need to readjust the timing once you get it stuck.

This is where I get to learn all about points and distributors. :wink2: Most of my auto experience is with mechanical diesels and fuel injected gassers.

I didn't check continuity of the wire between the + terminal of the battery and the + terminal of the coil. Like I said, the generator isn't even hooked up so it's been rigged to run off the battery only. When I hook up the new coil I'll crimp a ring terminal on the end of my wire to make sure I have good continuity to the battery. I know I can also check coil resistance to make sure it's not open, but I haven't gotten that far yet. I'm actually finishing up my degree as an industrial electrician at the moment, so I'm pretty excited to have a fun electrical project at home. lol

What sort of test device should I use here? One like this or this?

My game plan is to get the new coil hooked up and tested. Then I'll hook up the new plug wires and make sure I have spark on each. If I don't, I can guarantee I have a problem in the distributor which I can investigate at a later time.

Quick question - but is the coil grounded to the distributor in order to make sure the coil is only firing when needed for spark? The wire coming from the distributor looked a little frayed and it made me curious.

As for the distributor, the wire going to cylinder 1 (the rearmost cylinder, yes?) should always be in one position. Is that correct? Or can it be out by 180 degrees? I read how you could remove the spark plug in cylinder one and use your finger to determine when it's on the compression stroke, then pull the distributor cap and see where your wire needs to go. This is what I need to figure out first thing - I'll work on properly timing it once I can get it in my basement and work on it somewhere clean.

 

[bob4703]

Now would be a good time to replace the points with a Pertronix electronic ignition. It isn't expensive and easy to do.

 

[Fourtrail]

Ok, for the points/condenser, just order a new set rather than mess with what you have. There should be a tag on the distributor with the brand and model on it, you will need to make sure that you order the right set of points. Once you pull the cap and rotor, the plate that the points are mounted on removes after you take out the two screws that hold down the catch/latch for the cap. Once you have the screws out, the plate will lift out of the distributor. There are 2 screws in the points, one holds them in place, the other is a cammed head that adjusts the gap. Do not turn the one that is in the oval slot on the points (gap adjustment), just take loose the other screw and the lift the points off of the pivot pin. The new set of points should be close enough to drop back onto the plate and put the holding screw in and get the engine to fire up, you can fine tune the point gap later. the 'ground' wire from the coil connects to the points and spark occurs when the points open. make sure the you also replace the condenser, this absorbs the extra voltage when the points open and close to llimit the spark between the points as they open and close to extend the life of the point contact surface. if the condenser is bad, it can short directly to ground and the points will never charge the coil to get a spark.




pertronix is a good conversion, but I would hold off until you get the rest of the wiring straightened out and make sure that the motor runs.

 

[Fourtrail]

The distributor on the F-head has a flat drive and timing limited adjustment so as long as the oil pump gears are timed correctly to the cam you should be close on the timing. so #1 can really only be in 2 positions with that distributor. no being 'teeth off' when you put in the distributor.

 

[Chowlie]

Now would be a good time to replace the points with a Pertronix electronic ignition. It isn't expensive and easy to do.

I'll do some research on that. Looks like a good conversion.

Ok, for the points/condenser, just order a new set rather than mess with what you have. There should be a tag on the distributor with the brand and model on it, you will need to make sure that you order the right set of points. Once you pull the cap and rotor, the plate that the points are mounted on removes after you take out the two screws that hold down the catch/latch for the cap. Once you have the screws out, the plate will lift out of the distributor. There are 2 screws in the points, one holds them in place, the other is a cammed head that adjusts the gap. Do not turn the one that is in the oval slot on the points (gap adjustment), just take loose the other screw and the lift the points off of the pivot pin. The new set of points should be close enough to drop back onto the plate and put the holding screw in and get the engine to fire up, you can fine tune the point gap later. the 'ground' wire from the coil connects to the points and spark occurs when the points open. make sure the you also replace the condenser, this absorbs the extra voltage when the points open and close to llimit the spark between the points as they open and close to extend the life of the point contact surface. if the condenser is bad, it can short directly to ground and the points will never charge the coil to get a spark.

I really can't stress this enough, but everything inside the distributor looks brand new. Like it was replaced 25 years ago and run for maybe an hour before being parked. If I still don't see spark at the plugs after this I'll definitely be tearing into it.

