Alarm to Air Horns? Which Relay Fasher? - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 34 Old 07-29-2020, 11:15 PM Thread Starter
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Cj Alarm to Air Horns? Which Relay Fasher?

Folks, I connected my loud air horns to my alarm but I can not get the horns to sound flash (go on and off) with the alarm; meaning, they simply stay on constantly. I purchased an electronic flasher but it's not working. So, maybe I got the wrong one? Has anybody done this and if so, which flasher relay did you use? It is a 2 prong relay flasher and I was told there is a specific one I need however. Don't know for sure which one I need. Any thoughts?

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post #2 of 34 Old 07-30-2020, 04:50 AM
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How are you actuating the air horn compressor? They take quite a load and should be run through a relay. If you do not you will be fighting the high resistance and amperage with your car alarm which was not designed for it.

If your alarm was designed to actuate a normal car horn up and down, it was about 5 Amps. The compressor draws 15 Amps. You need a relay in between.

By contrast a 21W indicator lamp is around 1.5 Amps. that is why a flasher relay will be hard to find that is matched to the compressor. They are often "load sensitive" and will flash faster if the designed number of lamps (or equivalent load) are not connected.

if you have a constant alarm signal and want to make it go on and off, again use a relay to power the flasher relay and then the compressor.

An electro-mechanical type flasher is suitable to actuate the compressor as it does not care what amps you need, and does not detect a broken lamp. You can also use an electronic flasher as long as it is clearly labelled as non-load sensitive. Needless to say both need to be able to handle the load.

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post #3 of 34 Old 07-30-2020, 12:23 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BagusJeep View Post
How are you actuating the air horn compressor? They take quite a load and should be run through a relay. If you do not you will be fighting the high resistance and amperage with your car alarm which was not designed for it.

If your alarm was designed to actuate a normal car horn up and down, it was about 5 Amps. The compressor draws 15 Amps. You need a relay in between.

By contrast a 21W indicator lamp is around 1.5 Amps. that is why a flasher relay will be hard to find that is matched to the compressor. They are often "load sensitive" and will flash faster if the designed number of lamps (or equivalent load) are not connected.

if you have a constant alarm signal and want to make it go on and off, again use a relay to power the flasher relay and then the compressor.

An electro-mechanical type flasher is suitable to actuate the compressor as it does not care what amps you need, and does not detect a broken lamp. You can also use an electronic flasher as long as it is clearly labelled as non-load sensitive. Needless to say both need to be able to handle the load.
The air horns run on a relay to their compressor. They have been set up nicely for many years. They are LOUD!
Yes, I am finding the relay flasher that accommodates it really hard to find.
It is set up with a FLASHER to make it go ON and OFF but again, it is not doing it. My guess; the FLASHER. Air horns go ON when alarm is triggered but with all sirens, air horns still stays CONSTANT!

I bought the Electro-Mechanical flasher (Osram - LF12) and there is no ON and OFF!
So, currently there are 2 relays on the system but I was told by alarm shop that it needs the CORRECT relay flasher, otherwise it will be CONSTANT. I need that Brand and part number.
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post #4 of 34 Old 07-30-2020, 11:57 PM
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Looking at the LF12 it is electro mechanical.

So the LF12 is not turning on and off? Have you checked this with a multimeter and a simulated load such as a bulb?

12 Volt applications
2 terminals (X, L)
1 to 10 lamps (240 Watt / 20 Amp)
5 times louder than thermal flashers
Must fuse X lead
For car/truck trailering



You could try the EL13 but I woud be surprised at an elecr0-mechanical flasher not turning on and off.

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post #5 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 02:01 PM
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I'm not following relaying at the compressor?

It would make more sense to run a flasher (or whatever) with 12 volts feeding into the horn switch wire and "off and on" the solenoid.

-----JEEPFELLER
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AIR HORN SOLENOID.jpg  
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post #6 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 03:59 PM
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The alarm system puts out a positive signal, so using a relay at the compressor to supply a ground and turn it on/off as the horn button creates the ground side of the horn loop, not the power side. OP, sounds like the low amp draw of the relay is not enough to get the electro-mechanical relay to break over and flash. You likely need a low draw flasher like what is used when converting to led's.

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post #7 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 04:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEEPFELLER View Post
I'm not following relaying at the compressor?

It would make more sense to run a flasher (or whatever) with 12 volts feeding into the horn switch wire and "off and on" the solenoid.

-----JEEPFELLER

wire from the horn is a ground, not 12v, hence the relay to provide a ground

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post #8 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 06:31 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEEPFELLER View Post
I'm not following relaying at the compressor?

It would make more sense to run a flasher (or whatever) with 12 volts feeding into the horn switch wire and "off and on" the solenoid.

-----JEEPFELLER
Where is it attached to an alarm? My air-horns work fine, simply need to configure the CORRECT relay hook-up for the alarm to air-horns.
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post #9 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 06:34 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourtrail View Post
The alarm system puts out a positive signal, so using a relay at the compressor to supply a ground and turn it on/off as the horn button creates the ground side of the horn loop, not the power side. OP, sounds like the low amp draw of the relay is not enough to get the electro-mechanical relay to break over and flash. You likely need a low draw flasher like what is used when converting to led's.

I thought Elctro-Magnetic relay was for LED conversions? Hmmm? I will go back and take a look. I bet it's something super easy, lol. Thanks
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post #10 of 34 Old 07-31-2020, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 258 View Post
I thought Elctro-Magnetic relay was for LED conversions? Hmmm? I will go back and take a look. I bet it's something super easy, lol. Thanks
They are and work with the low current draw from the LED.
But a relay is really low power and may not be enough to start it flashing.

Are you trying to do something like this

https://www.the12volt.com/relays/ill...-flash.asp#lf3

Why didn’t they tell you what one to use.


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post #11 of 34 Old 08-01-2020, 04:34 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by John Strenk View Post
They are and work with the low current draw from the LED.
But a relay is really low power and may not be enough to start it flashing.

Are you trying to do something like this

https://www.the12volt.com/relays/ill...-flash.asp#lf3

Why didn’t they tell you what one to use.
Your link is not working . . . They seemed to be out of any but I was asked to return Monday to get it dialed in correctly since the Electro-Magnetic one failed to perform.
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post #12 of 34 Old 08-01-2020, 04:51 PM Thread Starter
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This is the air horn set up. The bottom relay (below the 2) is the original relay for air horns and it gave NORMAL performance. Push the horn button at steering wheel and it would blow air horns; simple!

The TOP relay set-up is the newly added relays. One to alarm, other to air horn compressor relay. The yellow relay is the newly installed Electro-Magnetic relay. So yeah, I'm missing something here, lol.
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post #13 of 34 Old 08-01-2020, 06:41 PM
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Do you have it wired up something like one of these?
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post #14 of 34 Old 08-01-2020, 07:25 PM
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Flashers require resistance to get them to break contact and resume contact. Relays require milliamps to trigger them. Not enough resistance there to make the flasher work. You need an electronic flasher, available at any auto parts store. Find one with the same blade pattern as your existing flasher.
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post #15 of 34 Old 08-02-2020, 05:23 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by John Strenk View Post
Do you have it wired up something like one of these?
Yes, initial set-up is like your diagram. The difference now is the alarm addition and the air-horn connection.
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