Goliath Offroad Roof Rack Review - Page 2 - JeepForum.com
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post #16 of 32 Old 11-09-2019, 04:18 PM Thread Starter
KUJeeper82
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Going on tomorrow once my buddy is back in town, the basket was too heavy for my wife to help me get up. :^)

Will only be a test fit until I resolve my mounting bolt issue on the driver rear. I going to need to cut those bolts off and then shift some cabin wire harness and some sort of cylindrical doohickey from under one of the captive nuts to rig up something different. Here's some pics with the three brackets installed and one with the stripped bolts.

You can see some gap between the bottoms of the brackets and the roof metal, but I'm not sure if that is typical of these vehicles. The captive nuts on my jeep all seem to be popped up and at slightly different pitches to each other. I'm thinking once the basket is up there everything will flatten out. I intend to use rubber sheeting underneath regardless. 3/8"" thick so may just cut out holes large enough for the captive bolts to stick up into, eliminating the gap.

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post #17 of 32 Old 11-10-2019, 11:45 AM Thread Starter
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Installed today. Fit and function were Perfect. Thanks for making a great product Greg! The brackets he fabricated were well thought out and pitched correctly for the rack to sit right.

Regarding the quality of Chrysler Products however, I think they really cut some corners on the roof rack mounting points.

The captive nuts these jeep have installed at the factory are crap fellas. They are little more than RIVETS held in place to the roof sheet metal with epoxy and a thin edge of metal... I cut the first free sprinning head of with a dremal then noticed the rivet pulling up through the sheet metal... popped the whole thing out with a flat head screw driver!

I'm going to add a strip of reinforcing metal under the front two brackets and drill 2-3 new holes through my jeeps roof to reinforce the front of the rack against wind effects. Additionally, I think a wind deflector will be necessary and will work on making something with aluminum black diamond plate.

I think that a wind deflector is one area that the prototype could be enhanced by Greg's guys at Goliath. That, and maybe some reinforcement plates with welded on nuts you could replace the craptastic factory hardware with.

Also, hooray for Gorilla Tape!
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post #18 of 32 Old 11-10-2019, 10:54 PM
jeeptorino68
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Will the sunroof still function?

Kyle
92 XJ 4.0 HO,AW4, NP242, 30" BFG AT, 1.75 spacer and ZJ coils, double cherokee leaf pack and 2 inch rough country shackles, 2.5 inch dnynomax exhaust, magnaflow cat, front hooks & rear hitch, gas skid, front skid, warn t-case skid, 99+ intake, bored TB

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post #19 of 32 Old 11-11-2019, 04:24 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jeeptorino68 View Post
Will the sunroof still function?
Well, it will open and you'll get some airflow, but no sunlight.

Other manufactures make a removable section of decking over the sunroof, but I didn't request that on this because my sunroof leaks and I have the buttons to open it removed to install my CB radio in the overhead console slot. Not sure if I'm going to fix it honestly.
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post #20 of 32 Old 11-11-2019, 03:58 PM
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Off topic: 99% of sunroof leaks on these are plugged drains. Blowing out the front drain tubes and replacing the rear drain tubes will fix almost all WK sunroof leaks. There rear drain tubes run down directly behind the rear doors. After they are run, the cavity is filled with spray foam and the foam constricts the line to where some blockages cannot be cleared. They sold a kit when I worked for Jeep that had new drain lines and a plug for the line to go through after drilling a new hole in the wheel well.

On topic: Does it ONLY use the factory mount holes? I feel like your pulled out nutserts were always the problem with the factory side rails being overloaded. Especially for the weight of the rack itself before its loaded up with stuff. As far as the space between the bracket and the rig. That is normal. There is enough structural support added by rigidly fixing the mount bracket to the rack that the lateral forces wont roll the bracket. Just that vertical force to be worried about.
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post #21 of 32 Old 11-13-2019, 12:50 PM
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I chased a sunroof leak for years. Finally took out the headliner and ran a garden hose. It was the windshield.
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post #22 of 32 Old 11-14-2019, 06:06 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by 2005JGC View Post
Off topic: 99% of sunroof leaks on these are plugged drains. Blowing out the front drain tubes and replacing the rear drain tubes will fix almost all WK sunroof leaks. There rear drain tubes run down directly behind the rear doors. After they are run, the cavity is filled with spray foam and the foam constricts the line to where some blockages cannot be cleared. They sold a kit when I worked for Jeep that had new drain lines and a plug for the line to go through after drilling a new hole in the wheel well.

