Diagnosing Death Wobble and Fixing Non-DW Shimmies and Wobbles - Page 23 - JeepForum.com
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post #331 of 360 Old 12-27-2014, 05:23 PM
tweezybird
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Thanks again everyone, looks like any repairs are on hold. Just found huge amounts of water damage in my crawlspace so the house has to come first.

I'll be back when I get started, in the mean time thanks again.

Terri

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post #332 of 360 Old 12-29-2014, 02:13 PM
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WOW just found this thread. Hard to believe from the factory this is an issue.
Very sad to think all that money I spend on a new Jeep and now I may have to consider swapping out some of the factory bolts for grade 8 ones of a different size.

Why don't they do this right from the factory?

Sorry if this was asked I have not had time to read all 20 something pages. I will before I attempt this procedure.

Is it better to just to buy a kit from someone or source the grade 8 locally? I see them from 44$ to 80$ + shipping for the kits.

Not sure if they are complete to address this problem. I need to do some more reading for sure. I don't want to ruin my 1600 mile JKU or have it get ruined in short time with the Wife and me driving in it.

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post #333 of 360 Old 12-29-2014, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jeepwrnglr92
WOW just found this threat. Hard to believe from the factory this is an issue. Very sad to think all that money I spend on a new Jeep and now I may have to consider swapping out some of the factory bolts for grade 8 ones of a different size. Why don't they do this right from the factory? Sorry if this was asked I have not had time to read all 20 something pages. I will before I attempt this procedure. Is it better to just to buy a kit from someone or source the grade 8 locally? I see them from 44$ to 80$ + shipping for the kits. Not sure if they are complete to address this problem. I need to do some more reading for sure. I don't want to ruin my 1600 mile JKU or have it get ruined in short time with the Wife and me driving in it.
If you keep your stock trackbar bolts maintained and periodically retorque them to 125 ft lbs at every oil change interval, you shouldn't have a problem.

The smaller stock bolts only present a problem if they have not been properly maintained and damage has occurred as a result.

If you want to do a swap, it does give good piece of mind, and the fine thread grade 8 boots will hold torque better and better center the bushing bolt sleeve in the bracket. Just buy the Northridge4x4 kit when you know your total order will be enough to qualify for free shipping.


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post #334 of 360 Old 12-30-2014, 06:25 AM
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Silly question but is there any place in the owners manual that says you need to re-torque the factory bolts ever oil change?

I just cannot imagine most owners doing/remembering to do this. Not to mention any dealer will to do this at ever service.

I don't think I have ever had to do such a thing on any of my Chevy's and I have over 140K on the clock on them or more in the past.

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post #335 of 360 Old 12-30-2014, 11:21 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jeepwrnglr92
Silly question but is there any place in the owners manual that says you need to re-torque the factory bolts ever oil change? I just cannot imagine most owners doing/remembering to do this. Not to mention any dealer will to do this at ever service. I don't think I have ever had to do such a thing on any of my Chevy's and I have over 140K on the clock on them or more in the past.
Few owners read their owners manuals.

My 2012 Ram 3500 diesel owners manual suggests at least an annual inspection of the front suspension and steering components. This would include torquing bolts, inspecting tie rod and drag link ends for play, ball joints for wear, etc. How many Ram truck owners do this?

I'm sure that the Chevy owners manuals recommend periodic inspection of front end components as well.

If it weren't below zero outside, I'd run out and look at my JK manual, but I'm pretty sure it recommends a periodic inspection of front end components. I think they are making a mistake by not recommending torquing the trackbar bolts as part of regular maintenance--like tire rotation.

I suggest at every oil change interval to torque the trackbar bolts because it only takes about 90 seconds to do, it's easy, and keeping those bolts torqued is critical to reducing the likelihood of death wobble.


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post #336 of 360 Old 12-31-2014, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post
Few owners read their owners manuals.

My 2012 Ram 3500 diesel owners manual suggests at least an annual inspection of the front suspension and steering components. This would include torquing bolts, inspecting tie rod and drag link ends for play, ball joints for wear, etc. How many Ram truck owners do this?

I'm sure that the Chevy owners manuals recommend periodic inspection of front end components as well.

