Transmission troubleshooting 545RFE+Hemi - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 01:32 AM Thread Starter
Windexer
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Transmission troubleshooting 545RFE+Hemi

Sorry for the long post but providing detail both to see if anyone has had something similar and also so that if someone in the future has similar issues my troubleshooting might help them along the way. I've had some odd behavior with my transmission on the highway for some time where I've had to trick it to change into 5th gear (by setting cruise control at my desired speed then accelerating another 2-3 MPH and releasing the throttle to make it see very low load) when cruising at 60/68MPH but other than this trick it had seemed to run fine. Its been used for a lot of offroad trips and always held up well without any issues when in 4LO.

Key details
  • 2005 Hemi with 135,000 miles on it
  • Transmission serviced and pressure sensor replaced @ 128,232 miles
  • Superchips Flashpaq tuned for the past ~6,000 miles

Started up after about a week of sitting. Reversed out of carport and then went to head up my drive but drive wouldnt engage so rolled back. Hit the breaks and left it in park for a bit to see if it would engage after that but no luck, extra revs and it threw itself into limp mode (3'rd gear). Checked the fluid and there was some there and no massive gushing leak so was confident that it wasnt running on zero fluid. Managed to reverse up driveway and parked and pulled the following codes.
  • P0700: Transmission Control System (MIL Request)
  • P0107: Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Sensor Circuit Low
  • P0731: Gear 1 Incorrect Ratio
  • P0876: UD Pressure Switch Rationality

The MAP sensor one pops up a bit, I've replaced it and it still seems to surface about once a month but I clear it and happy days afterwards.

Cleared the codes and took it for a drive to heat the fluid up so I could get a better read on the fluid levels, seemed to drive fine on a mix of mid to low speed roads for about 10 minutes, no major inclines were involved here. Checked the fluid while it was running and seemed quite low so went and bought some more ATF4+ for it and put about 1L in and she was reading in the area for hot temp. Thinking that was all it was I headed out later that day to hit some tracks, and the same issue started to surface when I was climbing hills, the transmission appeared to slip a bit then catch (almost like it was sucking some air then getting fluid again). Gave up and limped into camp and checked fluid again and pulled the following codes again:

Same
  • P0700: Transmission Control System (MIL Request)
  • P0107: Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Sensor Circuit Low
  • P0731: Gear 1 Incorrect Ratio
  • P0876: UD Pressure Switch Rationality

New
  • P1790 Fault immediately after shift
  • P0869 Transmission fluid pressure high
  • P0932 Hydraulic pressure sensor circuit

Next day was still getting the same slipping behavior in 1st gear but beyond that she was driveable so drove the 2 hours home without major issue, other than some minor slipping when doing low speed stuff through towns (traffic lights and such).

After some reading I think I'll start with looking at the wiring for anything totally obvious but seems unlikely due to just appearing out of the blue but worth a shot, then I'll drop the pan and look at the filters as there are a few reports of the filters splitting and sucking air causing similar issues.


2005 WK Limited Hemi, 2" OME lift, header back exhaust, 245/75/R17 MT, Superchips tuned, Roof rack
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post #2 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 08:42 AM
90grandoneer
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Sounds like you're covering most of the bases. A couple things I'd look at are, first, remove the Superchips tune from the vehicle to insure something in their programming of the transmission is not at fault. Reason to do this first.....it's quick and easy. More likely to be the cause.....you said it was serviced a while back. Are you ABSOLUTELY sure the main filter is installed correctly? Incorrect installation can sometimes cause all kinds of weird stuff to happen. From the FSM, here's the correct procedure for the installation.

INSTALLATION
CAUTION: The primary oil filter seal MUST be fully
installed flush against the oil pump body. DO NOT
install the seal onto the filter neck and attempt to
install the filter and seal as an assembly. Damage
to the transmission will result.

1. If necessary, install a new primary oil filter seal in
the oil pump inlet bore. Seat the seal in the bore
with a suitable tool (appropriately sized drift or
socket, the butt end of a hammer, or other suitable
tool).
2. Place replacement filter in position on valve body
and into the oil pump.
3. Install screw to hold the primary oil filter (1) to
valve body. Tighten screw to 4.5 Nm (40 in. lbs.)
torque.
4. Install new cooler return filter (2) onto the transmission, if necessary. Torque the filter to 9.5 Nm (7 ft.lbs.).
5. Place bead of MoparT RTV sealant onto the transmission case sealing surface.
6. Place pan in position on transmission.
7. Install bolts to hold pan to transmission. Tighten bolts to 12 Nm (105 in. lbs.) torque.
8. Lower vehicle and fill transmission with MoparT ATF +4.

