Swapped engine No start - JeepForum.com
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post #1 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 08:48 AM Thread Starter
WallyDog1
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Swapped engine No start

I just got the engine back in my YJ and much to my disappointment it won't start! I know It's something most likely very simple but at the moment I'm stumped.
I pulled a good running 4.0 from a 2000 XJ. Then pulled the motor from my 91 4.0 YJ . My motor ran well also but #6 rod knocked at start-up till oil pressure built up. So here's what I did and what it's doing...

I swapped all the components off the YJ motor onto the XJ motor I also did the oil filter location swap. I then installed the JK motor in my YJ.
Now after everything is back together, it cranks with the key but I have a no start condition. It has fuel pressure and the injectors are firing. I know this because pulling the fuel line off soaked me in fuel and the plugs were wet with fuel when I pulled them.
One thing that I did was to clean the inside of the distributor. It was rusty where metal can rust and very dirty. I've checked my plug connections etc. I've found nothing out of place or obviously wrong and no left over parts!
I have checked my timing marks at least 4 times . On the compression stroke for #1 cyl, my timing mark on "0" and distributor rotor facing #1.
It has a spark at the coil and at the plug ends. I know this because I zapped myself.
So the thing has spark and fuel. An interesting note I should mention is that if I crank the engine and give it a couple shots of starting fluid it will very faintly try to fire. With spark you'd think it would jump to life briefly!
I ordered a new distributor just in case I did something to the old one that I cleaned. Week spark? It didn't feel like it was week but I guess you never know. The new distributor should arrive by Friday this week or sooner.
I'm not quite sure how the ignition and fuel system operate but I hoping the distributor solves the problem.

If anyone has run into this problem I'd love to hear from you! Thanks in advance for any tips or pointers.


From the Smoky Mountains of Western North Carolina
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post #2 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 10:18 AM
jkbrereton
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Check your crank position and cam position sensors

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post #3 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 06:28 PM
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It could be as simple as your timing is a little retarded. Try turning the distributor counter clockwise. This will advance the timing. Remember that crank to cam relationship is two revolutions of crank to one revolution of cam. Same relationship is true for the distributor as it is driven by the camshaft. So 5 degrees of distributor rotation equals 10 degrees of ignition timing.

When you dropped the distributor in was it pointed at #1 before or after it dropped into the hole? The spiral cut gear causes the distributor shaft to rotate when it engages with the camshaft. It has to point at #1 AFTER it is down in the hole all the way. It will not be pointed at #1 before dropping it into the hole.

If you cannot fix it with a hammer then it has to be an electrical problem.
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post #4 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 06:41 PM
steeve555
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You did not mention year. Did you use the trigger plate (fly wheel) from old engine. Are you using Fuel injection for old engine? In certain year groups the trigger plate will only work with that system. I put a 95 engine in a 91 yj left 95 trigger plate on the 95 and there was a no start. Pulled engine swapped trigger plate, it started right up.
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post #5 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 07:52 PM
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There is also an aftermarket CPS that moves it to a special harmonic balancer instead of the flex plate or flywheel.

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post #6 of 16 Old 11-06-2019, 08:16 PM
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I'm using that set up. Got it from HESCO

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post #7 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 08:27 AM
Siva283
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SOunds like your timing might be 180 out. Are you sure you were at TDC compression on cylinder one and not on the exhaust stroke.

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post #8 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkbrereton View Post
I'm using that set up. Got it from HESCO

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I couldn't remember the name. Hesco. Sounds right.

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post #9 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 11:12 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steeve555 View Post
You did not mention year. Did you use the trigger plate (fly wheel) from old engine. Are you using Fuel injection for old engine? In certain year groups the trigger plate will only work with that system. I put a 95 engine in a 91 yj left 95 trigger plate on the 95 and there was a no start. Pulled engine swapped trigger plate, it started right up.
I'm using the whole set-up off my 91 engine. I swapped all the parts including the flywheel and clutch off my 91 4.0 5 speed AX15. The engine that is in it now is out of a 2000 Cherokee that had an automatic transmission. Both engines ran before removal.
As for the distributor being wrong, once it's dropped in at #1 position (I've checked now 6 times) the distributor is not adjustable. The distributor is fixed with the pinch bolt going through it into the block. The #1 cyl is on the compression stroke, The timing mark on the crank pulley is pointing at 0 unless this is my mistake and it should be pointing at a different #on the timing cover. It has fuel, the plugs are getting wet.
I was told to check my crank sensor. I never touched it but I'm now wondering if the bolt holes in the flywheel for a clutch and the flywheel for an automatic and the year difference reference to the same bolt holes so the sensor dowel is in the same rotation. Should I see the dowel the crank sensor sees through the sensor hole? When the engine is at TDC where is the dowel? TDC or 180 the other side.

So to sum it up the 2000 engine has ALL the parts that were on the 91. The only difference I came across was the crank shafts are different when it comes to the pilot bearing. I had to get one from Advanced Adapters. It worked great!
I'm still scratching my head

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post #10 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 11:15 AM Thread Starter
WallyDog1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steeve555 View Post
I put a 95 engine in a 91 yj left 95 trigger plate on the 95 and there was a no start. Pulled engine swapped trigger plate, it started right up.
Forgot to ask...trigger plate? The motor is back exactly as it was with a newer motor...Well...not exactly or it would be running.

