TT w/ Novak Uni Mount and Barnes flat or Stick with UCF? - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 13 Old 05-27-2021, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
jebmoore
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TT w/ Novak Uni Mount and Barnes flat or Stick with UCF?

Hey Everyone, I am gathering parts to begin building my 93 a little more and wanted to get your opinions. I continue going back and forth on which route to pursue regarding the TT. I was on the Novak website and noticed they made a universal mount for the AX15 and it cuts enough space from under the tranny that I am thinking I may be able to go with the Barnes full flat.

My initial thought was to go with the UCF like Bruin and many others but after seeing that Novak mount I am thinking the Novak/Barnes Option may get it even tighter without addition tunnel modification, a 1"BL and a 1" MML.

All that said, ideal would be likely be an independent crossmember but I don't have the Fab skills or the welder. I may just have to bite the bullet on the welder and learn as I go since I scored an 8.8 last night and will be incorporating that with a JB conversions Shorty.

So many choices my head is spinning.

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post #2 of 13 Old 05-27-2021, 06:01 PM
Luuca
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Originally Posted by jebmoore View Post
Hey Everyone, I am gathering parts to begin building my 93 a little more and wanted to get your opinions. I continue going back and forth on which route to pursue regarding the TT. I was on the Novak website and noticed they made a universal mount for the AX15 and it cuts enough space from under the tranny that I am thinking I may be able to go with the Barnes full flat.

My initial thought was to go with the UCF like Bruin and many others but after seeing that Novak mount I am thinking the Novak/Barnes Option may get it even tighter without addition tunnel modification, a 1"BL and a 1" MML.

All that said, ideal would be likely be an independent crossmember but I don't have the Fab skills or the welder. I may just have to bite the bullet on the welder and learn as I go since I scored an 8.8 last night and will be incorporating that with a JB conversions Shorty.

So many choices my head is spinning.
https://genright.com/products/univer...ember-kit.html
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post #3 of 13 Old 05-27-2021, 09:30 PM
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The ideal solution is a separate crossmember but when you're trying to go a totally flat skid even with a 1" BL, things start getting real tight. I run a flat skid. My first flat skid was with 3/16" steel reinforced with some angles and the heavy 4L60E transmission. Yes it holds it, yes it bows slightly, yes I smashed it on lots of rocks, no it never failed. I currently run a 5/16" aluminum skid without any reinforcing. It works fine but it bows in the middle as well. If I ever have to drop the skid plate, I just put a tall jack under the rear yoke on the transfer case. I've put a jack and a block of wood under the oil pan but the 4L60 is pretty heavy so the jack under the transfer case is a better solution. I think you have to clock your transfer case up to get a full flat skid but maybe someone else can chime in on that. I know I did but I am running a different setup albiet with the NP231 still.

You'll never hear me discourage someone buying and learning to use a welder but I'm not sure it's really necessary for this project.
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post #4 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 12:33 PM
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Did I read that first post correctly OP?

U think the Novak mount can get you flat without a 1" MML, 1" BL nor tunnel modification?

As others have posted, there are sets for an indy mount you can buy with all the components in it for pretty good cost. That takes the "fab" game out of it...

Do you not have mobile welders available on your area? That is one way to go about it. If you prep everything, he or she should be able to get everything welded in for you fairly quickly.

I rent a welder whenever I need it... but I have an acquaintance who I'm sure fleeces his shop owner and pockets the money whenever I rent the welder from him for less than the cost of dirt, it's probably not a cost effective way to go about it for you if it's a full price deal.

As Waternut stated, if you can afford a welder and have your own space and place to keep it, store it and use it leisurely. That's your best option.

I'll never argue against the functionality of true flat and indy mount... but it wasn't necessary for my context... and I really dont like the reviews of 2.5s (vibrators as it is) without my rubber OEM mounts.
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post #5 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luuca View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jebmoore View Post
Hey Everyone, I am gathering parts to begin building my 93 a little more and wanted to get your opinions. I continue going back and forth on which route to pursue regarding the TT. I was on the Novak website and noticed they made a universal mount for the AX15 and it cuts enough space from under the tranny that I am thinking I may be able to go with the Barnes full flat.

