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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey there - new to the group, hopefully going to be getting my dad's old Jeep running and driving again in the next few months. I know nothing about Jeeps, but am an otherwise experienced mechanic. These photos are from 2009 and are the only ones I could find handy. It's been sitting in our barn since then and needs quite a bit of maintenance. From what I remember the brakes are dead and it needs a new fuel supply. (It has had a boat tank hooked up in the past)

I'll probably be investigating it this weekend to see if it'll crank and whether it needs any wiring help. Fingers crossed it's not locked after all this time. Any tips or tricks about what I have here would be more than welcome!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yep, it's the 4 cylinder. Thanks for the tips!

And I'll get some updated photos soon - hopefully tonight.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Just took from fresh pictures. Definitely must more dusty now. I'm really having a hard time decoding the VIN as well. I get the "Open Body Universal CJ-5" part but not the last six digits. I can't find any table that corresponds with it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Oof, and I thought I had a project. Cool that it has family history though. I'm kinda hoping the kids take an interest in our Heep, and it becomes a family thing. Nobody else in my family is ridiculously sentimental about vehicles like I am. Hoping I pass that trait on. :laugh:

Looks like some small furry friends left some presents for you on top of the radiator cowl. That's to be expected I guess, after sitting for so long. Might be worth borescoping the manifolds/cylinders, see what's in there. Darn vermin. :(
Ha, yes - history indeed. My dad flipped this thing over sometime in the 70's and had a pretty close call from what I heard. lol I think the license plate was last renewed in 1988.

Clearly it's not a feasible full resto, at least not IMO. If I can get it running smooth and driving around the farm I'll be happy with it.

By the way, I did find another serial number table, and I think this may have been manufactured in 1965.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
8305 gives you the cj5 model, the last 6 is the sequential serial number. You can verify the year from that number from the link below. Serial number shows as 1965. And yes, the vin plate was attached to the firewall with regular screws in that year range.
Thanks for that - seems to confirm April of 1965.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
If you are an experienced mechanic you will find that this Jeep is the easiest thing you've ever worked on. Very little changed from 55 to 65. The fact that it belonged to your dad makes it even more special. You could have a show Jeep or a blue highways traveler. Have fun!
That's good to know! So far I'm mainly annoyed at all the dirt and rust, but hopefully the ease of maintenance will make up for it. Haha
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Anytime you can open the hood and look down and see the ground you know that you have a simple to work on Jeep. The dirt will wash off and the rusty body parts can be replaced or repaired. You can even replace the entire body with a new fiber glass one.

Please fill out your profile and give us a geographic location. One or more of us may live nearby and might know where you can find spare parts. Two weeks ago I went with another member to find parts and repairs for his son's 66.
Ok, I think I got the profile and garage thing straightened out. :wink2:

Made baby step progress today as I had several things to accomplish, but I did clean out the rear and poured a shot of ATF down each cylinder. I'll give it a few days and try to turn it over by hand before I try to start it. Still need to get gas to it somehow though.

And sadly we hauled off the remains of our 2004 Forester today after I spent the last two years parting it out. Someone ran a red light and T-boned my wife with our infant son in the car, but fortunately everyone was ok. I had only changed the timing belt about 2,000 miles prior, so we found another Forester with a bad engine and transplanted it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Today's progress: Started replacing the fuel lines and cranked it.

The sediment bulb was completely covered with grime, which I removed. Inside was a bit of crud, but no so much I'm too concerned. I do think getting the sediment bulb to seal will be a problem, though. Does it typically use a gasket or O ring? There's a lot of corrosion where it sits on the fuel pump. I bought several feet of 1/4" fuel line and a new fuel filter. The filter I removed was between the pump and the supply line to the carb and looked... very old, to say the least. lol

I tried manually turning the engine over with the fan, but had no luck there. The generator is kinda loose (and not even wired in) and the belt was very rotten and slack. So I just went ahead and cranked it with the starter, which it did happily. I put the plugs back in and cranked but didn't get a hint of fire. Holding the coil wire close to the body I didn't get any spark, so I ordered a new coil along with a set of wires. There is a hot wire going straight from the hot terminal of the battery to the + side of the coil due to the generator being disconnected.

I removed the distributor cap and everything looked surprisingly good inside, which I was thankful for. I think if I can figure out how the distributor is clocked I'll be in good shape to test fire it with some gas down the carb.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
No spark? Lets troubleshoot.......
Use a test light.

