First oil change, a bit different (big filter, 1999 4.0) - Page 5 - JeepForum.com
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post #61 of 85 Old 06-18-2021, 08:17 PM Thread Starter
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Light weight oil is used in racing for increased performance. Its not a big difference but it's a difference.

I'm not particularly looking for that. I just want to treat the engine right so it lasts as long as possible.

As for sound, sometimes upgrading to a filter with a silicone anti-drainback valve can fix ugly sounding, oil starved cold starts. That seems like a really good idea on engines that need it.

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post #62 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 01:06 AM
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Some nitty gritty stuff on filters made by several companies.

https://www.austincc.edu/wkibbe/oilfilterstudy.htm

Last edited by Delta0; 06-19-2021 at 01:18 AM.
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post #63 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 04:02 AM
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I've yet to change the kind of oil or filter I use in any car and had it make any noticeable change or difference whether it a noise, performance or mpg's. The topic is always entertaining anyways
Very true. Same with oil change intervals. The only real difference is long term.

Some high mileage engines are still clean under the valve cover. Some are full of sludge. That's a big indicator of how it was cared for and how healthy it is.

Years ago I read an interview with a Chrysler engineer, talking about the old days. Late 80s - early 90s they had a rash of upper valve train lubrication failures due to plugged up oil flow. They tracked it down to a couple of brands of oil, including a Sears oil that was popular at the time.

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post #64 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 07:08 AM
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Very true. Same with oil change intervals. The only real difference is long term.

Some high mileage engines are still clean under the valve cover. Some are full of sludge. That's a big indicator of how it was cared for and how healthy it is.

Years ago I read an interview with a Chrysler engineer, talking about the old days. Late 80s - early 90s they had a rash of upper valve train lubrication failures due to plugged up oil flow. They tracked it down to a couple of brands of oil, including a Sears oil that was popular at the time.
Known as "The Black Death."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_sludge
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post #65 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 09:16 AM
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I've been running Rotella T5 with a Wix 51515XP filter in my 4.0 for the last four years. The WJ 4.0 seems really happy (tamed lifter noise) with this oil, probably due to the high Zinc content.
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post #66 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 10:03 AM Thread Starter
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I’ve been running Rotella T5 with a Wix 51515XP filter in my 4.0 for the last four years. The WJ 4.0 seems really happy (tamed lifter noise) with this oil, probably due to the high Zinc content.
That sounds like a great reason to keep doing what you are doing, it doesn't matter if it's the zink helping or not.
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post #67 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 10:57 AM
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That sounds like a great reason to keep doing what you are doing, it doesn't matter if it's the zink helping or not.
I replace the Rotella T5 and Wix filter every 5000 miles. Walmart usually has a low price on T5.

These 4.0 engines are amazingly robust. Mine "marks its territory" with a very slow leak from one of the seals. I think that is pretty common with these.
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post #68 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 12:09 PM Thread Starter
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Some nitty gritty stuff on filters made by several companies.

https://www.austincc.edu/wkibbe/oilfilterstudy.htm
This information is pretty out of date (18+ years old).

I know Fram has improved their production and if you change the filter type you compare, the story can be different every time.

Hummel Mann wasn't represented either.

I'm not sure about the statement of deep pleats flowing more than shallow pleats with the same total area.

If you aren't looking at the disassembly of the exact filter you intend to use, all you are going to see are trends and the biggest trend you'll find is bigger filter=more filter element area. It's not always the case when you compare filters from different brands but within a brand it usually holds true. So good brand and big filter is a very safe bet for high filter element area.

I think Hummel Mann is OEM for Mercedes and considering mine was sold as a Napa Gold premium filter, I bet the quality is good.

That's the math I did. I didn't buy two so I can open one up with my oil filter cutter to see the element but I will cut it when I change it out.
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post #69 of 85 Old 06-19-2021, 01:47 PM
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.

I'm not sure about the statement of deep pleats flowing more than shallow pleats with the same total area.

