Long term cost/reliability of QD II versus QT II with BTCS ?? - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 18 Old 04-03-2015, 08:37 AM Thread Starter
Char
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Long term cost/reliability of QD II versus QT II with BTCS ??

I am looking to purchase either a low mileage 2005 WK with QD II or one of several cheaper and more readily available 2006s ( Laredos) with QT II and BTCS.
From all the advice and videos I am confident QT II with BTCS will meet my needs for traction and off-road fishing trips.
I am wondering if anyone has an opinion on whether or not the BTCS approach in QT II is cheaper and easier to maintain in the long run ( given only 10% off road and moderate off road use at that) than the ELSDs in QD II.
I am wondering if BTCS maintenance is largely just ABS component maintenance,which is needed anyway?
What breaks and what is expensive to repair?
Many thanks

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post #2 of 18 Old 04-04-2015, 01:49 PM
oldsmoke
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Good question. When did Jeep come out with QDll ? I had the feeling that it originated on the XK and WK series? I have not seen any threads thus far in JeepForum concerning problems with the front or rear lockers so I would assume it is a fairly robust system. I don't think there is another 4x4 system from any other manufacturer that can touch it.

I have the QTll and have found it to be adequate for the small amount of offroading I do but I think if you are buying used you can probably get into QDll for the same money as you would pay for a QTll so why not go with the superiour system?

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post #3 of 18 Old 04-04-2015, 03:39 PM
yzjwk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Char View Post
I am looking to purchase either a low mileage 2005 WK with QD II or one of several cheaper and more readily available 2006s ( Laredos) with QT II and BTCS.
From all the advice and videos I am confident QT II with BTCS will meet my needs for traction and off-road fishing trips.
I am wondering if anyone has an opinion on whether or not the BTCS approach in QT II is cheaper and easier to maintain in the long run ( given only 10% off road and moderate off road use at that) than the ELSDs in QD II.
I am wondering if BTCS maintenance is largely just ABS component maintenance,which is needed anyway?
What breaks and what is expensive to repair?
Many thanks
Even Qd ll uses the btcs so there is NO difference there . There has been some issues with the elsd solenoids going bad , but its a cheap part that is easily changeable.
The only mtce item that people forget is the Mopar LSD additive at $10 /bottle.
Trust me when I say that you will not just notice the difference on the trails. Having both qt ll in my wj and qd ll in my wk , there is a noticeable difference in winter especially with the hemi pushing it. You can almost feel the lockers kicking in.
And for what it it's worth I haven't heard of a single elsd failure on this site.
Good luck

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94 ZJ Ltd 5.2 ,00 WJ 4.0
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post #4 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 02:33 PM
Tango.
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If there is a problem with the QDii clutches then it will be a more expensive to rebuild a limited slip. I have only heard of one QDii going out on here. I would go with the Jeep that was best taken care of.

Life is hard-John Wayne
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post #5 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 04:31 PM Thread Starter
Char
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Thanks for the advice and a related question - is there EVER QD II on a Loredo?

Thanks for the advice.
Looking for a good used QD II in my pensioner's price range is tough.
However I can wait a week or two more but my old reliable 1992 Cherokee is giving up, after 350000 KMs ( about 220000 miles)
The sellers here know nothing about their machines.
Just getting them to tell me if it is a QT II or QD II is impossible.
So here are a couple of things I think I know about 2005 2006 WK model options ( putting Overland aside ) and some questions:
(1) I think Loredos can NEVER have QD II - Is that right?
(2) I think all WKs with the 5.7 Hemi ALWAYS have the QD II. - Is that right?
(3) I think that Limited with the 4.7 in 2005 NEVER have QD II but in 2006 it is possible - Is that right?
(4) Conclusion is that the sure way to get QD II is to get the Hemi and if you have the Hemi you've got QD II !! - Correct?

Now is the hemi less reliable and more costly for long term high mileage than the 4.7 ?