06 GCO, Dk Khaki, QDII, Flshing Hi 3rd Bk Lt, MDS "ON" Lt, Airtab Vortex Gens, Debadged, Fumoto Drain Valve, BT Catch Can, Chopped EGR Tube, SRT8 CAI, AFE Air Filter, Sonnax Trans Line Press Booster, SC Tuner W/Adv Trans Tune App, DS and HP tuners, Transgo Shift Kit, ARH Long Tube Hdrs w/3 in Magnaflow/Xlerator AP Exh Sys, Bilsteins, SRT Springs/Sways, Cust Eng Cvr, SRT8 frt/rear bumpers, FRI Sidewinder Cam w/6* advance/6.1 valvetrain, SLP 25% UD Pulley, BBK true 90mm T-Body, SOS Ign Coils w/.060 spark plug gaps, TEA ported/milled heads w/new valve seats, SRT Reps with 265/45&295/40X20's. Also 05 Hemi LX modded exactly like WK and Comp Cammed 06 300CSRT8.
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post #3 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 02:06 PM
Walt
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Windexer: addressing only the MAP sensor:

If you have a vacuum gauge, pull an intake manifold connection (or tee into an existing connection) and install the gauge to see how the pressure is doing. Vacuum gauge reading should be steady and deep (low absolute pressure) at idle. Manifold pressure decreases as the throttle plate opens. A pulsating or fluctuating gauge is symptomatic of other mechanical issues. You might have 12-13 psia at idle (~620 rpm) and 8-10 psia at 2,000 rpm. Also, check the intake manifold mounting bolts and any hose connections to verify there is no air in-leakage.

IIRC, 90grandoneer once mentioned that the latest production run MAP sensors required some sort of physical modification to fit into '05-'06 HEMI's. What do you know about yours and how it was installed? 90grandoneer: Does my memory serve me correctly?

Once all of this proves acceptable, it becomes an electrical/electronic issue and the real fun begins....

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'08 WK GC Limited. 5.7L HEMI. Quadra-Trac II. Bright Silver Metallic. Class IV hitch.
Michelin LTX M/S tires. Fumoto oil drain valve. Billet Technology oil catch can.
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post #4 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post
Windexer: addressing only the MAP sensor:

If you have a vacuum gauge, pull an intake manifold connection (or tee into an existing connection) and install the gauge to see how the pressure is doing. Vacuum gauge reading should be steady and deep (low absolute pressure) at idle. Manifold pressure decreases as the throttle plate opens. A pulsating or fluctuating gauge is symptomatic of other mechanical issues. You might have 12-13 psia at idle (~620 rpm) and 8-10 psia at 2,000 rpm. Also, check the intake manifold mounting bolts and any hose connections to verify there is no air in-leakage.

IIRC, 90grandoneer once mentioned that the latest production run MAP sensors required some sort of physical modification to fit into '05-'06 HEMI's. What do you know about yours and how it was installed? 90grandoneer: Does my memory serve me correctly?

Once all of this proves acceptable, it becomes an electrical/electronic issue and the real fun begins....
This is, for the most part, true. I understand you can still find New Old Stock originals around, but all the newer ones are the later type and require a couple mods to fit in place. The gusset on the intake manifold by the MAP Sensor needs to be broken/cut off and the mounting tab on the MAP Sensor also needs to be cut off. Then everything will fit fine. IIRC, the newer ones are also slightly larger in size.

06 GCO, Dk Khaki, QDII, Flshing Hi 3rd Bk Lt, MDS "ON" Lt, Airtab Vortex Gens, Debadged, Fumoto Drain Valve, BT Catch Can, Chopped EGR Tube, SRT8 CAI, AFE Air Filter, Sonnax Trans Line Press Booster, SC Tuner W/Adv Trans Tune App, DS and HP tuners, Transgo Shift Kit, ARH Long Tube Hdrs w/3 in Magnaflow/Xlerator AP Exh Sys, Bilsteins, SRT Springs/Sways, Cust Eng Cvr, SRT8 frt/rear bumpers, FRI Sidewinder Cam w/6* advance/6.1 valvetrain, SLP 25% UD Pulley, BBK true 90mm T-Body, SOS Ign Coils w/.060 spark plug gaps, TEA ported/milled heads w/new valve seats, SRT Reps with 265/45&295/40X20's. Also 05 Hemi LX modded exactly like WK and Comp Cammed 06 300CSRT8.
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post #5 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 05:16 PM Thread Starter
Windexer
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You boys are legends and thanks for the replies and your continued contribution to this forum!