If it weren't below zero outside, I'd run out and look at my JK manual, but I'm pretty sure it recommends a periodic inspection of front end components. I think they are making a mistake by not recommending torquing the trackbar bolts as part of regular maintenance--like tire rotation.

I suggest at every oil change interval to torque the trackbar bolts because it only takes about 90 seconds to do, it's easy, and keeping those bolts torqued is critical to reducing the likelihood of death wobble.
I actually have read several sections in the manual. But then I am anal that way. However I either fall a sleep or the wife needs something so I never get back to that good book

One of these days I do hope to finish it. I think the butler did it

I can say I don't remember reading about DW at all anyplace in the manual. I guess they selectively left that out.

Maybe it's in the recommended servicing when you take the Jeep in for 10 or 20K etc services?

Well at some point I think Ill just buy the kit.
Still trying to figure out what is a good complete kit and then I'll buy it. If I can Ill install myself or take it to my mechanic to do it. This way I know he has the correct tools etc. I have an old school torque wrench.

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post #337 of 360 Old 01-10-2015, 03:42 PM
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Simple fix - IF YOU ACT FAST!

Amazingly helpful post! Thanks a zillion.

My wife and I experienced the "Death Wobble" a week or so ago while cruising on a smooth paved road at about 60mph. Most violent thing that ever happened to me in a vehicle (that didn't result in a crash). Long story short I went online, found this post, called the dealer and decided to replace the steering dampener first. We have a 2008 JK Sahara - rock-stock - with 42k miles on it. NEVER had an issue before.

So I got an aftermarket from Amazon (Rocky Ridge $45) and replaced it. The new one was stiff as hell - LOTS of dampening. So as I removed the old one it was a HUGE relief to discover that it was basically resistance-free. Had virtually no dampening (in or out) thus confirming that sometimes the most easy fix really is the right one. While I was under the jeep I checked all the stuff that I could without a tear-down and re-torqued all the bolts. NONE were loose at all. All the parts check out and perform nominally.

So I really felt like I dodged a bullet. Then again it only happened once in 42k miles so there's plenty of time left...
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post #338 of 360 Old 01-10-2015, 04:41 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fratracide
Amazingly helpful post! Thanks a zillion. My wife and I experienced the "Death Wobble" a week or so ago while cruising on a smooth paved road at about 60mph. Most violent thing that ever happened to me in a vehicle (that didn't result in a crash). Long story short I went online, found this post, called the dealer and decided to replace the steering dampener first. We have a 2008 JK Sahara - rock-stock - with 42k miles on it. NEVER had an issue before. So I got an aftermarket from Amazon (Rocky Ridge $45) and replaced it. The new one was stiff as hell - LOTS of dampening. So as I removed the old one it was a HUGE relief to discover that it was basically resistance-free. Had virtually no dampening (in or out) thus confirming that sometimes the most easy fix really is the right one. While I was under the jeep I checked all the stuff that I could without a tear-down and re-torqued all the bolts. NONE were loose at all. All the parts check out and perform nominally. So I really felt like I dodged a bullet. Then again it only happened once in 42k miles so there's plenty of time left...
The source of the problem isn't a worn steering stabilizer.

The stock steering stabilizer is worn out because it could no longer mask the real source(s) of the problem.

You need to watch the two videos at the beginning of this thread, and at the very least, perform the tests I show in the second video.


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post #339 of 360 Old 01-10-2015, 04:50 PM
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I tried to explain that to this guy at SEMA.
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post #340 of 360 Old 01-11-2015, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planman View Post

The source of the problem isn't a worn steering stabilizer.

The stock steering stabilizer is worn out because it could no longer mask the real source(s) of the problem.

You need to watch the two videos at the beginning of this thread, and at the very least, perform the tests I show in the second video.
You could have just had mine for free, o don't run a steering stabilizer. It doesn't cause death wobble, all it does is mask it. Your issues will come back once that stabilizer wears out


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post #341 of 360 Old 01-11-2015, 08:11 AM
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I tried to explain that to this guy at SEMA.
What an idiot...


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post #342 of 360 Old 06-15-2015, 11:31 AM
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planman, first of all thanks for all your time researching/documenting on this issue!!!