On topic: Does it ONLY use the factory mount holes? I feel like your pulled out nutserts were always the problem with the factory side rails being overloaded. Especially for the weight of the rack itself before its loaded up with stuff. As far as the space between the bracket and the rig. That is normal. There is enough structural support added by rigidly fixing the mount bracket to the rack that the lateral forces wont roll the bracket. Just that vertical force to be worried about.
I'm trying to decide whether to use a 1"x1/4" piece of steel to act as a double washer for both mounting holes, or to use nylon locking nuts and longer bolts and mount off the reinforcement unibody. Which do you think would offer better vertical strength? The angles on the interior sections may be a challenge, whereas using washers or the steel strip will be much easier, I just worry about the strength of the sheet metal when pulled up.
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post #23 of 32 Old 01-29-2020, 06:49 PM Thread Starter
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So... to revive this thread. I'm going to use a different style of expanding rivets to mount my roof rack to my jeep. These are pre-belled screw type ones used for truck boxes. Yakima also uses something similar for their rails called "Plus Nut". Basically these are expanding anchors meant for blind install.

Now in order to spread load across more of the roof, I'm going to install 4-8 additional rivets into the roof, sandwiched between the roof sheet metal and 1/4"x1-1/2" flares bar in carbon steel. This will distribute the pull through force an additional 30-50% and also spread the static force across more of the roof.

Link to rivets to be used:
Weather Guard WEATHERGUARD 999-10PK Tool Box Fastener https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EAANKGC..._PxJmEb4SD3S4B

The mechanics at work use these to mount all sorts of stuff to truck beds like solar panels, hydraulic hose reels, etc and swear by them (oilfield farm boy engineering!). Will update as I develop.
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post #24 of 32 Old 02-01-2020, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
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More photos. I'm actually planning now to just pull all the factory rivets and replace with the 5/16 ones. The expanding ones are slightly larger than the factory holes, but will go in with some love taps from a hammer. I'm feeling really good about this approach now.

Factory rivet nut on right in first photo, upgrade on left. It should expand to a washer larger than a quarter and may actually pin the secondary layer of sheet metal underneath as well. This is a permanent installation, may prove very difficult to remove the rivets afterwards. Will use 3M sealing adhesive tape and epoxy to seal.
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post #25 of 32 Old 02-02-2020, 07:24 PM Thread Starter
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Finished the rivet replacement and bracket mounting today. Note to self: working in the dark on your jeep sucks. Get a taller garage.

Regarding the rivets, with an elcheapo air impact wrench these go in very easily. I smeared a bunch of JB Weld onto the inside of the heads before popping them in through the factory holes. After compaction, I layered a bunch of 3M sealant tape around the holes and spacing under the brackets.

I ended up using that 3/8" hard rubber afterall as a gasket of sorts. I torqued the 5/16 bolts down until I was smashing rubber and/or 3 grunts. Will check torque once things warm up again. It was in the 70s today so I think I got them reasonably tight and I may still need to loosen to get the roof rack aligned. That's for another day...

That extra 1/4-1/3" should allow my solar panels to clear, so theres that. These brackets are rock solid now, I can rock my jeep from side to side with no flex. As expected, the new rivets actually engaged two layers of sheet metal in the roof.
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post #26 of 32 Old 02-03-2020, 10:40 AM
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Nutserts can be super frustrating but also very easily over-torqued and pulled through the sheet metal. Note for anyone messing with the rack hardware.

I am interested to see how the rubber plays out on this one. Threads in a component can handle overtorquing so much better than nutserts. Your new ones look like they will hold considerably better than factory as far as pullout. I feel like I would want some type of threadlocker on the threads with the big rubber pad under there, at the same time, thread locker is the last thing you want on a nutsert if you ever want it to come apart again and not just spin with the bolt. The thick rubber pad scares me for your original nutserts in the front because the soft rubber actually gives the nutsert space go while it is sitting tensioned. At least if the leg is sitting on the nutsert compressed with the bolt, it has no force actually trying to pull it out, that would only be the load of the weight up there that ever attempted to pull the rack up. I feel like a 1/8" rubber pad that would squish to the point where you are still getting metal to metal on the nutsert to the bracket would be ideal if you really want to run the rubber. Most of these racks sit right on the nutsert and its normal to have a little space. At that point, a torsional load is all that is going to want to pull the nutsert through, but with the rigid rack there is no torsional load (minimal, if any) being applied.

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post #27 of 32 Old 02-03-2020, 12:11 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by 2005JGC View Post
Nutserts can be super frustrating but also very easily over-torqued and pulled through the sheet metal. Note for anyone messing with the rack hardware.

