Exciting Times in 4low...forever - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 12:20 PM Thread Starter
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Exciting Times in 4low...forever

Hi everyone! First time poster. First time WK2 owner, too (2012 Overland)! Bought it this week, drove home 400 miles or so and all was grand (pun intended). Tuesday I get a message from my wife saying the Serv 4WD light is on, Traction Control OFF light is on, but it is driving fine. I say okay, no big deal- when researching the vehicle I saw that a handful of people had needed to replace the motor when this happened- luck of the draw, right. Wednesday the problem persists and continues on Thursday. So, I figure before I tear into this I was going to see if I could get the problem to replicate for me. Sitting in the driveway, in N, I run the Selec-Terrain through it's paces, no problem. I go left to right and when I reach sand/mud the Serv 4WD light comes on. Bingo! I now have solid evidence to look into motor replacement. But I didn't stop there. I went to rock, engaged 4Low, and now it is stuck in 4Low. Additionally, now it gives me a Service Air Suspension (though the system works flawlessly), and my Selec-Terrain goes to Snow and flashes back to auto if I go left and goes to Sport and flashes back to auto if I turn right. The Neutral indicator is also illuminated solid red and will not go off. I disconnected the battery for a little over half an hour, pumped the brakes to remove any static charge (heard that works haha) and same problem. I removed the heat shield, checked the connections- all good. Pulled the TC Motor, thought about trying to manually shift into 4Hi, and thought better. I haven't had a chance to pull codes and really have no desire to limp it to the dealer. From what my now in depth research has uncovered, this tends to be related to the Transfer Case Motor, the Transfer Case Range Sensor, or the Transfer Case Control Module. So, yeh..please help.

TL;DR- Stuck in 4Low, Warning Lights, where is the best place to start? Also, does anyone have instructions on replacing Range Sensor and/or Transfer Case Motor? I am relatively mechanically inclined, but this is my first foray into jeep world ( I know my Landcruiser inside and out though) and I want to make sure I don't screw anything up.

Thank you

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post #2 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 12:23 PM Thread Starter
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Also forgot to mention, in my attempts to shift out of 4Low I did try some back and forth, low speed driving, shifting into neutral and disengaging. I lifted all 4 wheels off and rotated by hand, then attempted to disengage, no dice. I am also hearing the motor click quite frequently on startup/shutdown as well. If I can think of anything else, I will post as it comes to me.

Thanks again!
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post #3 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 01:41 PM
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There have been quite a few posts on the stuck in 4-Low subject, as you may have found. If no one jumps in here before I get back I'll take a look.

You have the usual suspects, but it could also be a bad transfer case. Given the wacky indicators, I'd suspect the controller, which is simple to replace. You cannot manually move the shift forks in this transfer case. The transfer case must be in neutral to easily replace the motor and get the new one lined up. A bum motor can burn out a controller and a bum controller can burn out the motor, so most shops replace both. The position sensor isn't typically the problem.

But a ODB scanner that can read body module DTCs could help. If I recall correctly, this kind of thing leaves no fault trail.

I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #4 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 02:51 PM Thread Starter
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Working on securing a scanner that will read the DTC codes, as you are spot on from what I have read about trying to pull these codes. And quite frankly, with the variety of solutions for this dilemma, I had pretty much resolved to replacing all three items at once.

Anywhos, here are my questions-

With my Selec-Terrain having the Neutral Indicator illuminated, although it is certainly not in neutral/tow mode, what is going to be the best way for me to make sure the TC is actually in neutral when preparing to replace the motor? I can switch the transmission into neutral when cycling the key to the Accessory position, but will that suffice?

There is an Arrow/Line combo on the Range Switch, is this to assure it is lined up with the neutral position as well?



Bonus fun fact from being under there today- at the very least my Transfer Case and Transfer Case motor have been replaced as the motor has a born on date in 2016 and the transfer case has a 2017 stamp. However, there are no records of this service through the Carfax report. Intriguing to say the least.

Thanks again for the help!
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post #5 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 04:24 PM
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Can you tell the born date for the controller?

