AEV Snorkel install. - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 01:33 PM Thread Starter
trw
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AEV Snorkel install.

I thought I'd write a thread on it since I deviated from AEV's instructions a bit to make things easier.

I forget which member on here mentioned it, but installing the snorkel first before cutting made checking the alignment of the template a lot easier.

I didn't bother with an angle grinder at all since it was too clumsy for this work. I primarily used a multi-speed dremel and electric body saw (from harbor freight).
I used 3 cutting wheels and 2 grinding wheels on the dremel, and 2 blades on the body saw (one it came with lost all its teeth half way through.)

snorkel installed:



Template taped on and holes drilled with 2" holesaw and high powered electric drill (be VERY careful when doing this, if the saw jams and stops the drill can fly out of your hands possibly hurting your wrist). My saw caught once on the forward hole, you can see where the teeth went into the hood just above the cut line thank goodness that was covered by the trim ring AEV provided.


raw cut done, inside still left to do: (the body saw made this real quick and easy)


cutting the inside metal was a little more difficult. I tried using my angle grinder but found it very difficult, so I defaulted to my dremel cut off wheels and finished up with my body saw and cleaned up all the edges with my dremel with grinding heads. The cut wasn't as clean as I had liked it, but I needed my Jeep for work in a few hours so I was in a hurry.


Trim ring was easy as pie to install, pop rivet gun and a drill, followed by black paint underneath to cover all the newly exposed metal, and done:




And all this followed up by silicone sealant on the air box where the inlet meets the box and the drain holes at the bottom also needed to be sealed.

Also, if you install the snorkel first, be careful when cutting and drilling that you don't fall through once the metal lets go and nick the snorkel as its right under where you're cutting. I propped my hood up with a toolbox during this part.

So far, first initial driving impressions are basically showing no changes performance wise. Power feels the same and mileage also returns the same, but now I won't have to worry about hydrolocking.

My only complaint was the ram air head. In that it felt extremely cheap. I had an ARB snorkel on my old YJ and the plastic work was far better quality and it cost less than this AEV one did; not that it really matters, but it was just an observation I made.

Total install time was about 2 hours

Tools required:
Pop rivet gun
Drill
body saw
dremel
metric allen wrenches
torx bits
sharpie
tape (no duct tape)
silicone sealant
angle grinder
2" holesaw with mandrel
center punch
drill bits


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2011 Jeep Wrangler JK - 33" BFG KM2s, 2.5" RC BB, ARB bumper, IPF 900XS, Superwinch EPI 9.0, AEV Snorkel
1995 Jeep Wrangler - 4 cyl, 2.5" lift, BFG AT 30s, Ford 8.8, SYE+CV, AX15 swap, ARB snorkel, Aussie locker + loads more - sold
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post #2 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 04:01 PM
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wow!! still seems a bit too involved for my taste.

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post #3 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 04:50 PM
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I like the idea of a snorkle but I keep hearing of power loss ..... can't really afford to lose any ..... After you get used to it could you comment on any power loss please ? Thanks

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post #4 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernjack View Post
I like the idea of a snorkle but I keep hearing of power loss ..... can't really afford to lose any ..... After you get used to it could you comment on any power loss please ? Thanks
You don't really lose any power with a snorkel unless you're running a supercharger, simply because it's designed to suck a lot more air and you're somewhat bottlenecking that process with the tube.

The argument that a snorkel is like breathing through a tube isn't accurate either, since your Jeep doesn't technically "exhale" out of the snorkel.

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post #5 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spank View Post
You don't really lose any power with a snorkel unless you're running a supercharger, simply because it's designed to suck a lot more air and you're somewhat bottlenecking that process with the tube.

The argument that a snorkel is like breathing through a tube isn't accurate either, since your Jeep doesn't technically "exhale" out of the snorkel.
......................... Yeah because your NA engine doesn't suck any air right? "Exhale" through your snorkel? Wow, I'm not sure where to even begin to help you out.

I would speculate you would lose more power on a non supercharged engine do to the fact you are only relying on the vaccum produced by the engine to get fresh air in.

An "exhale" through your intake is possible it isn't good but it is possible.............

Sean

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post #6 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPV View Post
......................... Yeah because your NA engine doesn't suck any air right? "Exhale" through your snorkel? Wow, I'm not sure where to even begin to help you out.

I would speculate you would lose more power on a non supercharged engine do to the fact you are only relying on the vaccum produced by the engine to get fresh air in.

An "exhale" through your intake is possible it isn't good but it is possible.............
I'm not sure what you're confused about. You repeated what I posted, except for some reason *I* need help.

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post #7 of 22 Old 05-22-2012, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernjack View Post
I like the idea of a snorkle but I keep hearing of power loss ..... can't really afford to lose any ..... After you get used to it could you comment on any power loss please ? Thanks
you won't with the AEV. that snorkel is designed to flow MORE than enough air for the 6.4L HEMI's

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post #8 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 04:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spank View Post
I'm not sure what you're confused about. You repeated what I posted, except for some reason *I* need help.
No sir, I speculated that a snorkel would hurt a NA(naturally aspirated) engine more than a supercharged engine.