So my wife's 2012 unlimited Rubicon with about 40K miles is experiencing the DW. It's not lifted, but it does have some bigger tires on it, 305/70/18's.

Following your video, I found vertical play in the ball joints and steering stabilizers. Didn't see much movement in the track bar. My ball joint video:
https://youtu.be/m2OSuOMUu6Y

I didn't see the parts listed in Chrystler's Maximum Care warranty, and it would cost me $100 to tow it, and another $100 for the Maximum Care deductible...so I am looking at working on it myself.
So far I am going with the Synergy ball joint kit, Synergy Drag Link, and the Northridge 4X4 grade 8 bolt kit:

Synergy MFG Jeep JK High Steer Drag Link - 8001 (going to use this in the stock un-flipped location)
Synergy MFG Jeep JK Heavy Duty Front Ball Joint Complete Set
Northridge 4X4 Jeep JK Grade 8 Hardware kit - GRADE8

I just started researching parts, so I was just wondering if my hardware selections are good to go?

Thanks!!!
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post #343 of 360 Old 06-16-2015, 05:54 PM
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Chrsyler Maxcare & Death Wobble

Unicorn,

All parts are covered under maxcare plan we have on our 2009 Wrangler X bone stock. The front end has been completely rebuilt w/new factory parts twice until they got it right by dealer all under warranty. A little prodding with their TSB in hand helped too. 122k to date on body 14k on warranty replacement engine ......
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post #344 of 360 Old 06-17-2015, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by unicron View Post
planman, first of all thanks for all your time researching/documenting on this issue!!!

So my wife's 2012 unlimited Rubicon with about 40K miles is experiencing the DW. It's not lifted, but it does have some bigger tires on it, 305/70/18's.

Following your video, I found vertical play in the ball joints and steering stabilizers. Didn't see much movement in the track bar. My ball joint video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2OSuOMUu6Y

I didn't see the parts listed in Chrystler's Maximum Care warranty, and it would cost me $100 to tow it, and another $100 for the Maximum Care deductible...so I am looking at working on it myself.
So far I am going with the Synergy ball joint kit, Synergy Drag Link, and the Northridge 4X4 grade 8 bolt kit:

Synergy MFG Jeep JK High Steer Drag Link - 8001 (going to use this in the stock un-flipped location)
Synergy MFG Jeep JK Heavy Duty Front Ball Joint Complete Set
Northridge 4X4 Jeep JK Grade 8 Hardware kit - GRADE8

I just started researching parts, so I was just wondering if my hardware selections are good to go?

Thanks!!!
I wouldn't waste your time or money on the Grade 8 bolt kit. There is nothing wrong with the factory bolts despite what you have read on this forum. That kit was put together for one thing...to make money. I does nothing to fix DW. Just make sure you torque your factory bolts to spec and that will be sufficient.

As far as ball joints go, if you can swing it I would buy the Dynatrac ones. They are quite expensive...around $400 but they can be rebuilt while on the vehicle with no special tools. They are the best out there in my opinion. Synergy, Teraflex, Alloy, Crown HD are all pretty much equal.

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post #345 of 360 Old 06-18-2015, 08:59 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Utah_Jay
I wouldn't waste your time or money on the Grade 8 bolt kit. There is nothing wrong with the factory bolts despite what you have read on this forum. That kit was put together for one thing...to make money. I does nothing to fix DW. Just make sure you torque your factory bolts to spec and that will be sufficient. As far as ball joints go, if you can swing it I would buy the Dynatrac ones. They are quite expensive...around $400 but they can be rebuilt while on the vehicle with no special tools. They are the best out there in my opinion. Synergy, Teraflex, Alloy, Crown HD are all pretty much equal.
The bolt question depends. Here is my thread about the stock vs. grade 8 bolts question:

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f96/d...bolts-2782882/

I've run Dynatrac ball joints and Synergy ball joints. I like them both.

However, if you think buying $40 in grade 8 bolts is a waste, then you should probably conclude that buying Dynatrac ball joints is a waste.

If you wheel your rig in such a fashion that you will destroy 2 complete sets of Synergy ball joints before you'd need to rebuild one set of Dynatrac ball joints, I'd be surprised.

If you want the bling of the Dynatracs, go for it, but it's not an economically preferable choice.


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