The distributor on the F-head has a flat drive and timing limited adjustment so as long as the oil pump gears are timed correctly to the cam you should be close on the timing. so #1 can really only be in 2 positions with that distributor. no being 'teeth off' when you put in the distributor.

Ok, that's good to know. Do you know which position should be for cylinder 1? This little diagram isn't much but it might be accurate anyway. Looks like cylinder 1 is likely pointing toward the front of the engine.

 

[Mongo228]

Cylinder 1 should be the front cylinder. Firing order, if I'm not mistaken, should be 1-3-4-2. I'm seeing diagrams showing counter-clockwise rotation; might want to verify that. As to where the timing should be set for the 4-banger, I have no idea. The I6 is generally set 6-8* BTDC from the factory.

 

[Chowlie]

Just found this image.

 

[Fourtrail]

#1 on the one picture that you have of your distributor looks to be more about 4:30 or 5 o'clock. if the distributor has been out, #1 could either be there, or where #4 is (10:30-11 o'clock). As I said though, this is as long as the oil pump gears haven't been out and the distributor drive in the wrong place.

 

[Chowlie]

Thanks for that. At least I have somewhere to start. If I don't have any luck in that position I'll just rotate the wires 90 degrees until I find it.

 

[Fourtrail]

Thanks for that. At least I have somewhere to start. If I don't have any luck in that position I'll just rotate the wires 90 degrees until I find it.

This is the distributor drive, so unless someone has had the oil pump gears off, it can really only go in one way.

 

[Chowlie]

This is the distributor drive, so unless someone has had the oil pump gears off, it can really only go in one way.

Right, I just have no way of knowing whether it has or not. I'm just gonna assume it hasn't been and see how it goes, hopefully tomorrow.

 

[Chowlie]

Now would be a good time to replace the points with a Pertronix electronic ignition. It isn't expensive and easy to do.

This has really piqued my interest. Between the Pertronix and a complete solid state distributor which do the members here prefer? Seems to be the Pertronix, but I figured I'd ask.

EDIT: I'm also curious, does this system use a ballast resistor or no?

 

[John Strenk]

BTW, If you have the coil connected directly to the battery, you might have trouble shutting it off after it starts.
Someone may of done that just to try starting it some years ago.

I would have to check the schematic but it's likely you will also need a ballast resistor so you don't burn out your ignition coil.

and this would be more useful than the other one.

 

[Chowlie]

BTW, If you have the coil connected directly to the battery, you might have trouble shutting it off after it starts.
Someone may of done that just to try starting it some years ago.

I would have to check the schematic but it's likely you will also need a ballast resistor so you don't burn out your ignition coil.

and this would be more useful than the other one.

Pretty sure we just pulled the battery cable to shut it off, IIRC. But yes, the only function the key would serve in this setup would be for the accessories and starter solenoid.

I'm looking through the service manual PDF for the CJ-5 printed in 1965 and there is no mention of a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit, and no mention of it anywhere when I Ctrl+F the document. That is, unless it's supposed to be incorporated into the voltage regulator (which is also not hooked up, obviously). I do believe there is a ballast resistor on the back of the firewall, but I'll have to double-check how it's wired.

I may try to pick up a spare from the parts store just to use temporarily while I jury rig it.

 

[bob4703]

JEEPFELLER should be chiming in about now. He is the F head Guru. He is remiss.

 

[jeepdaddy2000]

We are getting waaaaaay off point.
The issue is there is no spark. Lets focus on that first.

Points are super simple. In retard language, with power flowing from the battery through the coil to the points, every time the points open, the coil fires.

There needs to be power to the + side of the coil. 12V (direct) or 9V (ballast) doesn't matter.
The points need to open and fully close when the dist shaft is rotated. Don't worry about dwell, just adjust the points to about .020. Doesn't have to be exact as long as they close fully.
The points need a clean facing surface to insure they ground when closed.
The points plate (dist) needs to be grounded.

With the system fully hooked up, you can literally crank the dist till the points close, put power to the coil, then open the points with your fingernail and get spark from the coil.

If you follow my previous post and trouble shoot the 12/9V power path from the ignition (or battery) to the points you will get spark.
Guaranteed.