90grandoneer - Great minds think alike, yesterday I spent some time removing the tune to see if the same issue occurred, fortunately I can reproduce on my driveway, the issue still occurred but it didn't throw a code which I suspect might be more to do with me not pushing it rather than the Superchips but that's still a guess so I'll test more today.
I stupidly had a shop do the transmission filter (at my old place didn't have room to drop a pan and contain the mess) I'd been doing some reading on here and other forums and found the cases of split filters and even ones unscrewing over time.

Walt - Yeah I've got the MAP sensor which required some alterations of the mounts (found a hot screw driver was the best method to get a clean 'cut'). I'll have to hook a vacuum gauge up and investigate it as it seems to consistently pop up. Are the MAP sensors one of the parts you should steer towards the MOPAR original or just go for a quality unit?

Something I forgot to include but came to me last night was that I was sometimes (past 6 months) getting what felt like a lock and unlock of the torque converter when at 60 MPH, I am not sure if it was MDS or the torque converter unlocking but did give a very slight surge.

2005 WK Limited Hemi, 2" OME lift, header back exhaust, 245/75/R17 MT, Superchips tuned, Roof rack
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post #6 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 05:56 PM
Walt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windexer View Post
...Yeah I've got the MAP sensor which required some alterations of the mounts (found a hot screw driver was the best method to get a clean 'cut'). I'll have to hook a vacuum gauge up and investigate it as it seems to consistently pop up. Are the MAP sensors one of the parts you should steer towards the MOPAR original or just go for a quality unit?

Something I forgot to include but came to me last night was that I was sometimes (past 6 months) getting what felt like a lock and unlock of the torque converter when at 60 MPH, I am not sure if it was MDS or the torque converter unlocking but did give a very slight surge.
Thanks for again posting the details of the physical modifications you made on the MAP sensor (for the benefit of new-to-them WK owners on this forum).

Have not heard anything negative about aftermarket MAP sensors (if they are available), but my tendency is to use MOPAR for this sensor because of where it is located on the 5.7L HEMI and the PITA factor if I have to do it twice ().

I know that the PCM will lock and unlock the xmission torque converter and MDS for optimum performance at the 55-65 mph range. Involves the engine load sensed by the electronics. Not like the older xmissions that basically just locked up above 45 mph for fuel economy. My daily commute involves 55-60 mph on flat ground (almost no stopping).
I see the rpm's go up and down (about 50 rpm) as minor load changes occur.

Interesting topic.....if you would be so kind as to keep us informed.

HEMI CLUB MEMBER #45; SILVER WK CLUB MEMBER #13
'08 WK GC Limited. 5.7L HEMI. Quadra-Trac II. Bright Silver Metallic. Class IV hitch.
Michelin LTX M/S tires. Fumoto oil drain valve. Billet Technology oil catch can.
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post #7 of 30 Old 04-26-2019, 08:29 PM
90grandoneer
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I also normally use Mopar MAP Sensors, but I just recently installed an NTK one from RockAuto on my 300C SRT8 and it seems to work just fine.....so far. The one on the 6.1 is a little different and is a screw on....two little bolts. Much easier than the 5.7's.

06 GCO, Dk Khaki, QDII, Flshing Hi 3rd Bk Lt, MDS "ON" Lt, Airtab Vortex Gens, Debadged, Fumoto Drain Valve, BT Catch Can, Chopped EGR Tube, SRT8 CAI, AFE Air Filter, Sonnax Trans Line Press Booster, SC Tuner W/Adv Trans Tune App, DS and HP tuners, Transgo Shift Kit, ARH Long Tube Hdrs w/3 in Magnaflow/Xlerator AP Exh Sys, Bilsteins, SRT Springs/Sways, Cust Eng Cvr, SRT8 frt/rear bumpers, FRI Sidewinder Cam w/6* advance/6.1 valvetrain, SLP 25% UD Pulley, BBK true 90mm T-Body, SOS Ign Coils w/.060 spark plug gaps, TEA ported/milled heads w/new valve seats, SRT Reps with 265/45&295/40X20's. Also 05 Hemi LX modded exactly like WK and Comp Cammed 06 300CSRT8.
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post #8 of 30 Old 04-27-2019, 12:01 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the confirmation, I might try a MOPAR one when I put my next order in at RockAuto as the prices over here in Aus are eye watering!

Well did some more testing this morning without the tune in place and my "High pressure" code is gone but still getting the below ones so I am suspecting there is something physical at play here, it had another case of the MAP sensor making its way to stored (beyond a pending code) which is always fun.