You said:
Quote:
You don't really lose any power with a snorkel unless you're running a supercharger, simply because it's designed to suck a lot more air and you're somewhat bottlenecking that process with the tube.
See the difference yet, we are saying the opposite thing................

Sean

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post #9 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPV View Post
......................... Yeah because your NA engine doesn't suck any air right? "Exhale" through your snorkel? Wow, I'm not sure where to even begin to help you out.

I would speculate you would lose more power on a non supercharged engine do to the fact you are only relying on the vaccum produced by the engine to get fresh air in.

An "exhale" through your intake is possible it isn't good but it is possible.............
Why would a n/a vehicle lose more? That doesn't really make sense. A s/c'd car benefits from the increased airflow, forced induction. If you limit the ability of the sc to cram more air into the motor you're gonna lose power. Unless a snorkel creates a bottleneck for airflow on a n/a vehicle, its gonna breath like normal. It's not like there isn't already air inside of the intake. Plus you even said its speculation, what makes you think this?

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post #10 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 06:16 AM
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This would be the first time I have ever heard anyone claim power loss, or even potential power loss with a snorkel.
It it's going to affect one, it's going to be the one that demands higher airflow, but when I look at the kit, there are plenty of bottlenecks other than the snorkel. The intake at the airbox, the filter, and the intake to the manifold are going to be your biggest problems.
I agree that sucking air through a tube from a pure physics standpoint could mathematically show some potential issues, but in reality....that tube would have to be 100 feet long to ever cause issues with the amount of air these engines pull in. And even then I would be surprised if there were any measurable effects.
Air temperature and altitude are going to be much larger factors than a snorkel ever would.
Yeah, maybe the inductive reactive flux capacitive field created by the interaction of boson particles passing by the AEV logo might shave off a billionth of one HP. Maybe. Probably not.

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post #11 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wardo View Post
Why would a n/a vehicle lose more? That doesn't really make sense. A s/c'd car benefits from the increased airflow, forced induction. If you limit the ability of the sc to cram more air into the motor you're gonna lose power. Unless a snorkel creates a bottleneck for airflow on a n/a vehicle, its gonna breath like normal. It's not like there isn't already air inside of the intake. Plus you even said its speculation, what makes you think this?
I haven't looked into this it's just what I am thinking hence "speculation". Think of it this way: draining water through a hose. It will go with gravity but add a pump it will go much faster with a pump moving the water. The engine vaccum has less force and will be more affected by added friction in the pipe work. A supercharger suffers from the same friction but uses more power to pull the air through the intake. I would be curious to measure the difference with a NA and a supercharged engine w/snorkel and without the snorkel. If they both loose 3 HP (totally fabricated number) the over all percent loss is less in the supercharged because the total HP number is higher.

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post #12 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 09:35 AM
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I might be wrong, but I didn't think that people put in snorkels to increase power. I'm slightly off topic, but to the op, nice install. It looks good and will add that extra protection in deep water. Power increase or decrease won't matter if your hydrolocked!
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post #13 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 09:36 AM
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It's most likely the case that the snorkel can flow way more CFM than the engine can "suck" at redline. The only way I can see any powerloss potential is though heating on sunny day. That's a fairly long black tube that probably will warm the air a bit, making it less dense. That siad, it's pulling the air from WAY outside the engine bay, so it should have a minor "cold air intake" effect. Maybe the two balance out, maybe not. Without dyno sheets the world may never know

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post #14 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPV View Post
No sir, I speculated that a snorkel would hurt a NA(naturally aspirated) engine more than a supercharged engine.
Which is incorrect. In fact, according to all the companies kicking out superchargers for the JK, a snorkel attached to an engine with a supercharger suffers a measurable performance loss as opposed to one without, especially up here where we have no air. It's not huge and certainly not a dealbreaker, but the numbers are there. Ask me how I know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J33PNSL33P View Post
I might be wrong, but I didn't think that people put in snorkels to increase power. I'm slightly off topic, but to the op, nice install. It looks good and will add that extra protection in deep water. Power increase or decrease won't matter if your hydrolocked!
I've seen a few arguments people have made where they've claimed better gas mileage out of their JK with a snorkel, but I don't see how you can measure 2-5HP as an improvement to boast about. It's really no different than a CAI minus the protection benefits.

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post #15 of 22 Old 05-23-2012, 12:26 PM
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Even AEV will tell you you will lose power on a stock motor when you install their snorkel. IIRC, it used to be right on their ordering page, but that was a few years ago. You are adding at least two major turns into the airflow getting to your filter.

Is it noticeable? Not really - I've had mine for years now and never really noticed a singificant change. It was a pig when I bought it, and it's still a pig now. Plus, with all the extra weight it's now carrying in armor and gear, the impact on changing airflow patterns, while maybe interesting for internet debates, has no real world impact to offset the point, which is increased fording depth.

Something a heck of lot more important to me crawling through slop in 4Lo than 2 additional HP.

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