Remove the ignition wire from the coil and turn the key on.
Do you have power at the wire? If not, then you have an issue between the battery and the coil.
If so, install the wire back on the coil and remove the wire from the dist side. Do you have power at the - coil post? if not, you have a coil issue.
If so, reinstall the dist wire and open the points. Do you have power at the point arm? If not, then you have an issue between the coil and the points.
If so, then file and regap the points. You should have spark every time you open the points with your finger. If not, check the points ground and the condenser.
The dist connects to the oil pump with a beveled drive. It will only go back one way. You will need to readjust the timing once you get it stuck.
This is where I get to learn all about points and distributors. :wink2: Most of my auto experience is with mechanical diesels and fuel injected gassers.

I didn't check continuity of the wire between the + terminal of the battery and the + terminal of the coil. Like I said, the generator isn't even hooked up so it's been rigged to run off the battery only. When I hook up the new coil I'll crimp a ring terminal on the end of my wire to make sure I have good continuity to the battery. I know I can also check coil resistance to make sure it's not open, but I haven't gotten that far yet. I'm actually finishing up my degree as an industrial electrician at the moment, so I'm pretty excited to have a fun electrical project at home. lol

What sort of test device should I use here? One like this or this?

My game plan is to get the new coil hooked up and tested. Then I'll hook up the new plug wires and make sure I have spark on each. If I don't, I can guarantee I have a problem in the distributor which I can investigate at a later time.

Quick question - but is the coil grounded to the distributor in order to make sure the coil is only firing when needed for spark? The wire coming from the distributor looked a little frayed and it made me curious.

As for the distributor, the wire going to cylinder 1 (the rearmost cylinder, yes?) should always be in one position. Is that correct? Or can it be out by 180 degrees? I read how you could remove the spark plug in cylinder one and use your finger to determine when it's on the compression stroke, then pull the distributor cap and see where your wire needs to go. This is what I need to figure out first thing - I'll work on properly timing it once I can get it in my basement and work on it somewhere clean.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Now would be a good time to replace the points with a Pertronix electronic ignition. It isn't expensive and easy to do.
I'll do some research on that. Looks like a good conversion.

Ok, for the points/condenser, just order a new set rather than mess with what you have. There should be a tag on the distributor with the brand and model on it, you will need to make sure that you order the right set of points. Once you pull the cap and rotor, the plate that the points are mounted on removes after you take out the two screws that hold down the catch/latch for the cap. Once you have the screws out, the plate will lift out of the distributor. There are 2 screws in the points, one holds them in place, the other is a cammed head that adjusts the gap. Do not turn the one that is in the oval slot on the points (gap adjustment), just take loose the other screw and the lift the points off of the pivot pin. The new set of points should be close enough to drop back onto the plate and put the holding screw in and get the engine to fire up, you can fine tune the point gap later. the 'ground' wire from the coil connects to the points and spark occurs when the points open. make sure the you also replace the condenser, this absorbs the extra voltage when the points open and close to llimit the spark between the points as they open and close to extend the life of the point contact surface. if the condenser is bad, it can short directly to ground and the points will never charge the coil to get a spark.
I really can't stress this enough, but everything inside the distributor looks brand new. Like it was replaced 25 years ago and run for maybe an hour before being parked. If I still don't see spark at the plugs after this I'll definitely be tearing into it.

The distributor on the F-head has a flat drive and timing limited adjustment so as long as the oil pump gears are timed correctly to the cam you should be close on the timing. so #1 can really only be in 2 positions with that distributor. no being 'teeth off' when you put in the distributor.
Ok, that's good to know. Do you know which position should be for cylinder 1? This little diagram isn't much but it might be accurate anyway. Looks like cylinder 1 is likely pointing toward the front of the engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Thanks for that. At least I have somewhere to start. If I don't have any luck in that position I'll just rotate the wires 90 degrees until I find it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
This is the distributor drive, so unless someone has had the oil pump gears off, it can really only go in one way.
Right, I just have no way of knowing whether it has or not. I'm just gonna assume it hasn't been and see how it goes, hopefully tomorrow.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Now would be a good time to replace the points with a Pertronix electronic ignition. It isn't expensive and easy to do.
This has really piqued my interest. Between the Pertronix and a complete solid state distributor which do the members here prefer? Seems to be the Pertronix, but I figured I'd ask.

EDIT: I'm also curious, does this system use a ballast resistor or no?
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
BTW, If you have the coil connected directly to the battery, you might have trouble shutting it off after it starts.
Someone may of done that just to try starting it some years ago.

I would have to check the schematic but it's likely you will also need a ballast resistor so you don't burn out your ignition coil.

and this would be more useful than the other one.
Pretty sure we just pulled the battery cable to shut it off, IIRC. But yes, the only function the key would serve in this setup would be for the accessories and starter solenoid.