All the above assumptions come from looking at ads but also mainly the brochures that the forum put me on to:
http://www.wkjeeps.com/brochures/2005_WK_Brochure.pdf
http://www.wkjeeps.com/brochures/2006_WK_Brochure.pdf

Thanks again and looking for your advice on the above questions.
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post #6 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 05:20 PM
johngreen1234
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1. Dunno.
2. NOT correct.
3. Dunno.
4. NOT correct.

I have a 2010 Laredo w/Hemi and QT2. 2010 is the only year the WK Laredo was available w/Hemi. I do a LOT of winter snow/ice highway driving and I feel that QT2 works quite well. I have NOT tried QD2 on snow/ice highway driving. IMO, QT2 feels similar to the unlocked 4 HI on my ZJ, which I always preferred at speed to the locked 4HI.

As for the Hemi, you should make an effort to find one if you can afford it. Gas mileage is similar to the smaller engines and reliability is as good or better. 4.7 has many happy owners who use their gas pedals also. The small 3.7 engine is value-priced but I have not read many other strong recommendations of it.

ALSO: QT2 has a 10-bolt rear diff cover, qd2 has a 12-bolt rear diff cover, ALWAYS. If you can see a pic of the diff you can compare it to google images of 10- and 12-bolt chrysler diffs. Good luck!
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post #7 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 05:30 PM
craigbru
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My 4.7 2007 WK has QDII for what it's worth. It's not that they can't have it, but it's rare.

Jeep-Core
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post #8 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 08:02 PM Thread Starter
Char
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Great advice - Jeep seems to have changed option packages on a year by year basis

First thanks to all of you for the input and insight.

johngreen1234 - very useful insight on the QT II in the snow - encouraging!
What some posts elsewhere and above indicated made me think that in high torque situations, like climbing a dusty steep trail to a lake with smooth bedrock and dust pockets, the QT II may have difficulty while the QD II may beat it since it can put 100 % to any one wheel as needed, and does not essentially drag the slipping wheels along. Thus maybe QD II has the edge in high torque situations over the QT II. I would guess that QT II's maximum torque delivered to the non-slipping wheel on an axle is equal to or less than the braking torque of the BTCS on the same axle??? This is less than the engine torque for sure so QT II must I guess deliver less torque and more drag in these situations

Snow situation is key to me so I appreciate your comments To me snow hills are probably lower torque hills since any drive is doomed if all four wheels are on low traction and the incline is too great. For sure , I have messed up in snow here in Canada often enough in my old '92! But my serious off-roading is on a Polaris 700 twin Quad, so I guess QT II meets my needs since I really don't go into those high torque climbs? When doing fun offroading it seems on youtube a Jeep can beat a quad, but for functional use in the woods etc a quad beats a Jeep, in my situations. The Jeep tows the Quad in on a trailer!

2010WK: I think I was a bit messy in my post so sorry about that. I prefaced the whole set of questions with a limitation to 2005/06 WKs as there is no way I can afford any newer. But your comments on newer models is interesting and helpful.

Just looking at the brochures, I still maintain I have read them correctly and I ask you2010WK to please confirm you are still confident in your yes no assessment of my 2005/06 statements please.

For example, I note in 2007, like craigbru pointed out, Jeep again completely switched up their options table taking QD II off of the 5.7 Hemi package and making it a separate option and making QD II available down to the Loredo!
http://www.wkjeeps.com/brochures/2007_wk_brochure.pdf

So guys, maybe its a who knows situation but ...

Craigbru may have really hit the nail on the head there with his comment:
"ALSO: QT2 has a 10-bolt rear diff cover, qd2 has a 12-bolt rear diff cover, ALWAYS. If you can see a pic of the diff you can compare it to google images of 10- and 12-bolt chrysler diffs. Good luck!"

That may just be the kicker here! ... or I back off and get QT II which is a great system and one I can afford.

Regards
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post #9 of 18 Old 04-06-2015, 09:00 PM
PTee
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It's that simple to find out. 10 bolts QT2. 12 bolts QD2.
If your are going to be just driving off road, trails, snow, mud, QT2 is plenty good. If you are going to be wheeling off-road, rocky trails, maybe need a spotter, then you should hold out for the better QD2.