I know that in the HVAC world air filters with deeper pleats allow more air flow than shallower ones.
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post #70 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 02:32 AM
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I've been running Rotella T5 with a Wix 51515XP filter in my 4.0 for the last four years. The WJ 4.0 seems really happy (tamed lifter noise) with this oil, probably due to the high Zinc content.
Which viscosities please?
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post #71 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 02:51 AM
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This information is pretty out of date (18+ years old).

I know Fram has improved their production and if you change the filter type you compare, the story can be different every time.

Hummel Mann wasn't represented either.

I'm not sure about the statement of deep pleats flowing more than shallow pleats with the same total area.

If you aren't looking at the disassembly of the exact filter you intend to use, all you are going to see are trends and the biggest trend you'll find is bigger filter=more filter element area. It's not always the case when you compare filters from different brands but within a brand it usually holds true. So good brand and big filter is a very safe bet for high filter element area.

I think Hummel Mann is OEM for Mercedes and considering mine was sold as a Napa Gold premium filter, I bet the quality is good.

That's the math I did. I didn't buy two so I can open one up with my oil filter cutter to see the element but I will cut it when I change it out.
Thanks Dust Devil.

As you say 18+ years old.
It was the best I could find.
Plus much of it is still relevant.

According to "Bob is the oil guy" "OEM MANN filters are still made in Germany for BMW/AUDI, etc. However, all aftermarket variants for Chrysler, Hyundai, etc. are all from China. IT's called BRAND manufacturing."

I think the writer is probably correct.
Especially where the brand is marketed under another name.

Full discussion here, https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/th...-china.176148/

Probably the key questions are,
  • Where was the filter made?
  • Whose name is on the filter?
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post #72 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 04:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeepsmsc2 View Post
I've been running Rotella T5 with a Wix 51515XP filter in my 4.0 for the last four years. The WJ 4.0 seems really happy (tamed lifter noise) with this oil, probably due to the high Zinc content.
To be picky, Rotella is different in a number of ways which may benefit tired engines. The zinc content is not likely what helped there because the value of zinc is reducing wear on high contact pressure steel on steel. It might make your cam and lifter surfaces last longer, but won't likely reduce existing tappet noise.

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post #73 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 07:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Dust Devil View Post
This information is pretty out of date (18+ years old).

I know Fram has improved their production and if you change the filter type you compare, the story can be different every time.

Hummel Mann wasn't represented either.

I'm not sure about the statement of deep pleats flowing more than shallow pleats with the same total area.

If you aren't looking at the disassembly of the exact filter you intend to use, all you are going to see are trends and the biggest trend you'll find is bigger filter=more filter element area. It's not always the case when you compare filters from different brands but within a brand it usually holds true. So good brand and big filter is a very safe bet for high filter element area.

I think Hummel Mann is OEM for Mercedes and considering mine was sold as a Napa Gold premium filter, I bet the quality is good.

That's the math I did. I didn't buy two so I can open one up with my oil filter cutter to see the element but I will cut it when I change it out.
Here's some guff on Napa Gold Filters.

The Beta Ratio is a good way of deciding a filter's quality.
Trouble is, it's difficult to find.

Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/20
Burst Pressure: 400 psi
Filter O.D. (Inches): 2.685 in. Filter O.D. (mm): 68 mm
Flow Rate: 7 - 9 gpm Gasket I.D. (Inches): 2.173 in.
Gasket I.D. (mm): 55 mm
Gasket O.D. (Inches): 2.475 in. Gasket O.D. (mm): 63 mm
Height (Inches): 2.977 in. Height (mm): 76 mm
Media Type: Cellulose Micron Rating: 21
Style: Spin-on Oil Filter
Thread Size (Inches): 3/4-16 in. UNSPSC: 40161504

The Beta Ratio gives a good idea of how good a filter is.
It ain'r easy to get your head round though.

Last edited by Delta0; 06-21-2021 at 10:47 AM.
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post #74 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 07:59 AM
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post #75 of 85 Old 06-20-2021, 11:08 AM
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Hi Delta0

The viscosity of Rotella T5 I use is 10w 30.

A one gallon bottle at Walmart is usually about $17.
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