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post #1 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 11:52 AM Thread Starter
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Short to ground

Hey guys, I am fixing up 2003 Grand Cherokee, 4x4, when I first got it, it had a dead battery, that was only not quite 2 years into the 5 year warranty. The Walmart MAXX something. So I had my friend that I am fixing this for, she got a free replacement battery. I have been working on it for 3 months now, and would run it every week for ten minutes or so, drive it around for 20, etc.
Last week the battery was dead. So I jumped it charged up, but I disconnected the ground. Now it stays charged.

I am thinking short to ground. I was a mechanic (ground equipment), in the service for 30 years. I understand ohms, voltmeter, etc.

But before I jump off the deep end. Are 2003 Grand Cherokees, notorious for anything in particular? I know there are a lot of them out there. Any ideas on what could be draining the new battery? When I hook it up it arcs pretty good.

I am doing visual inspections, but want to know if anything jumps out, from your Jeep experience.

Thank you.


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post #2 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 12:00 PM
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I doubt it's a short. There is probably something on or a bad module, switch, aftermarket thing drawing power with the key off.

I would start with measuring the current at the IOD (ignition off draw) fuse. Connect an ammeter and shut it down. Watch the current draw and continue watching it for 15 minutes or so. Some modules take longer to shut down than others. Don't interrupt the ammeter connection while testing or the entire process restarts. If the draw doesn't drop to a minuscule amount, then you have found something not shutting down.

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post #3 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 12:54 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cranbiz View Post
I doubt it's a short. There is probably something on or a bad module, switch, aftermarket thing drawing power with the key off.

I would start with measuring the current at the IOD (ignition off draw) fuse. Connect an ammeter and shut it down. Watch the current draw and continue watching it for 15 minutes or so. Some modules take longer to shut down than others. Don't interrupt the ammeter connection while testing or the entire process restarts. If the draw doesn't drop to a minuscule amount, then you have found something not shutting down.
Thank you for your response, I am digging out my multimeter now.

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post #4 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 01:23 PM
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My first suspects are anything not original jeep - audio, lighting, alarm, trailer connector...
Another is a bad alternator - diodes allowing battery lead to go to ground.

a mechanic ground equipment - is that AGE equipt like -60 generators?

When I see the price of OEM I think aftermarket.
When I see the quality of aftermarket I think OEM.
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post #5 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
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My first suspects are anything not original jeep - audio, lighting, alarm, trailer connector...
Another is a bad alternator - diodes allowing battery lead to go to ground.

a mechanic ground equipment - is that AGE equipt like -60 generators?
Jtec,

Thanks for your response, will check the alternator also. ground equipment, is generic, for me to say. I was not an aircraft mechanic.
Started out with M60A1 diesel tanks in USMC, then the M1A1 after the war. (hull and turret). After I got out and came back into the Army, I was 63H3O, but had 63W (wheeled vehicle repairer) working for me. Then progressed to 63X, finally 91Z5O, Mechanical Maintenance Supervisor, everything from generators, 5K, etc, to FSSP, HMMWV, 5ton trucks. I think I got most MOS right, may have to double check my old NCOERs. But thanks for your info, on the Jeep.

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post #6 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 03:19 PM
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Semper Fi !

Avionics here!

Skyhawk/Phantom/Harrier/Intruder/Huey/Cobra.

2014 Grand Cherokee Overland V6
2008 Dodge Durango Limited 5.7L
2002 Chrysler 300m Special 3.5L
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post #7 of 18 Old 05-27-2020, 04:48 PM Thread Starter
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Semper Fi !

Avionics here!

Skyhawk/Phantom/Harrier/Intruder/Huey/Cobra.
Jeepronibo,

Well, Let me guess.. Yuma, Cherry Point?
All us grounded envied the flyboys. The M1A1 at least had an AGT 1500 turbine engine. Even though it took (how) many gallons to start.
I am still trying to find my multimeter to get this battery to stop, discharging, got some great leads, from the forum, and will chase it down. Semper Fi! Devil dog. ABQ, NM.

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post #8 of 18 Old 05-29-2020, 10:45 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cranbiz View Post
I doubt it's a short. There is probably something on or a bad module, switch, aftermarket thing drawing power with the key off.

I would start with measuring the current at the IOD (ignition off draw) fuse. Connect an ammeter and shut it down. Watch the current draw and continue watching it for 15 minutes or so. Some modules take longer to shut down than others. Don't interrupt the ammeter connection while testing or the entire process restarts. If the draw doesn't drop to a minuscule amount, then you have found something not shutting down.
Cranbiz,

Ok, got multimeter ready, which fuse is the IOD (ignition off draw), I have attached image of fuses on the Jeep. Also do I need to remove the little plastic tops on these type fuses to gain access to the two contacts that the fuse breaches?
Jtec mentioned anything not stock, maybe shorting. So visual inspection I noticed the horn relay was not plugged in. When I plug it in, then I went to hook up the ground terminal the horn sounded. So I removed it after I started the Jeep I plugged horn relay back in and it worked ok. Now I recall my friends daughter, (Original Jeep Owner), had a interlock? Hooked up at one time. That thing that you cant drive it unless you are sober, where would that be located and if it is still in there. I had a new remote and alarm fob, to get programmed and locksmith said his computer couldn't see the Jeep or something. Any advise is sure appreciated, Ski
Attached Thumbnails
FUSEDIAGRAM.jpg   FUSES.jpg  

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post #9 of 18 Old 05-29-2020, 01:24 PM
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Not sure which one of those it is. I would probably start with one of the JB power fuses. Pull the fuse and put the meter in line with the fuse, set for Amps and make sure the probes are set up correctly. Then I would try the ASD fuse.