I am interested to see how the rubber plays out on this one. Threads in a component can handle overtorquing so much better than nutserts. Your new ones look like they will hold considerably better than factory as far as pullout. I feel like I would want some type of threadlocker on the threads with the big rubber pad under there, at the same time, thread locker is the last thing you want on a nutsert if you ever want it to come apart again and not just spin with the bolt. The thick rubber pad scares me for your original nutserts in the front because the soft rubber actually gives the nutsert space go while it is sitting tensioned. At least if the leg is sitting on the nutsert compressed with the bolt, it has no force actually trying to pull it out, that would only be the load of the weight up there that ever attempted to pull the rack up. I feel like a 1/8" rubber pad that would squish to the point where you are still getting metal to metal on the nutsert to the bracket would be ideal if you really want to run the rubber. Most of these racks sit right on the nutsert and its normal to have a little space. At that point, a torsional load is all that is going to want to pull the nutsert through, but with the rigid rack there is no torsional load (minimal, if any) being applied.
Thanks for your comments. Fyi I ripped out all the original nutserts and replaced with the new ones. Two 5/16" expanding anchor type rivetnuts with 3/8" rubber compressed under each roof bracket. Eight total.

I considered using blue locktite as suggested, but wasnt confident that I'd ever be able to remove. Try as I might, I also couldn't find anything on torque spec for these rivetnuts...
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post #28 of 32 Old 02-03-2020, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KUJeeper82 View Post
Thanks for your comments. Fyi I ripped out all the original nutserts and replaced with the new ones. Two 5/16" expanding anchor type rivetnuts with 3/8" rubber compressed under each roof bracket. Eight total.

I considered using blue locktite as suggested, but wasnt confident that I'd ever be able to remove. Try as I might, I also couldn't find anything on torque spec for these rivetnuts...
Excellent!

As for the loctite, it is NOT supposed to be used on these types of fittings because of their likelihood of spinning in place preventing you from getting it apart, your concerns are valid. I looked up name brand nutsert information, the literature I came across really quick was for standard hardware, but I looked up a bolt in my lawson fastener book and the specified torque was the same (it was the 5/16 20 iirc). Nutsert suggested 17 ft lbs and the fastener book showed 16-18 ft lbs. The biggest problem being their inability to withstand over torquing like a regular bolt because the nutsert will pull out of the sheet metal before the threads will strip out.

Looks good, I like the new expanding anchors you used, a much wider handle on the sheet metal its hanging on to. Good choice! Thank you for sharing the process!

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post #29 of 32 Old 02-08-2020, 09:06 AM Thread Starter
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Solar panel slider system finally spec'd out. Going to use a 40" (1000mm) Linear Rail system to mount a single 40"x26"x1.5" Home Depot 100W solar panel to the underside of the Goliath Rack.

The sliders are $34 shipped from Amazon and come with 12mm plated ball bearings on an aluminum track system. I guess people use these for DIY CNC and 3D printer setups. I think they'll hold up well in a suspended system holding a 20 lb panel.

Happybuy Linear Rail 2 Set SBR12-1000mm Linear Rail Support 4 SBR12UU Rounter Bearing Linear Rail Shaft Guide for 12mm Slotted Bearings http://www.amazon.com/dp/B071YWMTLB/..._4KTpEbM6JNMZA

I have two orientation options available, either offset the panel with a second rail set and pull out from the side, or center mount and pull out towards the front of the jeep. Pulling through the rear won't work with the hatchback unfortunately. If I front mount I'll also need to figure out a good way to have a easily moveable wind guard (perhaps a flip up design?) That's also low noise and rugged.

Mounting the rails to the basket will be simple with 2.5" 1/4" bolts and either washers on the expanded metal or maybe I'll use a couple 1/8"x1" aluminum strips. The goal is to minimize catch/tear points on basket so when I toss gear up there I dont end up with a leaky tent. Hell, I could probably get away with SS zip ties in sufficient quantity, but it would be preferable to be able to remove the whole assembly at some point without removing the basket which is a PITA to install.

Will update with photos once the linear rails arrive. Bet they're chicom in origin so who knows with coronavirus? Amazon estimates delivery friday next week.

Here's a couple concept photos of what others have done. Whatever I do, I'll make it expandable so i can replace the single 100W panel with two 100W slim design panels (19" wide) in the future if necessary. I have a foldable 100W panel I can chain with one of these if necessary for low light conditions, but not sure 200W is necessary all the time since my Yeti 400 maxes out at 140W input.
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post #30 of 32 Old 02-12-2020, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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Got the linear rails in. Not sure on best arrangement or how to reinforce for 100% extension, what do you guys think?

Ordered a second set of the SBR12UU ball bearing housings to reinforce things further, should be able to tighten up the spacing to maybe 12" (4" per bearing kit) so am favoring the side mount to allow things to slide out past the roof rack threshold.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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