P2100 code - Electronic Throttle Control and ESP Lights - Page 3 - JeepForum.com
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post #31 of 57 Old 04-21-2015, 05:14 AM
bulletprf
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I have a 2008 Jeep Compass with 110,000 miles on it and I've had the issue with the ESC light and the ETC light coming on at the same time now 5 times. Originally the problem was fixed with a simple stop, shut down and restart a minute later, however this time is not the case. My max speed while driving was 40mph and if it went under 20mph it would sputter like it was going to stall.

Thanks to this forum I might get a diagnosis sooner rather than later.

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post #32 of 57 Old 06-26-2015, 08:08 PM
proto57
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I realize that many different things might be the cause of this, and I think I've also read all of the suggestions: The wiring under the driver's side rocker, and under the left fender; low voltage; the wheel ABS sensors; the connections to the throttle body; and last, possibly, the throttle body itself.

I did something today that might have fixed it. Of course I need to drive it for a few days at least, to know. But after about four days I'll be certain, because this has been happening so frequently... at least every other day, and sometimes, twice a day. Today it was the worst, and I had to drive home with the revs limited... and only able to go about 10 to 20 MPH for about 8 miles. So I had to do something when I got home, to see if I could finally solve it.

I used the suggestions of the wiring, taking off the rocker. Lots of sand made into the harness, and some of the electrical tape was worn through. But I could not find any chaffed wires. So I decided to clean the throttle body connection, and check and clean the body itself. I took off the air intake tube... two clamps... and could not get the wire attached to the bottom of it off (it is in a hard place), so I just clipped the holder... I could have tie wrapped it back on, but it does not look to be in a critical spot.

Anyway, when I got to the throttle body, I pushed open the throttle plate with my finger. It seemed a bit stuck. I worked it a few times, and usually it would just open... and I could hear the gears and I assume the motor turning in there... and they felt and sounded nice and smooth. I did not, I mean, think I had stripped gears in there or anything. But around the rim of the venturi, where the throttle plate touches seats on it, was a thick coating of hard carbon. I used a spray carb cleaner from Walmart... the $2 kind... and sprayed it in there. The carbon dissloved well. So I held the throttle plate open with the handle of a tool, and used a pile of q-tips, which I would spray the carb cleaner on, to rub off the deposits.

It was surprisingly thick. It took two dozen q-tips to properly clean off the parts I could see, and the upper part which was out of view. But when the q-tips were relatively clean, I figured I was done. I made sure to run some soaked q-tips along the edge of the throttle plate, too, until it was clean. When I checked the action of the plate with my finger, it no longer stuck. I took the Jeep for a test ride, and there was no sign of the problem. This is a good sign, because once the lights came on today, they would not go off.

But there is more: I had been noticing a lack of response the past couple of weeks, even when the lights were not on. That is, the engine would seem to stumble a bit, and not respond properly. I had read the suggestions on the web, and figured the gears in the throttle body were going... but now I think the carbon was causing sticking of the plate from time to time, and I would guess the computer does not like that... maybe it can read throttle body response hesitation? Or maybe a higher current draw if the body motor has to work harder against a stuck plate? Whatever... I cross my fingers and hope this was it. Meanwhile, since I have 133k on my Patriot, I will certainly buy a spare throttle body when I find a good deal, and keep it in the spare tire compartment. I don't want to get caught limping home cross country, or having to pay a dealer $650 for a $100, twenty minute roadside job.

I'll write if this was it, or if it was not, in a week or so.
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post #33 of 57 Old 07-03-2015, 06:47 AM
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Well bad news: Cleaning the carbon deposits from the throttle bore and plate did not fix the problem (see my previous post). I think it did help free the plate, which allowed the throttle body to work a few more days... but then yesterday I had a total failure, so I took out the throttle body and opened it up. This is what I found inside:

http://santa-coloma.net/jeep_throttle_body_gears.jpg

So it is clear what has been happening: The gears have been wearing, causing the throttle action to stick and/or be jerky, or possibly even skip a couple of teeth from time to time. This then is sensed by the computer, which generates the error messages. And then when shutting off the Jeep, the throttle closes of course, and it might happen to engage properly for awhile. And cleaning the carbon probably helps, because the gears don't have to work as hard to release the stuck plate. I would even go as far as to guess that a build up of sticky carbon is one cause of bad wear to begin with, because of the extra effort needed for the motor and gears to unstick it each time... but who knows? BTW, this was very nicely greased, and the grease looked clean. That is, it was not dry, and no water or grit got into this assembly.