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post #11 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 11:53 AM
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The 1991 YJ you have is OBD1 and swapping everything like you did should pretty much eliminate any issue with that implanted Y2K XJ motor running.

I don’t remember what the static timing is on our 4.0s but this is one of those cases where having a timing light would be a good way of affirming that number one was in the right spot by having someone crank it and you watch the timing light.

That would illuminate that possibility from the subsets. I think even Haynes manual goes through the procedure.

That you seem to have spark and fuel that leaves compression and timing. As a running motor you can guess that compression is ok.

The other issue that is surprisingly common among older newer vehicles from the 90s is cranking speed. If the battery isn’t 12.6+V especially if 11.9 or below it may not have adequate cranking speed to fire the motor. Or low volts AND cranking could drop coil primary voltage far too low for a hot, fat, blue spark.

[size=ď3Ē]Shackles & D-rings are different things.
Cranking IS turning over
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post #12 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 07:10 PM Thread Starter
WallyDog1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishadventure View Post
The 1991 YJ you have is OBD1 and swapping everything like you did should pretty much eliminate any issue with that implanted Y2K XJ motor running.

I donít remember what the static timing is on our 4.0s but this is one of those cases where having a timing light would be a good way of affirming that number one was in the right spot by having someone crank it and you watch the timing light.

That would illuminate that possibility from the subsets. I think even Haynes manual goes through the procedure.

That you seem to have spark and fuel that leaves compression and timing. As a running motor you can guess that compression is ok.

The other issue that is surprisingly common among older newer vehicles from the 90s is cranking speed. If the battery isnít 12.6+V especially if 11.9 or below it may not have adequate cranking speed to fire the motor. Or low volts AND cranking could drop coil primary voltage far too low for a hot, fat, blue spark.
Well I'm at a complete loss at the moment. I have a new distributor on order. It should arrive tomorrow. I'll go through the setup again making sure it is spot on. I'm not very confident that that is what will make it start but since I took the original one apart to clean rust and dirt out of it I'll remain hopeful. After that...
Thanks for the reply

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post #13 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 08:17 PM
Boojo35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WallyDog1 View Post
I'm using the whole set-up off my 91 engine. I swapped all the parts including the flywheel and clutch off my 91 4.0 5 speed AX15. The engine that is in it now is out of a 2000 Cherokee that had an automatic transmission. Both engines ran before removal.
As for the distributor being wrong, once it's dropped in at #1 position (I've checked now 6 times) the distributor is not adjustable. The distributor is fixed with the pinch bolt going through it into the block. The #1 cyl is on the compression stroke, The timing mark on the crank pulley is pointing at 0 unless this is my mistake and it should be pointing at a different #on the timing cover. It has fuel, the plugs are getting wet.
I was told to check my crank sensor. I never touched it but I'm now wondering if the bolt holes in the flywheel for a clutch and the flywheel for an automatic and the year difference reference to the same bolt holes so the sensor dowel is in the same rotation. Should I see the dowel the crank sensor sees through the sensor hole? When the engine is at TDC where is the dowel? TDC or 180 the other side.

So to sum it up the 2000 engine has ALL the parts that were on the 91. The only difference I came across was the crank shafts are different when it comes to the pilot bearing. I had to get one from Advanced Adapters. It worked great!
I'm still scratching my head
I am not 100% sure of your description of the pinch bolt but if it is what I think it is. Loosen it a little and the distributor should turn. I just phoned a friend that has done a few forward and backwards swaps.

I know for sure that if you loosen the distributor hold down bolt on a 91 to 95 the distributor can be rotated. Tried to verify if the mounting is different on a newer engine. I do not believe it is.

Pics of your pinch bolt might help. Peoples terminoligy and stuff can really make a phone or internet diagnosis difficult.

If you cannot fix it with a hammer then it has to be an electrical problem.
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post #14 of 16 Old 11-07-2019, 09:02 PM
jkbrereton
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I put a Cherokee EFI system on my 258 and, after reading your comment about the distributor being fixed, I remember that we had to modify it so we could turn it.

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post #15 of 16 Old 11-08-2019, 12:11 PM Thread Starter
WallyDog1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boojo35 View Post
I am not 100% sure of your description of the pinch bolt but if it is what I think it is. Loosen it a little and the distributor should turn. I just phoned a friend that has done a few forward and backwards swaps.

I know for sure that if you loosen the distributor hold down bolt on a 91 to 95 the distributor can be rotated. Tried to verify if the mounting is different on a newer engine. I do not believe it is.

Pics of your pinch bolt might help. Peoples terminoligy and stuff can really make a phone or internet diagnosis difficult.
I'll use the word clamp instead...The distributor has an ear on it that locates it. The clamp that tightens the distributor in the TDC position goes through it making it not adjustable.
Here's a pic...
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