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I believe the dealer gets reimbursed from Chrysler for warranty work and the dealer wouldn't get paid if the work wasn't approved by Chrysler.
Hydrolocked my engine with dealer plates still on...
So here's my story. I was out playing around in puddles...really nothing big at all. On my way out I made one final run, a little water splashed on the hook and the engine died. I still have the dealer plates on her and they towed me, after my friends got me out of the water, to the dealership. I've read some of the threads and seen some people say that it was covered by Jeep for the repairs. I have a video of my final death run and it shows I was not exceeding the limits of "the most capable offroad vehicle". She's a stock JK Rubi and can climb anything I point her at...water seems to be an issue. I would love to hear any thoughts on this, what it could be, best wat to prevent it (what is the best snorkel?) and if anyone has had this happen and had it covered by warranty I'd really love to hear from you so I can have a little ammo when I go in to fight them.
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That is exactly the case. Open the hood of the JK. Look just in front of the air box inlet. There is a gap between the fender and the grill. There is also a gap in the fender liner there. Anything going up into the front of the fender will end up being deflected by the hood directly into the airbox. In the OP's video, the hard splash entering the puddle could have easily given the airbox a good drink of muddy water. Snorkel has now moved up the upgrade list.
EDIT: After looking at the video again, it looks like water is being channeled up through the front of the fender the entire time OP is in the water. I quick fix would be to add a piece of rubber mat as a baffle to the opening between the grill and fender. That's the opening that would be getting the water in.
That is false..................
If a dealership does a repair under warranty they have to submit a claim to Chrysler to get paid back,they also must keep the part(s) for something like 90 days as Chrysler sometimes will call for that failed part to inspect.Also the regional reps like to grap the warranty claim paperwork and go through the dealers warranty parts storage room often when they show up unexpected.On something major like a engine a regional rep will be involved and they are very strict and do not work for any dealership but for Chrysler and if they say no then it's no go on the warranty.So basically if the dealership has any doubt that the claim will be denied they either get a regional rep involved or deny it if it is a high dollar repair like a engine,if it's a $20 part they will just replace it and not worry.
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I get the feeling that the OP didn't look for or didn't know what to look for as far as signs of water ingestion. I could be wrong, but I suspect this to be the situation. I'm like you, I would love to have been able to take a look see under the hood of this Jeek. It sucks that it happened, but hopefully, this will all lead to helping other Jeepers prevent damaging their engine.
Not to be argumentative but it's absolutely 100% true. I'm not arguing the semantics, I'm stating a fact.
It's all in the way the service manager decides to (or doesn't) write up the failure. I have personally had service managers tell me point blank that they will warrant items that did not fail under warranty. That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer. The service manager is awesome. So far that has brought me back for three vehicles. Treating your customers well pays big dividends.
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It has been years since I worked in a Dealership, but back in the day, when there was a large item such as an engine, transmission, axle, etc., the Dealership had to secure pre-authorization which meant that the District Manager would come to the Dealership and inspect the damage before giving the authorization for warranty to cover item. I can't imagine in these times that a automobile manufacturer would not review such claims with a very large magnifying glass.
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VW is one of the most successful car manufacturers on the planet--Chrysler isn't. It's been having bankruptcy problems for at least a generation with many owners--Fiat/tax-payer, Cerberus, Mercedes, and a tax-payer bailout years before they became popular.
Given that, they can't afford to be as generous with warranty claims. I wish I even had a Jeep dealer near me. There's not one within sixty miles of me now. The two I've bought Jeeps from over the years have both shut down. I'm glad mine haven't had any issues and I'm taking it slow through the puddles this winter.
If small items they will,large items they will not.A good service manager will spend shop money to fix small items on there dime to keep repeat customers happy and coming back.In the long run they will make more money off of you then you think.
But.....................
Any service manager would look twice if a vehicle that was just sold at his/her dealership less then 30 days ago come back with a hydrolocked engine.
That is very different then giving a customer a free $50 part,a $5000+ engine is not a give away for free item and is not a good way to run a shop.
Okay, I'll give you that one.
I had my turbo replaced (3500$) and it was my wife's fault, she drove into a curb. The SM covered us..... There were numerous other times that weren't that major...
I never really considered Chryslers current position, that will probably play a huge role in what they're allowed to do, or maybe the point that they begin to question claims....
Maybe it's not right, or economically correct for the corp...but it brought us back twice...
And you got to think that Fiat is controlling it now and they are very strict on warranty claims.
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I'm a master tech, and also worked as a warranty adjuster for Ford for 6 years (the guys the came in and inspected the parts...).
Think about these few facts.
1. Under warranty almost all engine replacements are to be reman engines from the mfg's reman distributer.
2. All engines replaced under warranty are sent back the remanufacturer to be remaned.
3. Guy has a brand new Jeep with a blown engine that is getting submitted through Chrysler for a warranty replacement. You can bet your *** that dealership is getting pre-approval for this replacement so they get paid for it.
4. Jeep see's a brand new Jeep with a known reliable engine (20 year old design) blow.
How many red flags do you see here. No matter how that dealer writes this they are going to get found out. All engines get sent back under all warranty repairs. Engines, trans, Diff's ect... are not like other things that sit in the hold and never get called for, these items are 100% called for either because they are large items, or rebuildable. The remanufacturers will take all of these items apart and must fill out a form describing what the cause of failure was so everyone will find out what happened. Yes you can tell how an engine failed even if it was hydrolock.
