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post #1 of 25 Old 02-26-2004, 05:53 PM Thread Starter
damianmantis
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shake of death

has anyone out there with a WJ experienced the "shake of death". to call it a vibration is a huge understatement. it occurs when you are going over 30 mph and you hit a hard bump and the front end shakes so hard that you have to slam on the brakes and completely stop and then start again. this occurence started when i put my first 4" lift on and when i went to 10" of lift it didn't do it since, well, it's back with avengence and i have no idea how to eliminate it. i put a dual stabilizer on to bandaid the problem, but the "shake of death" prevailed. i can't believe my tires don't just fly off. what's up? any help?

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post #2 of 25 Old 02-26-2004, 07:20 PM
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Seach for 'death wobble'. It's a highly discussed, and major problem when lifts get put on.
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post #3 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 05:24 AM
Texas ZJ1
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Do you have pics of the 10 inches of lift?


Hunter

If you can fab or have fabbed up ten inches of lift, DW is the least of your worries!

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post #4 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 09:40 AM
zjjeeper
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If you have 10" lift, and havent modded, your Steering, trackbar location, control arm mounts, etc..

you will probably never get rid of it.


why do you have 10" lift anyway???, you running 40's???


Death wobble is caused by improper alignment and Toe-In of the front axle, it causes the shaking you are talking about, if your alignment is out of whack , NO amount of stabilizers will help..


You probably need alonger draglink, you need a combination of a drop pitman arm AND and trackbar relocation bracket (moved above the axle on the axle end of the mount)

Hopefully you have swapped axles, because if you have the stock LOW PINION front end, ther is NO way you will able to get your caster even close to positive, OR even neutral, this will also lead to the steering not being responsive.


My suggestion, either LOWER it down, or open up the walled and get a High Pinion front AND rear end, , new steering, and if the required mods to make it work.

of course 10" lift on a WJ,ZJ, TJ, XJ, is just absurd, unless you have full width axles, and have stretched you wheelbase about 1ft., Even at that, that is WAYYY too much lift..

6" max, on one of those, you can fit 35's, or 37's with some trimming, No need to really go any bigger, it isnt going to make it offroad any better..

good luck... and lets see some pics...
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post #5 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damianmantis
has anyone out there with a WJ experienced the "shake of death". to call it a vibration is a huge understatement. it occurs when you are going over 30 mph and you hit a hard bump and the front end shakes so hard that you have to slam on the brakes and completely stop and then start again. this occurence started when i put my first 4" lift on and when i went to 10" of lift it didn't do it since, well, it's back with avengence and i have no idea how to eliminate it. i put a dual stabilizer on to bandaid the problem, but the "shake of death" prevailed. i can't believe my tires don't just fly off. what's up? any help?
It's called bumper steer. I had the same problem. It took for ever to find out what was wrong but when we went to the dealer the told us it was bump steer and they replaced the dampener.
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post #6 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 10:21 AM
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Hey,

bumpsteer and Death wobble are two different things. Please don't confuse the two.

Hunter

04 4.7 HO, limited
04 4.7 HO, Overland

08 Z71 Suburban, front leveling kit with rear spacers. 285/65 18s Nitto TerraGrappler G2s

94 5.9 Laredo 6.5 RE lift with 35 Maxxis Bighorns
and 33 Bridgestone Duelers
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post #7 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
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i've had the 4" the 6" the 8" and all those lifts would not let me articulate without grabbing the inner wheelwell. it may be enough for a zj, but the wj wheel wells come about straight down. you tell me what the disavantage is to being able to articulate further, and having more ground clearance (35" tires). i had a teraflex 6" lift with 32" tires and i was embarrased at how pathetic that thing was. my tires would rub turning into my driveway. yeah i could get the disk grinder out and hack up my jeep, but why? the 10" and 35s is the best set up i've had so far and to answer the tech questions, i got a drop pitman arm, the axles are staight ( not cause the axles are difftent, but because i got kick *** driveshafts front and back that can handle any angle) so on and so forth. i'm not a stranger to modification, being that i've fabricated vehicles from the ground up, which have won pro nationals and made multiple magazine shoots. i think people who think a 4" lift is the ultimate set-up are just insane. you need to think outside the box and turn those grocery-getters into rock krawlers. i would post pictures, but i'm new to this site and i'm not permitted to post attachments. i could whip up a site to post them on.

