Oil leak from water pump. Really? - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 11:07 AM Thread Starter
gregM=1944
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Oil leak from water pump. Really?

Background information:

  • Subject Jeep is a 2005 Wrangler TJ/LJ with 98,500 miles on the 6-cyl, 4-liter, un-modified engine.
  • Additional information that may be relevant: On 17 January, I gently rolled my Jeep onto a "soft" sand dune. I replaced the hard top, mirrors, plastic fenders, and driver's window, but doors were not racked and everything works well now, after a bit of home-mechanic-fix-it work. (Seems I should make you aware of this recent unplanned event.)
  • Engine mounts appear to be sound and unbroken.
  • This same problem presented shortly after the rollover, but then it went away. Now it or a close cousin has returned.

Now for the problem: As the attached pictures show, engine oil is leaking from what appears to be the gasket between the water pump and engine block.



From time to time, I twist a wrench or two, but I'm not an auto-tech by even grossly relaxed standards. So analyzing this seeming enigma is beyond my understanding of the ol' "engine oil and cooling water don't mix" cosmic rule. Seems my Jeep is operating by the rules of some distant galaxy.



So my questions to you Mopar Mystics are:

  • Is correct to say engine oil is leaking from the water pump?
  • If so, how does engine oil get into the cooling water?
  • What is the fix, if any?
  • Is this condition more likely the result of the roll-over or 98,500 miles?

Thank you for considering my questions.


Greg in Vegas

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post #2 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 11:14 AM
TheBoogieman
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Looks like the pan gasket to me. Use brake/parts cleaner and clean all that crud off so you can see exactly where it's coming from. The water pump would leak antifreeze.

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post #3 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 11:46 AM
JFM626
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Pan gasket or timing cover seal,

How can you trust an atom, they make up everything
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post #4 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 12:49 PM
Jonny Jeep
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Looking at the grime build up on the timing case cover, #1 suspect for me would be the front crank seal.
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post #5 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 01:35 PM
mukluk
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If that's an engine oil leak, why is the fluid red? A slow coolant leak will accrue dirt and look just like an oil leak given time.
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post #6 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 01:41 PM
gutthans
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Place a piece of white paper or cardboard under the motor and let it idle a bit. It will either smell like anti-freeze or the rust.sludge will be separated from the fluid and you can tell it's water...OR, you will be able to tell there's oil there, ...OR BOTH.
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post #7 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 03:25 PM Thread Starter
gregM=1944
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Greetings TheBoogieman,


I'll do as you suggest and use a can or two of brake cleaner to remove the 15 years of built-up crud. Then I will watch to see from whence the leaking oil comes. Seems like a solid plan. And yep, it makes sense that antifreeze--not oil--would come out of a leaking water pump gasket. Thank you for taking time to write. Greg in Vegas
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post #8 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregM=1944 View Post
Greetings TheBoogieman,


I'll do as you suggest and use a can or two of brake cleaner to remove the 15 years of built-up crud. Then I will watch to see from whence the leaking oil comes. Seems like a solid plan. And yep, it makes sense that antifreeze--not oil--would come out of a leaking water pump gasket. Thank you for taking time to write. Greg in Vegas

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepinmichguy_ View Post
TheBoogieman is a jerk.
03' Rubicon/Zone 4" coils with 1" spacers up front/Rancho shocks/5.13 gears-35" MTZs/Black Magic brakes.
99' XJ /4.0L-AW4/ 5.5" lift / Rancho RS5000X shocks/33" DC Extreme country MTs. Jeep #18
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post #9 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 04:13 PM
TheBoogieman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mukluk View Post
If that's an engine oil leak, why is the fluid red?
Maybe a squirrel got stuck up there (blood) and he didn't know it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepinmichguy_ View Post
TheBoogieman is a jerk.
03' Rubicon/Zone 4" coils with 1" spacers up front/Rancho shocks/5.13 gears-35" MTZs/Black Magic brakes.
99' XJ /4.0L-AW4/ 5.5" lift / Rancho RS5000X shocks/33" DC Extreme country MTs. Jeep #18
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post #10 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
gregM=1944
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Lots of good ideas and thank you.


I can't account for why the fluid in my pictures has a red tint--seems an answer to this question may lead to an explanation of the source of the problem. I changed the oil (I use Castrol Edge Titanium, 10w-30) on 8 January about 1,200 miles ago, and, when I collect some of the fluid on a white paper towel, the collected fluid has--my wife advised--a "pinkish-orange" color to it. It feels like oil, yet it is of a thin viscosity.


I'd hoped to get all this resolved before I put this ol' LJ on jack-stands and I rotate out until October 2020, but this is much more involved than I'd considered.



I will employ your advice by cleaning the pan and surrounding area, observing exact point of any leaks, and collecting fluid on white paper. I may also use tracer dye in the antifreeze or engine oil and then use a UV light to help determine if the leak is from one source or the other. But into which fluid reservoir--oil or antifreeze--to put the dye? Well, this will have to wait until I get back.



In the meantime, I will read about where to find the "front crank seal" and look at YouTube.com videos on changing the various gaskets and using dye to find the source of leaks. I can't imagine what I did with my time--or money--before I bought this ol' Wrangler.



Thank you for your ideas.



Greg in Vegas
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post #11 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 05:51 PM
TheBoogieman
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I use brake cleaner to clean all crap and stuff paper towels anywhere I think it's leaking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepinmichguy_ View Post
TheBoogieman is a jerk.
03' Rubicon/Zone 4" coils with 1" spacers up front/Rancho shocks/5.13 gears-35" MTZs/Black Magic brakes.
99' XJ /4.0L-AW4/ 5.5" lift / Rancho RS5000X shocks/33" DC Extreme country MTs. Jeep #18
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post #12 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 06:27 PM
bobjp
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That is the common drip path for the water pump. If it is the water pump you should see the trail further up. I usually see it on the driver's side of the crank shaft.

You can touch your finger to the fluid and taste it on the tip of your tongue without swallowing. Antifreeze has a distinct sweet taste, there's no mistaking it for oil. Easiest and quickest way to tell.

What color is your antifreeze?

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post #13 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 07:38 PM
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+1 on the Boogieman point

Clean clean clean, then find the source

I once had coolant dripping between the block and trans on my Durango, figured it was the expansion plug on the rear of the motor.
Long story short, timing cover leak ran along the gap between the block and head to the rear and then down
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post #14 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregM=1944 View Post
I can't account for why the fluid in my pictures has a red tint--seems an answer to this question may lead to an explanation of the source of the problem. I changed the oil (I use Castrol Edge Titanium, 10w-30) on 8 January about 1,200 miles ago, and, when I collect some of the fluid on a white paper towel, the collected fluid has--my wife advised--a "pinkish-orange" color to it. It feels like oil, yet it is of a thin viscosity.
What colour is your coolant?

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post #15 of 21 Old 04-02-2020, 10:37 PM
wtroger
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Power steering fluid
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