Weber 38 DGES Tuning - Page 6 - JeepForum.com
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post #76 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 11:38 AM
Matt1981CJ7
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Oooof....that plug doesn't look happy at all.

I just can't imagine a slightly misadjusted choke doing that to the plugs, unless it wasn't opening at all.

Michael, what type of ignition do you have on this engine? It looks like that plug was barely firing.

Matt



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post #77 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 12:43 PM Thread Starter
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I got some great help from Matt1981CJ, Keith460, Hoover7, uptillnow, and John Strenk when I did this:

She ran great for 200 miles until I messed with the carburetor.

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/i...grade-4386083/

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael72 View Post
Hello everyone,

I have just finished doing a Nutter bypass and putting a Weber K-551 38 on my 1984 CJ-7 with the 6-258.

I am getting ready to upgrade the ignition now and had two questions before I get started:

1- What supplies should I have on hand?

I know I will have to do some of my own wiring. I purchased a nice soldering iron and will learn how to use it.

I have learned that the factory wiring is low quality so I would like to upgrade any wires related to this job as I go.

2- Where should I locate the coil and module?

Purchased MSD Part #s

Coil - 8227

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8227

Distributor 8516

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-8516

Module 62013

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-62013

Here is a link to the work I did to get here, got lots of great answers.

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/n...-carb-4365371/

Thank you,

Michael
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post #78 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 02:11 PM Thread Starter
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I think that I need to explain the conditions under which I was working on the carburetor that put me in this spot.

After my happy 200 miles, I wanted to change the oil , and check my timing and tune the carburetor again.

I had done a nutter-bypass, carb swap, and ignition upgrade, I wanted to bring everything together thinking that I knew what I was doing.

She started right up but I could not get her to restart while hot.

I got her to restart the next day and began to tune the carburetor.

While tuning the carburetor, I noticed oil coming out of the dipstick so I shut her down. I had put an extra quart of oil in. Honest mistake that I am willing to own.

I was able to get her restarted but not get her to restart when she was hot again.

I took her for a test drive around the neighborhood and all was well.

I started a thread about it and spoke to MSD about it: https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f8/o...butor-4424041/

Could this be the cause of my problem? If so, am I looking at a blown motor?

I am lost here because she has started multiple times but I couldn't get her to restart when hot until after the idle jet swap.

When I try to start it and she doesn't start, I can hear a sucking sound coming from my distributor.

All was fixed a few days ago until I messed up the choke.

Thank you,

Michael

Last edited by michael72; 10-16-2021 at 02:14 PM. Reason: Added Information
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post #79 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 03:50 PM
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Michael,


Holy ADHD, Batman!! I just went back and read thru your other threads, as well as this one. Now, I'm exhausted and feel like taking a nap. You've been all over the place with this this thing.

You've attempted so many changes with so little knowledge and experience, only the Lord knows what your current problems are. If I were closer, I'd come over and we'd probably have your CJ running in about hour. As it is, I feel like we are just chasing our tails.

Do you have any old, experienced mechanics, who know their way around carburated vehicle's, who could help you?

Matt


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post #80 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 03:54 PM
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I'm throwing a big flag on those fancy spark plugs, unless my tired eyes aren't seeing the pic correctly. Autolite 985s (or equivalent of your preferred brand) gapped to .040. I'd do that first and then start with what's been posted. I have a feeling that's what's making things stubborn.


Shawn
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post #81 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you guys, my guests are going to be her in 30 minutes but I had to check back in, I will give you a proper response tomorrow.

Matt,

I will buy you a plane ticket.

I asked around for years looking for a mechanic before I started to do the bigger projects in case I got in over my head and couldn't find anyone.

So, the old, experienced mechanics, who know their way around carbureted vehicle's are you guys.

That's why I joined this forum, without you guys, I wouldn't have accomplished what I have so far.

It is a long story about how I got to this point, I sent Shawn an email telling him everything already but I will post it tomorrow for people learning.

Shawn,

Will do on the plugs. Autolite 985s gapped to .040.

Thank you and enjoy your Saturday night!

Thank you,

Michael
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post #82 of 125 Old 10-16-2021, 06:06 PM
Shawn Watson
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I'd forgotten that you had an MSD so who knows.