in closing, i apologize if i come across too harsh, but i've had jeeps for years and i loved the days of the CJs, but i feel that jeeps have turned into a rich yuppie vehicle to use to travel to the tennis courts and it pisses me off, so don't tell me that your wrangle with the garage installed 4" lift is radical, because i ain't buying it. i live in the sticks, i got a jeep cause i need it, not so the wind can blow through my hair. over and out.
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post #8 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 12:13 PM
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Wow!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by damianmantis
i've had the 4" the 6" the 8" and all those lifts would not let me articulate without grabbing the inner wheelwell. it may be enough for a zj, but the wj wheel wells come about straight down. you tell me what the disavantage is to being able to articulate further, and having more ground clearance (35" tires). i had a teraflex 6" lift with 32" tires and i was embarrased at how pathetic that thing was. my tires would rub turning into my driveway. yeah i could get the disk grinder out and hack up my jeep, but why? the 10" and 35s is the best set up i've had so far and to answer the tech questions, i got a drop pitman arm, the axles are staight ( not cause the axles are difftent, but because i got kick *** driveshafts front and back that can handle any angle) so on and so forth. i'm not a stranger to modification, being that i've fabricated vehicles from the ground up, which have won pro nationals and made multiple magazine shoots. i think people who think a 4" lift is the ultimate set-up are just insane. you need to think outside the box and turn those grocery-getters into rock krawlers. i would post pictures, but i'm new to this site and i'm not permitted to post attachments. i could whip up a site to post them on.

in closing, i apologize if i come across too harsh, but i've had jeeps for years and i loved the days of the CJs, but i feel that jeeps have turned into a rich yuppie vehicle to use to travel to the tennis courts and it pisses me off, so don't tell me that your wrangle with the garage installed 4" lift is radical, because i ain't buying it. i live in the sticks, i got a jeep cause i need it, not so the wind can blow through my hair. over and out.

Oh man!!!! That Jeep sounds incredible! You can send me pics to [email protected] and I can host them for you. I agree with the death wobble though that you will need to change your steering set-up. 10" has got to be maxing out the stock set-up. Also make sure all wheel bearing units and BJs and bushings are tight. I wish I could bring myself to take my Grand Cherokee in the woods, but its still too nice to scratch up I think. So for now it just stays on the road where the 33s and chrome wheels stay shiny. I do get alot of compliments though with the 6" lift, which I am more than happy with. But yea, e-mail me if you want me to host those.
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post #9 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 12:29 PM
MaineZJ
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I think everyone here would love to see lots of pics of your ride (specially close-ups of links and stuff)
Usually death wobble is caused by failing (worn out) suspension / steering mounts from what I know.
Bump steer is just the wheels turning as the suspension cycles.

93 ZJ
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post #10 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damianmantis
.... you tell me what the disavantage is to being able to articulate further, and having more ground clearance (35" tires)..
If you want to have 10" of lift, that is fine, but don't pass it off like you need it. IMHO, anything over 6" is just for showing off, and not done because you need it. I'm not that familiar with East-coast wheeling, but here in the midwest we have some hills, and it can get pretty scary offcamber with stock-width axles....

And if you are able to build your rigs, then it shouldn't be a problem getting rid of the DW. In fact, I would hope that you would be an expert on DW, as I can't imagine you had those other lifts and didn't experience it at least a little. I have seen rigs have DW at stock height.

Just my $0.02 worth.....
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post #11 of 25 Old 02-27-2004, 05:45 PM
zjjeeper
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UH....he newby..


ever heard of bumpstops and proper backspaced wheels...what about trimming the fenders..

adding more lift will NOT give you more articulation, it will just make the jeep more top heavy...


It has NOTHING to do with WJ/ZJ it has to do with the fact that your suspension is setup improperly, you dont have the correct bumpstops for your tires, And you probably havent trimmed your fenders very well..


components..






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post #12 of 25 Old 02-28-2004, 12:48 AM Thread Starter
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post #13 of 25 Old 02-28-2004, 08:30 AM
AAMC
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Given your DW situation, it's likely that at 10" of lift, your steering geometry (ie., caster) is sacrificed at the expense of maintaining pinion angle. Even at 7-8" of lift I had both axles replaced with a high pinion 44/60 combo and had the front steering geometry corrected. The WJ drives well. I don't necessary believe that you need an exorbitant amount of lift to clear the 35's, but to each his own. I had all the fenders trimmed and can run 38's comfortably.

Anton Cabellon


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post #14 of 25 Old 02-28-2004, 04:32 PM
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Are those stock axles?

Hunter

04 4.7 HO, limited
04 4.7 HO, Overland

08 Z71 Suburban, front leveling kit with rear spacers. 285/65 18s Nitto TerraGrappler G2s

94 5.9 Laredo 6.5 RE lift with 35 Maxxis Bighorns
and 33 Bridgestone Duelers
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post #15 of 25 Old 02-28-2004, 06:12 PM
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From the wee bitty pictures, they sure look it.

93 ZJ
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