I think then for people who have written that they have the problem, then it goes away, then comes back, then gets worse... they probably have wearing gears. I would say that in the future, should I get the error message, the first thing I am doing is going home and opening the unit up and checking it. And I would say as a precaution I would just replace this unit at 100K, or at least have a new one on the shelf. And that being said, I'm amazed that no company is casting a set of these gears... there are probably hundreds of thousands of these units on the road, and all are going to fail. If someone offered a new set of gears for say, $40, they do very well. The motor, shaft, motor bearings, electronics are all really nice in here.

One last thing: The cover of the unit comes off quite easily by using a pliers to gently work the "lip" back, going around the edge. If I could rebuild this, it would be an easy matter to tap the lip back in place, and make a nice seal. There is a gasket below the lip which would assure this.
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post #34 of 57 Old 07-04-2015, 04:25 AM
Sdsjeep2008
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Thanks for the update. Where do you purchase the throttle body for $100.00?
I might get one to keep on hand.

I have a 2008 Compass that I bought with 62,000 miles on it last December. Within a few thousand miles, I had the lights come on while my jeep was idling. The lightning bolt was flashing though. I shut off the jeep then turned it back on and it ran fine. I read about some of the cures on here and bought a new battery hoping that would cure the problem. I've used my trip meter B to keep track of the mileage since I replaced the battery and I've gone 7,000 miles so far without it happening again, but maybe I've just been lucky so far and I certainly don't want to pay $600 to have it replaced at a dealership.
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post #35 of 57 Old 07-04-2015, 07:30 AM
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SDSjeep2008:

Quote:
Thanks for the update. Where do you purchase the throttle body for $100.00?
I might get one to keep on hand.
I apologize... when I wrote that, I was seeing them from as low as $83... but they are used at those prices! I would never put a used on in, in this case, because we don't know the condition of the gears. Not worth it. But when I searched for a brand new, Mopar one, on Amazon, there are several starting at $170, with free shipping. So that is not too bad I think. I ordered one from a local dealership, and will pick it up on Monday morning... they were closed for the July 4th weekend, but I paid for it to make sure I had one.

I called a couple of dealerships directly, that were open, and they quoted me $270. None of them sold on Amazon, nor online. Two of them told me that the ones sold by their competeters online were fakes... not MOPAR. I told them to look it up, but they insisted. So someone is lying... but I somehow doubt the I bought online will turn out to be anything but MOPAR OEM (well the company that makes these, that Chrysler uses on the assembly line), since the ad was so insistent. But we will see...

Quote:
I have a 2008 Compass that I bought with 62,000 miles on it last December. Within a few thousand miles, I had the lights come on while my jeep was idling. The lightning bolt was flashing though. I shut off the jeep then turned it back on and it ran fine. I read about some of the cures on here and bought a new battery hoping that would cure the problem. I've used my trip meter B to keep track of the mileage since I replaced the battery and I've gone 7,000 miles so far without it happening again, but maybe I've just been lucky so far and I certainly don't want to pay $600 to have it replaced at a dealership.
I'm obviously a newbie to this problem, and don't even have my Patriot running yet! But from my experience, and what I have read so far, I would worry that your gears are stripping, and you might get stuck somewhere, if you don't replace your throttle body first. But maybe you have that wiring problem others have found: There are four pink wires in the bundle of wires under your left side kickplate (careful removing it, don't break it). These wires are "looped" into a "U" in the bundle, and have extra splicing tape around a wire splice. My splice was shiny and new, but some people have had this corroded, and either broken or partly broken.

And still another person said the problem can be one of the ABS sensors at one of the wheels, and which one, an ABS code reader can find. I didn't go down this road, as my OBII reader does not read ABS, so I thought I would pop off the throttle body first. But I point it out, because the throttle body is not cheap, even at $170...

