Did the Machine Shop Foul it Up?!?! - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 12 Old 10-12-2020, 08:47 AM Thread Starter
smbundy13
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Did the Machine Shop Foul it Up?!?!

I have been on an adventure of rebuilding my 4.2L and swapping the stock SR-4 for a T176.

I had the short block rebuilt and a mild cam installed by the machine shop because we figured out that the block needed to be bored .030 over.

we finally got the drivetrain into the jeep yesterday and when we were turning the engine over by hand to lube the cylinders, the engine locked up. we came to find out that the machine shop didnt put the cam retaining bolt and the cam gear came off and locked it up. We reinstalled and verified timing of the engine using the timing marks facing each other at TDC. We are confident that it is in the right orientation.

I was pretty annoyed about the bolt but it appears that it is a specialized bolt with a spring type thing to keep the cam from walking. luckily, i have a neighbor that is a jeep nut (his jeep is in pieces too) and he had that bolt. i stole it from him and ordered a new one to replace that bolt for him.

now to the real question. the machine shop did a valve job on my head and installed new springs & retainers that came with the new cam. what they didnt install are the rocker arms. I didnt get the factory rocker arms back!

i am going by the shop today to discuss with them but wanted to verify with yall, can i use the factory rocker arms and push rods with the new cam? for specifics, i bought the Comp Cams part 68-232-4.

i can confirm in my pictures that the head had rocker arms installed when i took to the machine shop.

so, the two questions are, can i use the factory rocker arms/push rods with the new cam. & what should i say to the shop?

i am not a combative person and know mistakes are made.

thanks alot.


1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
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post #2 of 12 Old 10-12-2020, 12:12 PM
whollsee
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Originally Posted by smbundy13 View Post
i am not a combative person and know mistakes are made.
'To lose one parent, Mr. Worthing, may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both looks like carelessness.' Oscar Wilde

Id be a bit cranky and wonder about their competence with two issues. Id be civil though and give them a chance to remedy the situation before I ripped em a new one! You can use your original rocker arms, springs and pushrods If they are in good condition. If they are not the shop should have communicated that at least. However I would be tempted to get new Comp Cam springs, retainers.... and the stock pushrods may come up a little short but you would need to measure for preload on lifters. Was the shop meant to handle all the valvetrain work?

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post #3 of 12 Old 10-12-2020, 12:28 PM Thread Starter
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the kit came with springs and retainers.

I was assuming that the shop doing the head work meant they would give me back a head that can be bolted right up.
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1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
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post #4 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 07:47 AM Thread Starter
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update, went and talked to the shop owner. they still had my rocker arms and we got them home. now i just need to install the pushrods and rocker arms in the head and the front engine accessories.

on another note, i am trying to find a step-by-step guide to installing them. I do have a haynes manual and havent been able to check it.

anybody know of a guide that is good/easy to follow?

1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
2.5" lift, Method Con6's, Weber 38, DUI HEI, Painless Harness
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post #5 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 08:08 AM
Shawn Watson
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I'd be leery of reusing stock pushrods on a Comp XE camshaft with stiffer valve springs. I'd also check the pushrod cups on your old rockers and see how close you are to wearing through the heat treat.

I'd replace both so you have good pushrods and can start with a brand new wear pattern on new rockers but that's just me.


Shawn

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Last edited by Shawn Watson; 10-14-2020 at 08:19 AM.
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post #6 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 08:21 AM Thread Starter
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I'd be leery of reusing stock pushrods on a Comp XE camshaft with stiffer valve springs. I'd also check the pushrod cups on your old rockers and see how close you are to wearing through the heat treat.

I'd replace both so you have good pushrods and can start with a brand new wear pattern on new rockers but that's just me.


Shawn
ok, should i get stock replacement pushrods? the machine shop did say that my rocker arms looked great/perfect.

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post #7 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 08:28 AM
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I kind of went though this process rebuilding my engine. I wanted a different cam but a little research led me away from it.

I ended up finding out that the valve spring seats needed additional machining to accept the new valve spring retainers/ seats. Basically, you can't just put them in and call it a day (at least for the cam I was looking at, which wasn't that beefy of a cam). I think the spring seats were thicker and the springs were slightly different from stock. I'm sure the machine shop knows that and would probably adjust for the new retainers.

Just a thought I wanted to share and may be something to look into if you are still having issues.

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post #8 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 08:58 AM
Shawn Watson
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ok, should i get stock replacement pushrods? the machine shop did say that my rocker arms looked great/perfect.
I'd go with a 5/16ths, .080 (.060?) wall pushrod but the stockers have that big-azz ball on the end so I'm not real sure. I don't have a ton of confidence in Comp's tech line but maybe they can answer that ball-end question. I'd want the ball to be the same radius as OEM to give me a better shot at fitting into the existing wear pattern on the rockers.

I think their "High Energy" pushrods are fairly cheap and will do the trick. I do think you're asking too much from the stockers, though, especially considering how long they are. You need a rigid pushrod, not a pole vault, lol.


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post #9 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 09:17 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Deer-Slayer_5 View Post
I kind of went though this process rebuilding my engine. I wanted a different cam but a little research led me away from it.

I ended up finding out that the valve spring seats needed additional machining to accept the new valve spring retainers/ seats. Basically, you can't just put them in and call it a day (at least for the cam I was looking at, which wasn't that beefy of a cam). I think the spring seats were thicker and the springs were slightly different from stock. I'm sure the machine shop knows that and would probably adjust for the new retainers.

Just a thought I wanted to share and may be something to look into if you are still having issues.
thanks for the info. the new valve springs are installed in the head already, i just need to re-install the rockers and pushrods.

1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
2.5" lift, Method Con6's, Weber 38, DUI HEI, Painless Harness
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post #10 of 12 Old 10-14-2020, 09:18 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Shawn Watson View Post
I'd go with a 5/16ths, .080 (.060?) wall pushrod but the stockers have that big-azz ball on the end so I'm not real sure. I don't have a ton of confidence in Comp's tech line but maybe they can answer that ball-end question. I'd want the ball to be the same radius as OEM to give me a better shot at fitting into the existing wear pattern on the rockers.

I think their "High Energy" pushrods are fairly cheap and will do the trick. I do think you're asking too much from the stockers, though, especially considering how long they are. You need a rigid pushrod, not a pole vault, lol.


Shawn
thanks for the info. i might install the factory units and turn the engine over by hand with my engine builder and see what he thinks/hears. should be fine turning it with a wrench. but we will see.

1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
2.5" lift, Method Con6's, Weber 38, DUI HEI, Painless Harness
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post #11 of 12 Old 10-16-2020, 04:07 AM
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thanks for the info. i might install the factory units and turn the engine over by hand with my engine builder and see what he thinks/hears. should be fine turning it with a wrench. but we will see.
I ended up finding out that the valve spring seats needed additional machining to accept the new valve spring retainers/ seats. Basically, you can't just put them in and call it a day (at least for the cam I was looking at, which wasn't that beefy of a cam).
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post #12 of 12 Old Yesterday, 08:00 AM Thread Starter
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the head has had a valve job when installing the new springs.. so, we will just send it and see how it goes.

1980 CJ-7 Alpaca Brown 4.2L, SR4
2.5" lift, Method Con6's, Weber 38, DUI HEI, Painless Harness
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