My initial thought was to go with the UCF like Bruin and many others but after seeing that Novak mount I am thinking the Novak/Barnes Option may get it even tighter without addition tunnel modification, a 1"BL and a 1" MML.

All that said, ideal would be likely be an independent crossmember but I don't have the Fab skills or the welder. I may just have to bite the bullet on the welder and learn as I go since I scored an 8.8 last night and will be incorporating that with a JB conversions Shorty.

So many choices my head is spinning.
http://genright.com/products/univers...ember-kit.html
Man Genright really is proud of their stuff.

That may be a good deal... not sure on materials down there. For up here in Canadian, $199 is good when you factor materials in and time, etc. But I have a local place selling that exact kit more or less for $125 CAD. Which is crazy good.

Considering it is Canada, I assume its Chynuh steel though.
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post #6 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 04:27 PM
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Man Genright really is proud of their stuff.

That may be a good deal... notnsure on materials down here. For up here in Canadian, $199 is good when you factor materials in and time, etc. But I have a local place selling that exact kit more or less for $125 CAD. Which is crazy good.

Considering it is Canada, I assume its Chynuh steel though.
I agree, everything is getting more expensive.

I went to the Barnes website to buy a bumper for my kids jeep thinking their shorty with bull bar would still be $180. . . . boy was I wrong.

I will say this though, that Genrite kit is what I bought for the MJ transmission. Its stout steel and well made. I could have made it here, but figuring out the engineering, sourcing the metal, bending the tube, finding the bushings, cutting the metal, etc. it was worth it for me just to buy it un-welded and modify as needed.
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post #7 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 05:10 PM
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I have said that I have an idea for a separate trans crossmember to fab and the Genrite kit is my idea almost to a t. Their kit is more universal and adjustable than my idea. For the price, not bad. Because the bobbins on the ends, your trans is still mounted to rubber and certainly does need the torque arm thingy.
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If you cannot fix it with a hammer then it has to be an electrical problem.
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post #8 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 06:31 PM
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You do gotta consider the thickness of the rubber though... I mean, they are just bushings.

Obviously nothing will work like OEM, and in most cases OEM need to be ditched to get to whatever point some of us want to get our jeeps to.

Necessary modifications in most cases... it becomes a compromise. Sure am happy they started producing those bushings in the rubber, because poly sucks for vibration dampening. As for the "durability" aspect, I'm fairly certain it is overplayed in order to produce and sell cheaper materials to us.

I know I would hate poly trans and motor mounts. But I do have the 2.5... which is a wife pleaser if ya know what I mean
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post #9 of 13 Old 06-03-2021, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by bruinjeeper View Post
You do gotta consider the thickness of the rubber though... I mean, they are just bushings.

Obviously nothing will work like OEM, and in most cases OEM need to be ditched to get to whatever point some of us want to get our jeeps to.

Necessary modifications in most cases... it becomes a compromise. Sure am happy they started producing those bushings in the rubber, because poly sucks for vibration dampening. As for the "durability" aspect, I'm fairly certain it is overplayed in order to produce and sell cheaper materials to us.

I know I would hate poly trans and motor mounts. But I do have the 2.5... which is a wife pleaser if ya know what I mean
Not all applications are solid rubber bushings around the bobbin. Some have relief cuts in them. Like some of the hockey puck lower control arm bushings. Honda and acura used them for sure, so have many others. I guarantee they would be as soft and probably softer than a factory trans mount. JS.
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If you cannot fix it with a hammer then it has to be an electrical problem.
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post #10 of 13 Old 06-04-2021, 03:31 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bruinjeeper View Post
Did I read that first post correctly OP?