I'm looking through the service manual PDF for the CJ-5 printed in 1965 and there is no mention of a ballast resistor in the ignition circuit, and no mention of it anywhere when I Ctrl+F the document. That is, unless it's supposed to be incorporated into the voltage regulator (which is also not hooked up, obviously). I do believe there is a ballast resistor on the back of the firewall, but I'll have to double-check how it's wired.

I may try to pick up a spare from the parts store just to use temporarily while I jury rig it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #44 ·
If you have a trouble light, you could hook the light up to the wire to the points (-) on the ignition coil. When the light is on, the points are open, when the light is off, the points are closed.

Looks like the ballast resistor was only used on the V6 and not on the I4

Do you know if you have a 12 volt or 6 volt system?
Yes, it's a 12 volt system. It did have a ballast resistor on the firewall, so I hooked it back up and got fire. More on that below...

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Discussion Starter · #45 ·
SO.... Lots of good news and progress today. Firstly, thanks to everyone who chimed in with the wealth of info. Fortunately I didn't have to utilize all of it, but I did get it running and driving!

This morning I went out and installed the new coil and plug wires. Using my spark tester I noted that there was no spark on any cylinders. I remembered what was previously mentioned about the points opening to fire the coil, so I removed the distributor cap and plate to investigate. I don't know this system well enough to use the right nomenclature, but I cleaned the contacts where the spring point contacts the ground wire and that seemed to fix it. After that I put it all back together with the plug wires in factory position and got it to fire up with gas poured down the carb.

Then I had to address the gas supply. I cut a new cork gasket for the fuel bulb and attached the fuel filter to the pump. I ran my 1/4 line to the pump and attached the other end to my boat tank connector. I stuck my head in the engine bay and sucked on the fuel filter just long enough to prime it and got fuel running through the bowl. After that it was easy peasy to get it running on it's own with a little attention to the choke and throttle.

Suffice it to say, I'm very impressed with how easily it all came together.

My dad came home and got to drive it around for the first time in 20 years, with me in the passenger seat and my three-year-old in my lap. It was a fun day for everyone.

Lastly, we pulled it in my basement to continue working on it. There are tons of things left to address, such as brakes, leaf springs, cleaning, new wiring, and fluids. Once I'm not on my phone I'll fill in some details I learned about this vehicle's history.

Oh yeah, and is there any way to retrofit a newer style of alternator on this thing?


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Discussion Starter · #52 ·
Made lots more progress today - I pulled the carpet to clean it all and started the rewire. Dad removed the master cylinder and son did some vacuuming.

I removed everything that either needed work or didn't work at all. The oil bath filter canister needs to be cleaned out before it's used, and I need to source an intake elbow for it. I removed all of the factory blower and HVAC components, which are probably never going back in. I replaced the ignition switch that we lost the key for with a new one. I removed all the frayed and superfluous wiring and put everything back together with heat shrink, proper connectors, and fuses.

Oh yeah, and we're probably gonna need to find new rear leaf springs too. A few of them are cracked or missing, and the rear axle is barely hanging on. Any suggestions on replacements?

Also planning to service the axles, t-case and transmission if anyone has opinions on fluids. Automotive tire Vehicle Tire Ingredient Recipe
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Discussion Starter · #55 ·
You have a lot of irons in the fire with this Jeep.

I suggest you start a build sheet that maps out:
Specific areas you want to work on.
What you want to do in those areas
And what you have done. This will keep you from missing, forgetting, or failing to finish each section.

I like to break down by components.
Example
Steereing:
Lube/adjust box
Repair loose draglink/bellcrank
Inspect tie rod ends
toe in

Front axle:
Change fluid
Bearing pack
Inspect king pin bearings
Replace knuckle wiper seals/refill knuckles
Clean breather

brakes
Engine
Transmission
T case
Clutch
Rear axle
Springs
Fuel system
etc....

It also gives you a sense of accomplishment as you tick off each task.
Well this is the current work list. Font Screenshot Communication Device Software Multimedia


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Discussion Starter · #57 ·
I certainly didn't do it this way myself, but I would suggest moving the fluid changes up the list. Imagine putting all new brakes on it, then having to take them off to tear down an axle that you later discovered was in need of a rebuild.

Don't get me wrong... I just wanna drive mine, and I did refill my transfer case for now , but I know i need to pull it's pan and look inside now. There was a lot of metal on the plug, and in the oil. The milkshake that was the oil in my rear diff, now I know I need to keep an eye on that. Engine oil, I changed that before I even started it.
Eh, I don't have them listed by priority. Haha but yes, all fluids and filters are gonna be done before we pull it out again!

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