It looks like you have several Junction Blocks, you might need to look for those and for what may be plugged into them.

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post #10 of 18 Old 06-03-2020, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cranbiz View Post
Not sure which one of those it is. I would probably start with one of the JB power fuses. Pull the fuse and put the meter in line with the fuse, set for Amps and make sure the probes are set up correctly. Then I would try the ASD fuse.

It looks like you have several Junction Blocks, you might need to look for those and for what may be plugged into them.
Cranbiz,
I did the diode test on the alternator, and it failed, it flowed both ways. Installed a new alternator, however the WJ still has another parasitic draw. The old alternator looked so old that It may have been the original one from 2002.
Spoke with the technician that installed the interlock system, (DUI). He told me that he hooks up the interlock system to the ignition, the horn and a constant hot wire on the vehicles. Now, the previous owners Mum, is here she said when they hooked up the interlock the horn would go off and not stop, so she pulled the horn relay, and to this day the horn relay is still disconnected. I plugged it in and it went off random (horn). I am not familiar with the horn circuit, on 2003 Grand Cherokee. I have also read about people getting electrical problems when they get interlocks hooked up and removed. I am wondering what your thoughts on this maybe. Maybe the horn circuit could be shorted out when they installed the interlock.

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post #11 of 18 Old 06-03-2020, 03:32 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tonyskidawg View Post
Cranbiz,
I did the diode test on the alternator, and it failed, it flowed both ways. Installed a new alternator, however the WJ still has another parasitic draw. The old alternator looked so old that It may have been the original one from 2002.
Spoke with the technician that installed the interlock system, (DUI). He told me that he hooks up the interlock system to the ignition, the horn and a constant hot wire on the vehicles. Now, the previous owners Mum, is here she said when they hooked up the interlock the horn would go off and not stop, so she pulled the horn relay, and to this day the horn relay is still disconnected. I plugged it in and it went off random (horn). I am not familiar with the horn circuit, on 2003 Grand Cherokee. I have also read about people getting electrical problems when they get interlocks hooked up and removed. I am wondering what your thoughts on this maybe. Maybe the horn circuit could be shorted out when they installed the interlock.
She got me a new Walmart 850cc battery for the Jeep in Jan, and I have been slowly fixing it up, over the year, I would start it to charge once a week. After about 4 months, the battery started showing less voltage on the voltmeter (gage). So I started running it twice a week to keep it charged. Then about a month ago the battery just died and would start. I jumped it and have drivin it some to get it up to charge. But it would stay charged so I have been disconnection the ground, and hook it up to go somewhere. I am wondering if the battery got so dead it may have killed a cell or two. I charged it up today and it got up to 12.72 volts with engine off, and when I started it would go up to 12.34 to 12.36 volts with a multimeter at the battery terminal. In comparison to my Silverado, I put the meter on her this morning, her battery is older. Silverado had 13.4 volts after setting over nite, and 14.6 with the engine running. Let me know if anything sounds like it jumps out at you. Thank you. Ski

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post #12 of 18 Old 06-03-2020, 03:38 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tonyskidawg View Post
She got me a new Walmart 850cc battery for the Jeep in Jan, and I have been slowly fixing it up, over the year, I would start it to charge once a week. After about 4 months, the battery started showing less voltage on the voltmeter (gage). So I started running it twice a week to keep it charged. Then about a month ago the battery just died and would start. I jumped it and have drivin it some to get it up to charge. But it would stay charged so I have been disconnection the ground, and hook it up to go somewhere. I am wondering if the battery got so dead it may have killed a cell or two. I charged it up today and it got up to 12.72 volts with engine off, and when I started it would go up to 12.34 to 12.36 volts with a multimeter at the battery terminal. In comparison to my Silverado, I put the meter on her this morning, her battery is older. Silverado had 13.4 volts after setting over nite, and 14.6 with the engine running. Let me know if anything sounds like it jumps out at you. Thank you. Ski
Sorry all these numbers.. the WJ had 13.44 to 13.66 with the engine on and charging not 12.

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post #13 of 18 Old 06-04-2020, 09:59 AM
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If the interlock is not not required, pull it out.

I don't know a lot of specifics on the WJ, do detailed operating parameters, I can't help with. Like I'm not sure if the PCM controls the charging voltage. If it does, there may be an issue with the connection or the PCM itself. Charging voltage should be really close to 14V.

12v on a sitting battery is good, it shows that all cells are contributing.

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post #14 of 18 Old 06-04-2020, 03:09 PM
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What can we do to help?

I have that manual open for other reasons and will keep it open tonight if you need something..

Attached is IOD - I think you asked.

long post confuse me - I have the attention spam of a teenager at a topless bar look there oh over there wow look, what was I saying
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When I see the price of OEM I think aftermarket.
When I see the quality of aftermarket I think OEM.
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post #15 of 18 Old 06-04-2020, 03:15 PM
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HORN circuit.... I think you asked

Is your AIRBAG light on?
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File Type: pdf wj HORN.pdf (88.2 KB, 0 views)

When I see the price of OEM I think aftermarket.
When I see the quality of aftermarket I think OEM.
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