2010 WK North Edition 5.7 Hemi, QT2, loaded Black WK #102
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post #10 of 18 Old 04-21-2015, 05:49 AM
unobtanium
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I bought QD2, and did so for snow. It snowed here a couple months ago, and I was NOT disappointed.

Traded the '10 WK w/Hemi and QD2 in on 5/15/15 for a '15 mazda CX-5 2.5L AWD Touring. Happier!
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post #11 of 18 Old 04-21-2015, 07:49 PM
92JEEPWRANGLERY
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I have, no wait, My wife has a 05 Hemi QDII and it snowed about 8" here in February(which is rare) and of course I was out playing in my 92 YJ and had no problems. We then took my wifes GC out and I could not believe the difference. While my YJ has a front locker and mud tires and I could go anywhere I wanted in the snow, the GC on Firestone Destination LE tires was almost like it was on dry pavement! I know that it is full of electronics and sensors but the QDII really does what it's supposed to. It would be easy to catch yourself running too fast for conditions as stable as the QDII makes it feel. I couldn't be more impressed with it in the snow.
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post #12 of 18 Old 04-23-2015, 06:11 AM
mkmk
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I have a 2006 Limited 4.7 with QDII, so they rxist. Love, love, love it in heavy snow. Never driven a QTII (in muck, anyway).
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post #13 of 18 Old 04-24-2015, 01:22 PM
msully725
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 92JEEPWRANGLERY View Post
It would be easy to catch yourself running too fast for conditions as stable as the QDII makes it feel. I couldn't be more impressed with it in the snow.
Happens all the time. QDII rocks.
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post #14 of 18 Old 04-24-2015, 08:26 PM
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I have an 05 4.7 QTII and was very impressed this winter in NY, never had a problem. I even tried to swing the back end out a little here and there, and was almost not able to. Granted I had brand new General Grabber AT2s, but if QDII is that much more superior, I can only imagine how fantastic that system is. Overall I'm very happy with this engine/drivetrain combo. In hindsight though I would have held out for a HEMI QDII had I known the varying options when I bought this one. Just my .02

05 WK 4.7L V8 QTII, RC 2", Rustys rear springs, 1.25" spacers, GG AT2 265/70/17, Bilsteins, Superchips, custom shackle mounts, bedlined Rola rack, bedlined grill mod, KC's
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post #15 of 18 Old 04-24-2015, 09:34 PM
Chirpz
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I have an O7 Larado CRD and it has the QDII.

Forget about all the "Always" and "Never" statements and just look at the rear differential using the 10 or 12 rule. As far as which is better, 12 rules!!
I have talked to several dealers that don't know the difference.

You will usually see the letters QDII somewhere on the shifter console.... at least it is there on mine.... but best to look at the diff.

Dumb Story.... I got used to the carefree sure footed feel of my QDII.
Last winter when it snowed about 10 inches I decided to jump in my old 91 XJ and go to the store. I levered it into 4x4 high and took off down the street. I love to drive in snow. I zipped around the first corner and spun out right into the ditch.... never did that before....but I was so used the the QDII that I sort of forgot that the XJ just ain't the same...with it you have to be a tiny bit cautious in the snow. My ego was crushed but the Jeep was OK. It was snow, not ice, not plowed, and I have new tires.... I just got over confident and goosed it a tiny bit. This would never happen with the QDII.

On the other hand... I've had the QDII since 08 and it has never spun a tire. One day I had to back up hill pushing a 4000 pound trailer on a well packed gravel road. Never spun a tire... it just pushed that trailer like it was nothing. When you drive in sloppy stuff, you can feel the power shifting from tire to tire as wheels begin to loose their traction...but they never seem to spin free. I guess you can get them to spin free but I'm not a hot dog throttle stomper and for me it is just smooth power all the time.

If you can find one that fits your money bag, you won't regret it.

Chirpz
2007 WK CRD, Quadradrive II, OEM Tow Hitch, GDE EcoTune, DPF-Delete, 4xGuard Front, Rear, Belly Guards, Side Rails & Full Matrix, OEM Skids, EHM, Dash Duck.
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