Best of luck. Let us know how it goes.
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post #36 of 57 Old 07-24-2015, 06:32 PM
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Have you had any luck with the throttle body proto57?
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post #37 of 57 Old 07-27-2015, 06:53 PM
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Same issue. I bought a new ETC and pulled the old one. I was pretty upset to find out the bracket holding it on wasn't bolted onto the motor. Obviously, there had been issues already from a previous owner, and they left a bolt off. Arrrrggg… The one I took out wasn't very dirty inside, however, it was much more loose than the new one. It also barely stuck once every 10 or so times that I opened it with my fingers. This explained the sometimes random slow start response and rough shifting, especially into second. After the swap, I turned it on, it ran a bit smoother, but was still rough. The ETC light only came on once after I started it, then didn't again. This was encouraging, but it still idled slightly rough and after about 20 sec's went into limp mode and the ESP light came on. I took another person's advice however, to replace the PCV valve. It's right on top, super easy to take off. It seemed ok, but since a new one was only $10 I picked one up. I was surprised how much different the movements inside the 2 were. The new one had much more movement on the ball/spring. Replaced that, and it ran even better with way better response, but still after so long, limp mode and ESP light again. I forgot to mention, I also pulled the driver side wheel well before any of this to check the wire harnesses, and connections. It all looked good, and I air-hosed it all off just to make sure. My buddy told me to Re-Learn the ECU, so that the new ETC could sync back up with the old pedal sensor, and if they didn't sync after a Re-Learn, it might be the sensor has gone bad and is ruining ETC after ETC with mixed signals that are tearing up the plastic gears… This site has a great forum on Re-Learn without having to kill your battery for an hr. I am about to go out and try it to see if it works. I'll report back...
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post #38 of 57 Old 07-27-2015, 06:57 PM
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Sorry, it's another jeep forum that has the Re-Learn steps. Just google Re Learn ECU jeep patriot...
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post #39 of 57 Old 07-27-2015, 08:48 PM
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Ok… Well, I Reset the ECU. I tried both ways to make sure I was doing it correctly. It definitely started smoother as if it didn't realize there was a problem, but it didn't take long for the idle to become rough and go through the same motions again… ESP light and limp mode. I tried driving it around the block to see if it would sync whatever is out of whack, but no dice. I'm stumped. I'm going to sleep on it and try something else tomorrow. Might have to drive it slowly to the shop and let them hook it up to the computer, but at least now I can drive it there. Before it was too rough. I have a transaxle leak. I'm curious if anyone would know if low fluid level would trigger the ESP and put it into limp mode??
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post #40 of 57 Old 07-28-2015, 03:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joooblooo View Post
Ok… Well, I Reset the ECU. I tried both ways to make sure I was doing it correctly. It definitely started smoother as if it didn't realize there was a problem, but it didn't take long for the idle to become rough and go through the same motions again… ESP light and limp mode. I tried driving it around the block to see if it would sync whatever is out of whack, but no dice. I'm stumped. I'm going to sleep on it and try something else tomorrow. Might have to drive it slowly to the shop and let them hook it up to the computer, but at least now I can drive it there. Before it was too rough. I have a transaxle leak. I'm curious if anyone would know if low fluid level would trigger the ESP and put it into limp mode??

How old is your battery? My problem seem to have been solved by replacing the battery (I read that low voltage could trigger this problem). I've put 8500 miles on since I replaced the battery and haven't had the problem since.