So a dealership has near a 100% chance at getting caught falsifying information on this one and getting caught. Which if they do not charge the customer for this repair they will end up having to eat several thousand dollars worth of repair work. PLUS a good chance of going through an audit because they lied to the mfg. This means a mfg rep standing over every technician and parts guys shoulders every day until they are satisfied nothing fishy is going on and going through months of back warranty claims trying to find out how many other false claims have been filed. On top of that if technicians are found with parts in there tool box (and every tech has a surplus of parts in there tool box new in box every single tech in this world at a dealership) the audit will conclude they were claiming parts were replaced under warranty and kept the parts which could lead to the techs loosing there jobs or worse criminal charges.
So chew on that then think what the dealership would do in this situation....
Kind of makes you wonder why there's so much leeway on modified vehicles and warranty repairs...
I see your point and understand why the dealer does what they do and with this engine, I can definitely see them getting busted when you lay it out the way you did.
I would really like to hear more info on the vehicle in question....
I see your point and understand why the dealer does what they do and with this engine, I can definitely see them getting busted when you lay it out the way you did.
I would really like to hear more info on the vehicle in question....
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The leeway on modified vehicles is much much harder to get busted on. First off the dealership would not warranty a non factory part so they are not going to be replacing extended sway bar links that are worn, or after market control arms ect.... They may repair some broken axles, worn bearings, anything else that is not modded as long as the failure "could appear to be a defect in materials or worksmanship of the factory part". The mfg has no way to know what vehicles are modified because they are not on the ground 100% of the time, if the dealership decided to omit this info the mfg will never know.
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That's crazy. Some of you have probably seen this, but here's my pre-snorkel water run my buddy caught on his camera:
YouTube - Don't Fear the Jeeper!
YouTube - Don't Fear the Jeeper!
Out of curiosity did you have any water or mud in your air-box after that one?
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Good question... We need some up-to-date information
Here we go...so as far as updates go, I called the dealership (as I do every day to bug the hell out of him) to see when it will be repaired. They said the tore it down on Monday, started replacing parts on Tuesday and I'll get an update as to when it will be ready this afternoon.
The video of the jeep going through the pond a few posts back just gets to me...how can my splash equal a dead engine when his is fine? I don't know how that worked but I don't hold any ill feelings, I think it's cool as hell. Yeah, a Jeep isn't a boat but finding out just what it's capable of is so fun.
I've have spent a lot of time trying to find a better engine for it recently, I thought about going the Hemi route but with an install of the engine and new trans I was looking at about 17k...insurance is going to cover about 9k (roughly) so I let that idea pass. While I was talking with Matt at West Texas Off-road (highly recommended for the area BTW) he jumped on the phone to get information on how easily the Hemi install could be done. He called a friend over in California and they'd replaced 5 JK engines in the past month, 2 with Hemi's, all because of the same exact issue.
When the dealer found her they told me she had leather, when she was delivered she had no leather so the dealer may keep her a little bit longer while I drive their truck around the city to put the leather in. I also have headrest dvd players to install and a push button ignition from Stardrive so it may be a week even after I get her back before she hits the streets...and yes...the mud.
I will claim stupidity and ignorance in checking the air intake box for moisture. After seeing videos like the one mentioned above it was the last thing on my mind, it shouldn't be a problem right? Obviously not.
The video of the jeep going through the pond a few posts back just gets to me...how can my splash equal a dead engine when his is fine? I don't know how that worked but I don't hold any ill feelings, I think it's cool as hell. Yeah, a Jeep isn't a boat but finding out just what it's capable of is so fun.
I've have spent a lot of time trying to find a better engine for it recently, I thought about going the Hemi route but with an install of the engine and new trans I was looking at about 17k...insurance is going to cover about 9k (roughly) so I let that idea pass. While I was talking with Matt at West Texas Off-road (highly recommended for the area BTW) he jumped on the phone to get information on how easily the Hemi install could be done. He called a friend over in California and they'd replaced 5 JK engines in the past month, 2 with Hemi's, all because of the same exact issue.
When the dealer found her they told me she had leather, when she was delivered she had no leather so the dealer may keep her a little bit longer while I drive their truck around the city to put the leather in. I also have headrest dvd players to install and a push button ignition from Stardrive so it may be a week even after I get her back before she hits the streets...and yes...the mud.
I will claim stupidity and ignorance in checking the air intake box for moisture. After seeing videos like the one mentioned above it was the last thing on my mind, it shouldn't be a problem right? Obviously not.
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Your update confirms that there was internal damage to your engine and that we can assume it was from water indigestion.
I have been reading a lot about the Hydrolock situation as it relates to the JK's and it seems that some people have done some wild water crossing and never had an issue while others have done minor stuff and had major ill effects. I have heard people say that if you drive thru water just right with a JK, the edge? of the uderside of hood will act as a funnel and direct water into the airbox. I have no idea how much truth there is to any of this, but after reading this post and seeing your video, if I was a JK owner, a snorkel would be on my Jeep before I got with in a 1,000 foot of water. BTW, a Hemi isn't going to like water any better than your OEM engine so changing engines isn't going to prevent future problems unless you also change the style and location of the airbox.
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