U think the Novak mount can get you flat without a 1" MML, 1" BL nor tunnel modification?
Really wanted to see if anyone had tried it with the Novak but at that point it seems that most have gone indy which makes the most sense going full flat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruinjeeper View Post
Do you not have mobile welders available on your area? That is one way to go about it. If you prep everything, he or she should be able to get everything welded in for you fairly quickly.
Great Thought, mobile welders are pretty expensive here (haven't tried CL) and at that point I would likely ask @jbolty as he isn't too far from me and has every tool under the sun. I just picked up an 8.8 so I will have to source welding from somewhere whether that be at Jbolty's, purchasing a welder, or borrowing a welder. It would be nice to have though .

I like the GenRight Mount but after installing Brown Dog MM and reading through other posts here and elsewhere I have realized that I am not keen on additional vibes. I think the UCF will probably be my best bet to reduce vibes. I will likely go back to a rubber trans mount and will be swapping out my BD MM for a block lift and rubber mounts.

@bruinjeeper When you went with the Ultra UCF was there any additional modification you felt were needed? I would have the JB shorty so I am hoping I am nearly in the clear with tub modifications. Wait, just remembered your likely running an AX5 with the 2.5 so I am not sure they are close enough. Anyone else running a UCF and had mods other than a 1" MML and 1" BL. Would it be safer to just stick with the High Clearance UCF?

@Waternut what are you running between the trans and the member?

Thanks for everyone's input it is greatly appreciated.
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post #11 of 13 Old 06-04-2021, 03:59 PM
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When I did the UFC ultra flat I modified the bracket between the transmission and the rubber mount to take out an inch. After that I was able to clear the tub with a little hammer work. This is with 1" BL.

I keep thinking to make a crossmember type mount but can't really think of a good reason. It's not like I'm changing the fluid in the tcase and there is really no reason to get in there unless the linkage pops off or something but I would rather just not have that happen. I did break my front driveshaft twice this season so probably going to make an access hole in the tub to speed that job. A hole in the skid seems like way more work and would go right thru the brace.

Having said all that. I might do a doubler transfer case this summer so all that might go out the window.
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post #12 of 13 Old 06-05-2021, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by jebmoore View Post
@bruinjeeper When you went with the Ultra UCF was there any additional modification you felt were needed? I would have the JB shorty so I am hoping I am nearly in the clear with tub modifications. Wait, just remembered your likely running an AX5 with the 2.5 so I am not sure they are close enough. Anyone else running a UCF and had mods other than a 1" MML and 1" BL. Would it be safer to just stick with the High Clearance UCF?
Actually i am running the 3 spd auto behind my 2.5"

I have always had a vision when it came to this jeep, so everything i do is usually towards some end goal that required those mods anyways.

I already had a 1" MML in as well as replaced my worn out body mounts with a 1" BL (always knowing i wanted to go completely flat or UCF ultra HC.

As you know i went with the latter, just before installing the UCF i moved from a regular SYE to a SS SYE. I have no clearance issues at the TC output/DC joint. Lots of space.

I believe the auto is "shorter" height wise than any manual (fact checkers might be along shortly to correct this statement). I do know @Awesome runs an AX15 and added the SS SYE and has no clearance issues at the output/DC joint and he is running COMPLETELY flat. He does have a 1" MML and a 1" BL. He'll chime in shortly after he has hunted his pig quote for the night.

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post #13 of 13 Old 06-06-2021, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by bruinjeeper View Post
I do know @Awesome runs an AX15 and added the SS SYE and has no clearance issues at the output/DC joint and he is running COMPLETELY flat. He does have a 1" MML and a 1" BL. He'll chime in shortly after he has hunted his pig quote for the night.
Almost stepped on pigs twice last night but the wheat was too tall and couldn't see them. The big groups we could see were about 600 yards out so we didn't get shots on them either.

But yeah, no clearance issues for me besides the one body rail/brace that needs to have a slot cut in it to clear the corner of the transfer case. Not a big deal in my opinion.
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