Although, I will note that my issue only happened that one time and after I shut off the vehicle and turned it back on, it was OK and I replaced the battery the next day.
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post #41 of 57 Old 07-28-2015, 11:11 AM
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I was curious about that. Whoever put it in didn't scratch the date off, so I have no idea. I bought my jeep 9 months ago, so it's at least that old. It's an o'reilly battery so the sticker covers the wells. If I peel it back to check it will void any warranty, but seeing as I don't have a purchase history I might anyway. I was wondering if I simply hooked it up to my wife's van with cables and started it, if it was the battery should it start up and idle fine? I'm going to check my transaxle fluid today also, just considering I know it has a slow leak, and I know low pressure can send it into limp mode. Just don't know if the ESP light would come on. Seems like it would be a different indicator light if it was fluid pressure. Thanks for the idea…!! I'll let you know what I find out.
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post #42 of 57 Old 07-28-2015, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joooblooo View Post
I was curious about that. Whoever put it in didn't scratch the date off, so I have no idea. I bought my jeep 9 months ago, so it's at least that old. It's an o'reilly battery so the sticker covers the wells. If I peel it back to check it will void any warranty, but seeing as I don't have a purchase history I might anyway. I was wondering if I simply hooked it up to my wife's van with cables and started it, if it was the battery should it start up and idle fine? I'm going to check my transaxle fluid today also, just considering I know it has a slow leak, and I know low pressure can send it into limp mode. Just don't know if the ESP light would come on. Seems like it would be a different indicator light if it was fluid pressure. Thanks for the idea…!! I'll let you know what I find out.
Not sure if just hooking your wife's battery would indicate the battery is the problem but I would just replace the battery anyway, it's worth a try. My battery didn't look bad and I didn't know how old it was either. Also, my jeep started fine and didn't exhibit any power issues but as I read, it only takes a minute drop in voltage to set it off.
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post #43 of 57 Old 07-28-2015, 01:07 PM
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Well, I tried running another battery jumped to mine first with no difference, so I peeled the label off and the water level was ridiculously low. It took over 20 oz to fill it to the very bottom of the level indicators. I started it and straight to limp mode again, so I took it around the block to let all the capacitors in the different systems charge up (just in case) then let it set for a bit. Here's where it gets interesting… I keep thinking that the low transaxle fluid is setting off the ESP sensor. I brainstormed and because it's a transaxle not a transmission, even in neutral it's interacting with the motor. So instead of starting it and releasing the clutch (which I normally do naturally), I started it and held the clutch in keeping the transaxle and the motor disengaged. It idled perfectly fine. At this point I was like… did the battery finally clear the sensors or is the clutch doing it?? I let out the clutch slowly, and it started rattling and idling rough, so before it went into limp mode I pressed it back down. I sat with the clutch engaged hoping that the fluid would heat up and expand enough to raise the pressure past the sensor limit. After 30 sec's I let it out and it was fine… Drove it around the neighborhood with no problems… NOW, I'm curious if it was the battery, which was obviously ridiculously low, or the transaxle fluid level, or both. Maybe the low voltage changes the range, or the efficiency of the sensors. I noticed the day this all started, my tire pressure light was on, and I only had one tire that was at 38 psi, the others were at 42 (shouldn't have been on)… I'm going to let it completely cool back down in my garage, start it up and immediately let the clutch out to see if anything acts weird. That should tell me if my pressure being low at a cold start is part of the problem. Otherwise it was obviously the battery. THANKS!!!! The one good thing to come from all of this is I didn't realize when you reset your ECU, it goes to factory settings and not only re-learns your new parts and clears all the bad codes, it re-maps your driving habits for the first 50 drives. It started so much better, and when I took it around the block, it shifts a lot smoother. I highly recommend doing this periodically. I'm going to Colorado in 2 weeks, so I can reset it when I get there to accommodate for mountain driving, then when I get on the road home reset it again. Thanks again SDSjeep2008!! It's great to have my jeep back! (I'll post whether it cold starts rough or not)
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post #44 of 57 Old 07-28-2015, 02:55 PM
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Let it cool completely down and cold started it. No problems… You were right!!! I can't believe that a chrysler would let a battery drop in voltage throw it into limp mode. I've noticed rough starts lately and am frightened to think that my jeep has been on the threshold of limp mode slowly as my battery lost water. The back and forth, rough shifts, rough starts, and sensor flips are what obviously is causing the throttle body to wear out prematurely. No telling what else has been wearing out. Since I know it's been messed with before (missing bolt) leads me to believe that the previous owner probably was going through the same problems and decided to ditch it. What would happen if you were out in the desert 4x4ing and this happened? It wouldn't climb a tiny hill in limp mode, and chrysler would rather strand someone out in the desert, than run their precious vehicle with a semi-low battery… Ridiculous… I wonder what the specifications for the battery light are. Why it wouldn't go off at a certain level prior to the voltage drop causing all of this. To at least let the driver know to simply check the battery?? Going from 80 to 20 on a busy interstate seems way more dangerous than having a low battery. Bad call Chrysler… Well, Thanks again, wish I could return the favor.

Last edited by joooblooo; 07-28-2015 at 03:26 PM.
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post #45 of 57 Old 07-29-2015, 03:33 AM
Sdsjeep2008
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No problem! Glad to help! I found the solution from this forum and glad to pass it on. I can't believe that a battery that appeared to be functioning properly could cause so big of a problem either.
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