Shawn

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post #83 of 125 Old 10-17-2021, 12:47 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawn Watson View Post
I'd forgotten that you had an MSD so who knows.


Shawn
Does having the MSD mean that getting new plugs isn't what you want me to do?

I don't know why having an MSD makes you uncertain as to what I should do.

I am feeling dumber by the moment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt1981CJ7 View Post
Michael,


You've attempted so many changes with so little knowledge and experience, only the Lord knows what your current problems are. If I were closer, I'd come over and we'd probably have your CJ running in about hour. As it is, I feel like we are just chasing our tails.

Matt
I know that I have done a lot of work that was over my head but I got help from you guys or went out on the forums and taught myself to do some things without leaning on you guys.

I did the clutch, flywheel, motor mounts and rear main seal by reading other posts. The forums encourage us to do that. All of those survived a test drive. I could not believe that a wet hot dog bun got my pilot bushing out.

The help with the nutter, carb, and ignition from you guys gave me the confidence to do my homework and try those on my own.

This forum encourages learning on your own sometimes and I have used it to do that.

I really need your help guys and hope that you haven't given up on me.

I am going to get new plugs and set the carburetor the way that you suggested.

Is that still your advice?

Please keep helping me guys, I will be more lost if I can't turn to you when I get lost.

I am willing to troubleshoot anything that you recommend.

I have nowhere to take her to get a professional to get me going.

Thank you,

Michael

Last edited by michael72; 10-17-2021 at 12:49 PM. Reason: Format
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post #84 of 125 Old 10-17-2021, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michael72 View Post
Does having the MSD mean that getting new plugs isn't what you want me to do?

I don't know why having an MSD makes you uncertain as to what I should do.

I am feeling dumber by the moment...
Well, to be honest, I'm a little torn. Durasparks on 8v don't function well with what appears to be an iridium plug which is why I mentioned Autolite 985s. Then on one hand, an MSD should fire a plug in a bucket of oil but on the other, they're so bad at firing low-compression, low-speed engines that they have to hit it 5 times in a row in hopes of getting a decent kernel going so I'm all kinds of wishy-washy on the plugs.

If it were me, I'd swap the plugs and at least eliminate that potential. The plugs are clearly sooting up and 985s are cheap so I'd go for it. And definitely no gap over .040, regardless of what anyone's marketing material says.


Shawn

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Last edited by Shawn Watson; 10-17-2021 at 06:45 PM.
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post #85 of 125 Old 10-17-2021, 06:50 PM
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I don't think the issue is the plugs, but I've been wrong before, because I'm just a shade tree mechanic.

I think there's a reason why the plugs are carbon fouling in such a short run time. We just haven't figured out why.



Matt


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post #86 of 125 Old 10-17-2021, 07:02 PM
Shawn Watson
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And you could absolutely be right.

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post #87 of 125 Old 10-18-2021, 08:45 AM Thread Starter
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When I looked at the 985s online, the electrode is a very different shape from the XP985s that I was running.

I went and grabbed a set of the 985s last night and I think that I may get a better result as there is more surface area.

After trying to get the simplest version of fuel, air, and spark, I bought the fanciest plugs that they sell.

I will try to get them in tonight after I get the carburetor to the settings posted above and let you know how it goes.

Picture #1 is the 985

Picture #2 is the XP985
Attached Images
   

Thank you,

Michael
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post #88 of 125 Old 10-18-2021, 08:48 AM Thread Starter
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Interesting:

https://www.carsdirect.com/car-repai...op-performance

I am sticking with the copper plugs from now on.

Thank you,

Michael
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post #89 of 125 Old 10-18-2021, 08:59 AM
Matt1981CJ7
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It's pretty common knowledge that copper plugs perform better, especially in these older engines.

Here's my 360's plugs after about 2000 miles post rebuild.

Michael, if you are serious about tuning your engine well, and keeping it that way, you might consider investing in a wideband A/F monitor.
Attached Thumbnails
SparkPlugAnalysis.jpg   AFMonitor3.jpg  
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post #90 of 125 Old 10-18-2021, 10:07 AM
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Let's hope that opens up the door to some successful carb tuning.


Shawn
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