Starter Spinning and throwing bendix out fully but not engaging with flywheel. - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 48 Old 07-21-2019, 07:25 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Starter Spinning and throwing bendix out fully but not engaging with flywheel.

I just traded a ranger I had for a '97 Grand Cherokee, originally the ZJ had a 4.0 but was swapped out for a 5.2 from another ZJ. The guy I got the jeep from just rebuilt the trans and told me that the starter needs to be shimmed. The parts store I went to said they do not have any shims available for the starter's I bought, And I was under the assumption that you only needed to shim starters on older chevys... but thats kind of beside the point.

Originally the starter that was in the jeep was Part # V612453B, I had the starter tested and it came back bad, I purchased the same starter and threw it in the jeep and tried to crank it over and the starter rotates the bendix and throws it out fully to engage with the flywheel but the bendix is about an inch below the fly wheel

I did some digging and found that a 97 ZJ with the 5.2 calls for a starter with a part # R612609B, so i went back to the parts store and picked up that starter. Brought it back home and the new starter is still doing the same thing, still about an inch below the flywheel. Im stumped here and am not sure which direction to go...

Flywheel has no teeth damaged or missing
Transmission doesn't look clocked/rotated one way or the other
starter is completely throwing bendix out


any ideas??? thanks!

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post #2 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 11:33 AM
zjosh93
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Hmm... The first number you bought was the 4.0 starter. It has a different bolt pattern so it shouldn't have bolted to the transmission.

The second number you bought is the correct starter for a ZJ with the 5.2 or 5.9. Should be unique to the ZJ since the ZJ has the starter on the opposite (passenger) side from the rest of the Magnum V8s. Might need to get your post count up but a picture would help since it's a swap motor. Unless someone else has run across this before and just knows off hand.

Does your starter mounting look like the below pic I stole from the internet?
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post #3 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 01:51 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zjosh93 View Post
Hmm... The first number you bought was the 4.0 starter. It has a different bolt pattern so it shouldn't have bolted to the transmission.

The second number you bought is the correct starter for a ZJ with the 5.2 or 5.9. Should be unique to the ZJ since the ZJ has the starter on the opposite (passenger) side from the rest of the Magnum V8s. Might need to get your post count up but a picture would help since it's a swap motor. Unless someone else has run across this before and just knows off hand.

Does your starter mounting look like the below pic I stole from the internet?
Yes the starter mount looks identical to what’s in the picture. Both starts I received from the parts store looked nearly identical.. I’m wondering if they are the same externally and the 5.2-/5.9 starters provide more torque for the v8’s?
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post #4 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 02:18 PM
firebane
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1) Is your starter on the left or right of the engine block?
2) Have you verified which transmission you have?

Figure out what transmission you have and that will help in the figuring out.
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post #5 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 02:23 PM
Mr. Puddles
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If the starters they gave you were identical that may be the issue


4.0
https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-select-4535/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-select-starter-new/n612453a/4601634/1996/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0




5.2
https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-4536/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-starter-remanufactured/r612609a/4603994/1997/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0






Look at them both in the side profile shots and notice the Bendix housing design differences

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The 4.0 is dumb old tractor motor, itís too stupid to know itís supposed to die.

Last edited by Mr. Puddles; 07-22-2019 at 02:27 PM. Reason: Better images
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post #6 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 02:55 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firebane View Post
1) Is your starter on the left or right of the engine block?
2) Have you verified which transmission you have?

Starter is on passenger side of block and I have not verified which trans I have. I will have to do that tomorrow evening when I can get out and look at the Jeep..

4.0
http://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-select-4535/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-select-starter-new/n612453a/4601634/1996/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0




5.2
http://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-4536/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-starter-remanufactured/r612609a/4603994/1997/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0






Look at them both in the side profile shots and notice the Bendix housing design differences
I will take the a look at the last starter I picked up and double check it to make sure it does match up to the 5.2L starter
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post #7 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 02:56 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firebane View Post
1) Is your starter on the left or right of the engine block?
2) Have you verified which transmission you have?

