1974 CJ5 AMC 304 - cold start stalling - Page 6 - JeepForum.com
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post #76 of 89 Old 05-04-2014, 07:40 PM
jammer1
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The red arm rides on a shaft. Picture putting a ring on a pencil. You can turn the ring on the pencil. The only difference is it may not turn completely around (something mighty hit the arm while turning, can't remember).

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post #77 of 89 Old 05-05-2014, 09:06 PM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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So, I didn't get the manual choke conversion kit. I decided to just try to repair the electronic choke and if it gives me more trouble, or if the same problem with cold start is still a problem, I'll convert to manual. Simply because the electronic choke is pretty new. I found the receipt for it in the Jeeps documentation (the PO gave all his receipts to me). So, I bought a replacement cam and it should come in Wednesday.

Anyway, I drove it this afternoon. It started up with no stalling. And at first it sounded great. But after it warmed up it was idling really high. Or, it sounded high to me. I don't have a tachometer on the Jeep. But it sounded way way higher than it was before. At the same time...I have no idea if the way it idled before is good or not. But that's my reference point.

So, it would seem that breaking the fast idle cam in the way I broke it means it is stuck on fast idle.

Otherwise, it ran great. It was just sitting at traffic lights and such that it didn't sound right.
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post #78 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 09:45 AM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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It's fixed!

The new fast idle cam came in the mail yesterday. I work from home a lot (an analyst...all computers and some teleconference) so I went out and put it on. Started right up. No stalling. Idling like a champ. Making the requisite popping noises from the exhaust (that my husband and son love) when letting off the throttle.

Now, I had a little trouble getting the bimetal spring in position and I started the engine a handful of times to check the response of the choke plate. So, it wasn't truly cold when I put the choke back together. But it's there. I'll just adjust it tomorrow if it needs it.

Thanks, everyone, for helping me figure out what was wrong and getting to know chokes.

I can tell you what happened.

At some point in the past the ball weight on the old fast idle cam broke off. Either the PO did it or it was like that when he got it. Does't matter. Someone tried to rig it up to work with no ball weight. My son calls it a MacGyverism but MacGyverisms are, by definition, successful. This one was not. Basically someone wrapped a bunch of metal wire around the broken end and secured it with electrical tape, hoping that would act as the ball weight. It might've worked, weight-wise, but the bulk of the wire and tape got in the way of the cam's travel. It stopped it before it could fully reach the top end. The result was that the choke plate wouldn't fully close.

Of course, when I was investigating the cam I broke it. But the plastic was "dry-rotted". I think the cam was probably pretty old and plastic gets very brittle with age and lots of heat exposure, which a cam will of course have. So, the cam basically crumbled.

After that I didn't have problems starting but it idled way high without relief.

This morning I installed the new cam and it idled the way it did before, only now it is no longer stalling.

The choke may need adjustment tomorrow or later this afternoon when it's cold but the issue seems to be resolved.

Thanks a lot, guys!
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post #79 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 09:57 AM
Matt1981CJ7
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Great to hear, Jen. I'm glad we could help.

Matt
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post #80 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 10:12 AM
Mike Romain
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Very cool. There is an adjustment for the choke cover. There should be an arrow on it with lines cast into the base of it. One longer line for center. Usually they set something like 2 lines rich from center. Rich is tighter.

To adjust when warmed up, just unplug the cap and the spring will unwind after a bit. Or wait...

You will want the fast idle screw when set on the closed choke position to be around 1750 rpm on a warmed up engine. You can see where the screw sits on the cam cold and off, so once warmed up the cam can be manually moved while manipulating the throttle back to that spot to set the rpm. The choke plate should stay open I think, most allow the fast idle cam to move by itself.

Mike
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post #81 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romain View Post
Very cool. There is an adjustment for the choke cover. There should be an arrow on it with lines cast into the base of it. One longer line for center. Usually they set something like 2 lines rich from center. Rich is tighter.

To adjust when warmed up, just unplug the cap and the spring will unwind after a bit. Or wait...

You will want the fast idle screw when set on the closed choke position to be around 1750 rpm on a warmed up engine. You can see where the screw sits on the cam cold and off, so once warmed up the cam can be manually moved while manipulating the throttle back to that spot to set the rpm. The choke plate should stay open I think, most allow the fast idle cam to move by itself.
Yes, there's basically a bunch of lines on the choke with the cap having one line. Right now it's right about center.