I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #6 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 05:28 PM Thread Starter
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So here are some supporting pictures, however I do not see a born on date for the Control Module or the Range Switch (encoder)

This is what my Selec-Terrain looks like when I go into Accessory or crank the vehicle (it goes forwards (D), backwards (R), up (Normal, Offroad Height 1&2) and down (Park/Exit)- just in 4low haha)



Here is the stamp on the Transfer Case



Here is the stamp on the Transfer Case Motor



Here is the Transfer Case Range Sensor/Encoder (ignore the missing bolt, that is in my pocket)



And last, but not least, here is the Transfer Case Control Module

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post #7 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 05:31 PM Thread Starter
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Time out...someone tell me I am crazy, but that Transfer Case says 3025. Am I missing something here, aren't I supposed to have a 3023?
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post #8 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 05:36 PM
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Well, the motor obviously isn't original - a 2012 can't have a part with a 2016 build date, so I suspect this was a recurring problem with this car.
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post #9 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 05:39 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceb1 View Post
Well, the motor obviously isn't original - a 2012 can't have a part with a 2016 build date, so I suspect this was a recurring problem with this car.
My thoughts exactly. Same with the Transfer Case and it's 2017 stamp. But neither of these services showed on the Carfax. I tried to call the dealer listed on the report today- JCD of Ontario, California, to see if they would be able to pull me a more detailed service history, but could not get anyone on the phone.
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post #10 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 07:42 PM
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The Explaining the three 4wd thread has links to some detailed information You should find an ID tag with something like MP3023ATP. If you have a 3025, that was pulled from a heavy duty GM truck. Same case, I think, but beefier reduction gears (4Low).

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f309...stems-1177616/


Off hand, dunno how to get the tranfercase into the neutral position, but new motors are shipped in the neutral position and must be aligned with the transfercase worm shaft accordingly. But if the motor is trying to move and jammed, you will almost always hear a clicking noise, at least for awhile. I'd suspect the controller isn't sensing voltage to the motor. You could check this by pulling the motor connector and measuring, careful to not short anything out.

Those flashing select terrain lights are a fault indication.

When you install the sensor, you need to align the arrow on the encoder shaft with the alignment mark, then the encoder shaft to the shift shaft and dowl in the case.

I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #11 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 07:58 PM
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This stuck shift motor was due to bent pins

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f309...29/index2.html
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I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #12 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 08:06 PM
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This guy replaced the module:

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f309...ivate-4395741/
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I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #13 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 08:18 PM
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More diagnostic info here, may or may not be useful:

https://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f309...cking-4229378/

I was born with nuttin' and I still have most of it
Current: 2011 Grand Cherokee Overland V8, 2009 Liberty Rocky Mt V6
Previous: 2000 Grand Cherokee Laredo I6, 1979 CJ7 I6 Quadratrac
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post #14 of 30 Old 05-22-2020, 08:44 PM Thread Starter
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I wish it was in the connectors. I saw a handful of people say their problem was fixed by repairing a loose connector. But mine are right and tight. It looks like the module and motor are the most common, like you said. Probably try and source those this weekend- away from the dealer and their approximately $1000 parts cost.

I definitely have some more reading to do though Thank you again for all the threads and direction on the sensor. I feel like I have read about this until I word vomit potential diagnoses, but it seems like everyone has a different solution, or at least chain of events leading to the solution

Once I can get my hands on a quality scan tool I will report back with the codes (I'm sure they're in there) and I will dig some more into that 3025 stamp on the case. Thanks everyone! Despite all this I am still thrilled to be in the Jeep family!
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post #15 of 30 Old 05-26-2020, 08:17 AM Thread Starter
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So, weekend update!

The local dealer had the range sensor in stock, so I went ahead and replaced that- because why not. This also resulted in a flush and refill of the Transfer Case, which was much needed. And for about ten minutes my problems were solved!

However, when I prepared to go for a second test drive, it was locked in 4low, again and this time without me even pushing the button. After a few attempts to get it out, and noticeably harder shifts from P-R-D, I shut it off. Waited a couple hours (cleaned my shed) and then hopped in to see in maybe something would have changed. Well, it did. No service lights! No 4Low illumination! No reverse! That's right. When I shift into reverse I get a wicked grind and click combo which I believe solidifies that it is the Transfer Case Motor. Which is ok. I have the motor and module on order (still waiting on that scanner though haha) and should be able to get them in before the weekend.

I did look into my transfer case stamping issue a little more, and I am perplexed. The part# on the case- 52853664AH, shows to be for a 2017 Grand Cherokee, which worries me. But the motor, sensor, and even gear range listed all match what would come on my 2012. Once I hit my ten post threshold I am going to check with JeepCares and see if they can shed some light on my service history, still no response from the Ontario dealer, but one step at a time

Thanks again for all the help! That ten minutes of driving was exhilarating and I can't wait to get this beauty back on the road.
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