P0700: Transmission Control System (MIL Request)
P0107: Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Sensor Circuit Low
P0731: Gear 1 Incorrect Ratio
P0876: UD Pressure Switch Rationality

I think I need to drop the pan (can see that somewhere in the cars life someone has stripped and retapped the front two bolts) to see what I can find, fortunately I have a second car to get around so I can do runs to the part store as needed. I think I'll order a filter kit today as finding it hard to get genuine over here.

2005 WK Limited Hemi, 2" OME lift, header back exhaust, 245/75/R17 MT, Superchips tuned, Roof rack
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post #9 of 30 Old 04-27-2019, 03:15 AM Thread Starter
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Dropped the pan and found I was the lucky recipient of a split filter! Pics below to paint the full picture.

Seems that at some stage the front bolts have been enlarged or perhaps thats from from factory. Pan magnet didn't have metal in it but the pan did seem to have a bit of clutch material to it and the fluid smelt a bit burnt to me (far from a expert). I am hoping that this is my fix but seems that its been like that for awhile so I'll be crossing my fingers.
Attached Thumbnails
pan_magnet.jpg   grime2.jpg   grime.jpg   filter_split2.jpg   filter_split1.jpg  

filter_draining.jpg   filter_bolts.jpg   burnt_fluid.jpg  

2005 WK Limited Hemi, 2" OME lift, header back exhaust, 245/75/R17 MT, Superchips tuned, Roof rack

Last edited by Windexer; 04-27-2019 at 03:36 AM. Reason: Post clean up
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post #10 of 30 Old 05-09-2019, 01:24 AM Thread Starter
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Update both of the filters I removed were non-genuine so time will tell if the new ones are any better, went with the newest revision of Mopar ones I could find and they both installed fine, the only external difference was the snout of the new screw on filter was a little shorter (maybe 10 mm) but it's still engaged fine and I screwed it down to the required level.

Part numbers for those interested:
5013470AE - pan filter
5179267AD - spin on filter

Importantly after filling it back up (reused the cork pan gasket) the issue appears to be gone!

Still trying to get the right fluid level as I just cant seem to get it up to the right level when hot but we'll get there, testing on the driveway has been fine and no issues after a few laps of the neighborhood. I'll keep trying to get the fluid level right and will be watching it closely but it appears to be normal again other than the engagement on first startup (might be a valve body thing). I'll reapply the tune soon as I forgot how bad the electric throttle is without it!

2005 WK Limited Hemi, 2" OME lift, header back exhaust, 245/75/R17 MT, Superchips tuned, Roof rack
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post #11 of 30 Old 05-09-2019, 07:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windexer View Post
...Still trying to get the right fluid level as I just cant seem to get it up to the right level when hot but we'll get there, testing on the driveway has been fine and no issues after a few laps of the neighborhood. I'll keep trying to get the fluid level right and will be watching it closely but it appears to be normal again other than the engagement on first startup (might be a valve body thing)....
FWIW, I find that the drive train does not "settle in" until I drive >1/2 hr at highway speeds. Now, I only check the xmission fluid level after a drive like that, when I am sure the heat soak has occurred for all components. Probably just me being anal about these electro-mechanical component parts and the way the electronic sensors perceive the world around them.

To ensure the torque converter gets refilled on first startup of the morning, I wait until the airbag light goes out (as a timer) before I shift into reverse to back out.

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post #12 of 30 Old 05-09-2019, 10:06 AM
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Reading through this from the top I was about to say drop your pan and check for a split filter immediately.. I killed a tranny with an aftermarket filter...

Glad you got it figured out..

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post #13 of 30 Old 05-09-2019, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raffish View Post
... I killed a tranny with an aftermarket filter.....
Something I heard a long time ago:

The excitement of a low price lasts a little while.......but the disappointment of poor quality lasts forever. - Anonymous.

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post #14 of 30 Old 05-09-2019, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Windexer View Post
Dropped the pan and found I was the lucky recipient of a split filter! Pics below to paint the full picture.

Seems that at some stage the front bolts have been enlarged or perhaps thats from from factory. Pan magnet didn't have metal in it but the pan did seem to have a bit of clutch material to it and the fluid smelt a bit burnt to me (far from a expert). I am hoping that this is my fix but seems that its been like that for awhile so I'll be crossing my fingers.
The first time I did mine I installed a transmission pan that had a drain plug. I still need to remove the pan to replace the filters but the drain plug makes it a little less messy.
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post #15 of 30 Old 05-10-2019, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
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The first time I did mine I installed a transmission pan that had a drain plug. I still need to remove the pan to replace the filters but the drain plug makes it a little less messy.
I did look at them as they are a great option but the shipping was a little pricey out to Aus so I'll have to stick with with my ATF baths

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