Now, I don't have tachometer so I don't know what my RPMs are except to be able to hear them go up or down.

Is there another way to measure RPMs?
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post #82 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 11:37 AM
Mike Romain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post

Yes, there's basically a bunch of lines on the choke with the cap having one line. Right now it's right about center.

Now, I don't have tachometer so I don't know what my RPMs are except to be able to hear them go up or down.

Is there another way to measure RPMs?
Not really. You just want it to be considerably higher than base idle. Someone posted a video a while back of fast idle sound. Mine has a fixed fan and just roars at 1750. My highway cruise rpm is about 2300 to give you an idea.

Maybe someone else with that carb can give you the screw turns in from touching?

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG AT's, 'glass nose to tail in '00, 'New' frame,wires and plumbing in '09. Carter BBD Carbed 4.0 HO in '10.
89 YJ Renegade. BBD Carbed 4.0 HO. Locked front and rear with 33x9.5 BFG AT's
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post #83 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 12:18 PM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romain View Post
Not really. You just want it to be considerably higher than base idle. Someone posted a video a while back of fast idle sound. Mine has a fixed fan and just roars at 1750. My highway cruise rpm is about 2300 to give you an idea.

Maybe someone else with that carb can give you the screw turns in from touching?

There's this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrEvgnruM9g

Mine sounds kind of like that...it's louder because of the headers on it but the idle sounds similar.
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post #84 of 89 Old 05-08-2014, 08:54 PM
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If you did not touch the fast idle screw (turn it in or out) just try starting it when cold and let it run. If you do this a few times and are happy with the fast idle you're all set . You will just have to turn the black cap to get a setting that you like (for how fast the choke turns off). When cold loosen the screws and turn the cap. When you get more resistance to turning and the choke plate closes you are setting the choke to run longer. It's trial and error. If the choke turns off before engine is warmed up enough, turn the cap to the next line (tighter resistance), if the choke was on too long (engine racing cause of fast idle screw when warm enough to run without choke), turn the cap one line in the opposite direction (less resistance).
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post #85 of 89 Old 05-09-2014, 01:56 AM
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Jen,

If you plan to continue to work on your CJ's engine, I'd highly recommend purchasing the following tools:

1. A quality digital timing light with a tach feature.
2. A vacuum/pressure gauge
3. An electrical test light.
4. A multi-meter.

With these 4 tools, you can diagnose virtually any engine-related problem, and keep it tuned.

Matt
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post #86 of 89 Old 05-09-2014, 08:42 PM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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Thanks, both jammer1 and Matt!

I can tell you I need to up the idle a little. When completely cold it's idling reeeeeeaaaaaalll low and stalls. I'll give the idle screw a half turn and test it.

Matt, I already have the multimeter. I used it to help me figure out I blew the ignition coil.

If you have recommendations for brands for the other tools I'll get them. I always love new tools.

And, yes, I plan on maintaining the Jeep myself. I think it'll be fun!
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post #87 of 89 Old 05-11-2014, 05:58 AM
Mike Romain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post
I can tell you I need to up the idle a little. When completely cold it's idling reeeeeeaaaaaalll low and stalls. I'll give the idle screw a half turn and test it.
Remember there are 2 idle screws, one for warm running and the other for the choke fast idle. You want it to roar pretty good on fast idle.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG AT's, 'glass nose to tail in '00, 'New' frame,wires and plumbing in '09. Carter BBD Carbed 4.0 HO in '10.
89 YJ Renegade. BBD Carbed 4.0 HO. Locked front and rear with 33x9.5 BFG AT's
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post #88 of 89 Old 05-11-2014, 03:28 PM Thread Starter
sabbyATL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romain View Post
Remember there are 2 idle screws, one for warm running and the other for the choke fast idle. You want it to roar pretty good on fast idle.
Ah, did not know that. I only adjusted the one next to the fast idle cam.

What do you mean by roar on fast idle?
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post #89 of 89 Old 05-11-2014, 07:13 PM
Mike Romain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sabbyATL View Post

Ah, did not know that. I only adjusted the one next to the fast idle cam.

What do you mean by roar on fast idle?
At least twice the speed of warmed up idle.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG AT's, 'glass nose to tail in '00, 'New' frame,wires and plumbing in '09. Carter BBD Carbed 4.0 HO in '10.
89 YJ Renegade. BBD Carbed 4.0 HO. Locked front and rear with 33x9.5 BFG AT's
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