Figure out what transmission you have and that will help in the figuring out.
Starter is on passenger side of block and I have not verified which trans I have. I will have to do that tomorrow evening when I can get out and look at the Jeep..
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post #8 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 03:20 PM
zjosh93
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How are you checking the gap between the bendix and flywheel and that the bendix is completely out? Just looking at the starter bendix in relation to the bolt pattern is seems unlikely that the bendix could be an inch off.
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post #9 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 03:51 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zjosh93 View Post
How are you checking the gap between the bendix and flywheel and that the bendix is completely out? Just looking at the starter bendix in relation to the bolt pattern is seems unlikely that the bendix could be an inch off.
The inspection plate that mounts between the motor and trans is off and I can see the starter and flywheel when everything is put together... nothing was measured with a tape measure or anything but it looks to be about an inch off. I’m starting to wonder if for some odd reason he swapped the flywheel and put one on that was a bit smaller?
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post #10 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 03:58 PM
firebane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noah_cain View Post
The inspection plate that mounts between the motor and trans is off and I can see the starter and flywheel when everything is put together... nothing was measured with a tape measure or anything but it looks to be about an inch off. Iím starting to wonder if for some odd reason he swapped the flywheel and put one on that was a bit smaller?
Well this is why I was asking about the transmission for. I don't think its even entirely possible to put a 4.0 onto a 5.2 ... but who knows what is going on when people swap things.
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post #11 of 48 Old 07-22-2019, 04:07 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firebane View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by noah_cain View Post
The inspection plate that mounts between the motor and trans is off and I can see the starter and flywheel when everything is put together... nothing was measured with a tape measure or anything but it looks to be about an inch off. I’m starting to wonder if for some odd reason he swapped the flywheel and put one on that was a bit smaller?
Well this is why I was asking about the transmission for. I don't think its even entirely possible to put a 4.0 onto a 5.2 ... but who knows what is going on when people swap things.
I will have to get back with you guys on the trans tomorrow... i can’t make it to the Jeep tonight but I’m planning on doing some tinkering with it tomorrow. I believe he took the entire drivetrain out of the donor Jeep. He said the donor was rotted out and falling apart, he took the upper road support to keep the tag with motor info with the motor and originally the Jeep had the selec-trac t case and now it has the Quadra drive. So it’s nothing definite but it’s what I’m going with for now.
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post #12 of 48 Old 07-23-2019, 04:18 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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[QUOTE=noah_cain;40686435]
Quote:
Originally Posted by firebane View Post
1) Is your starter on the left or right of the engine block?
2) Have you verified which transmission you have?

Starter is on passenger side of block and I have not verified which trans I have. I will have to do that tomorrow evening when I can get out and look at the Jeep..

4.0
http://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-select-4535/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-select-starter-new/n612453a/4601634/1996/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0




5.2
http://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/b/ultima-4536/charging---starting-16772/starter-11798/dad3c6651e74/ultima-starter-remanufactured/r612609a/4603994/1997/jeep/grand-cherokee?q=starter&pos=0






Look at them both in the side profile shots and notice the Bendix housing design differences

I pulled the starter to match it up and I do have the correct 5.2L starter in the jeep
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post #13 of 48 Old 07-23-2019, 04:31 PM Thread Starter
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Sorry for the bad picture... but according to what I found on the internet the pan with the RR corner of the pan not rounded off but making a diagonal transitions says I have the 42re
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post #14 of 48 Old 07-23-2019, 05:03 PM
CatSplat
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Should just be a 44RE, same pan as the 42RE but actually bolts up to the 5.2L and was the 5.2L transmission for that year.

Sadly that doesn't really help you with the starter issue though.

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post #15 of 48 Old 07-23-2019, 05:06 PM Thread Starter
noah_cain
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Originally Posted by CatSplat View Post
Should just be a 44RE, same pan as the 42RE but actually bolts up to the 5.2L and was the 5.2L transmission for that year.

Sadly that doesn't really help you with the starter issue though.
After I posted this I found that the 42re will not bolt to the 5.2 due to a different style bell housing... so there should be no question about it being a 44re correct? 14 pan bolts, same style pan as the 42RE and ID #’s stamped on driver side of vehicle just above the pan.

Am I correct?
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