superchips vs. Procal - Page 2 - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep Wrangler Forums > JK Wrangler Technical Forum > superchips vs. Procal

Dual Color LED Light Bars White/AmberFS: 2007-2013 Jeep Wrangler "HALO" Angel Eye KitTHE NEW! VANCO DUAL MODE 15/16″ Big Brake Kit w/Bla

Reply
Unread 03-11-2010, 09:30 AM   #16
MrOrange
Registered User
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 885
I think everyone goes through this dilemma. The Flashpaq will give you a slight increase in gas mileage, but nothing major. Also, the Procal lets you straighten the wheel. Personally, I'm going with the Flashpaq once I have the money because I wanted the performance boost. It's not for drag racing, just wanting whatever little bump I can so that my cruise control doesn't need to downshift on steeper overpasses.

__________________
'09 X Unlimited, 4WD, auto, half-doors, soft-top
RC 2.5" Series II BB, JKS Quick Discos, JKS adjustable front track bar
15x8 Unique 297 (Soft 8), Goodyear MTR/Kevlar 35x12.50R15
5.13 gears, ARB front locker, Currie front shafts
Bushwacker flat flares, Rubicon rails with steps added
MrOrange is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 10:21 AM   #17
asknight
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Southwest, Arkansas
Posts: 2,193
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattman8706 View Post
thats where I am at...

$120 or $350...
$285 delivered.
asknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 10:22 AM   #18
asknight
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Southwest, Arkansas
Posts: 2,193
Quote:
Originally Posted by PartyBarge View Post
Spend the $120. I've never seen anyone with the Superchips brag about all their "newfound power" while on the trail doing 5mph.
Then they weren't running the crawl tune.
asknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 11:09 AM   #19
McKBrew
Registered User
JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Hayden, Idaho
Posts: 2,743
If it's a money issue and you only want the basic features, then get the Procal.

Only reason I got the Superchips is because I had a little extra money now and after reading the numerous threads about it, decided it was the way to go.

Even if the only thing I get out of it besides reprogramming for tire change/no TPMS is that it gets rid of that throttle lag then it's worth an extra $140-160 bucks to me.
McKBrew is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 12:17 PM   #20
mattman8706
Web Wheeler
 
mattman8706's Avatar
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Lawrence, KS
Posts: 4,558
so I wonder if the extra power would be worth it for driving in the mountains.

what does everyone think? If it is worth it I will go with the superchip if it isn't I will probably just save my money and get a procal
__________________
-Matt

My Build Thread
JK Tech
mattman8706 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 12:21 PM   #21
asknight
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Southwest, Arkansas
Posts: 2,193
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattman8706 View Post
so I wonder if the extra power would be worth it for driving in the mountains.

what does everyone think? If it is worth it I will go with the superchip if it isn't I will probably just save my money and get a procal
I believe it's worth it. I debated the two for about a month reading everything I could find, just like you're doing now, and chose the Flashpaq and am thrilled with it.
asknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 12:25 PM   #22
asknight
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Southwest, Arkansas
Posts: 2,193
Quote:
Originally Posted by owtdorz View Post
I bought the Procal.
The price was right and chip performance is not worth it to me.
Besides I know of 3 vehicles that fried the ECU because of chips.
I like my Lifetime Warranty.
Please provide the names and phone numbers of the owners of the 3 vehicles which the Superchips Flashpaq fried the ECU. I want to hear their story first hand.

The fact is that if the Flashpaq can fry the ECU, so can the Procal. They are both a programmer, not a piggyback or replacement "chip."

I thought this thread was "Superchips vs. Procal"
asknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 01:13 PM   #23
IPB
Registered User
2007 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: RI
Posts: 289
I just grabbed a procal recently. Mainly to fix the stearing wheel/ESP issue.
I did the reprogram for gears(4.10's) and I did the reprogram for tires(315/75/16's). The jeep feels just like it did when I had 32's and my milage has not gone down at all. Yes there is still lag, but whatever it's a jeep. I can tell the tranny is shifting much better, and it never drops down while cruising on the highway at 65-70.
__________________
Rescue Green 07 JK Unlimited X 4" Skyjacker LA kit, pro comp 7069's wrapped in 315/75/16's.
05 Legacy Wagon 2.5GT Limited
07 Raptor 700 (mine)
02 Sportsman 400 4x4 (the wifes)
IPB is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 01:48 PM   #24
Xtremjeepn
Registered User
2008 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,140
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrOrange View Post
I The Flashpaq will give you a slight increase in gas mileage, .

With all the CAFE standards that Chrysler has to go through don't you think they would eek out all the MPG they could if it was as simple as tuning a computer they had to design from scratch?

I would like to see actual proof of the mileage increase. These claims are usually just that, claims, not facts.
__________________
Cole Ford
Xtremjeepn is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 01:59 PM   #25
mattman8706
Web Wheeler
 
mattman8706's Avatar
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Lawrence, KS
Posts: 4,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtremjeepn View Post
With all the CAFE standards that Chrysler has to go through don't you think they would eek out all the MPG they could if it was as simple as tuning a computer they had to design from scratch?

I would like to see actual proof of the mileage increase. These claims are usually just that, claims, not facts.
that's kind of what I have been thinking......
__________________
-Matt

My Build Thread
JK Tech
mattman8706 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-11-2010, 02:44 PM   #26
MrOrange
Registered User
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 885
The only flaw in this logic is that you're assuming the engineers have full control over the design. A lot of times it's a compromise between what the engineers come up with and what the bean counters approve. There are alot of decisions that are made that are solely to help increase satisfaction/sales. That is why the exhaust on all modern vehicles is significantly quieter than compared to aftermarket systems. Even stock intake systems are designed to minimize the noise of the air entering the throttle body. When it comes to tuning the computer, they have to leave some room for the common person who isn't going to take proper care of their vehicle to be able to abuse it and have it still be reliable. Just look at how rich most modern vehicles run. There's always room for improvements, but the balancing act is to make it cost efficient yet still desirable. I definitely think there's room for improvement in any vehicles fuel/ignition timing; some more than others. Just look at turbocharged vehicles from the factory. Everyone knows you can install a manual boost controller and slightly increase the boost pressure to produce more power. Why wouldn't the factory just increase it for you? It's the balancing act.

JP magazine did an unofficial test on programmers and found a slight increase in gas mileage. But they used real world testing which has plenty of errors and factors to consider. I guess if someone had a rolling dyno and didn't mind the abuse, a vehicle could be loaded up and tested in a controlled environment for hard, measured data.
__________________
'09 X Unlimited, 4WD, auto, half-doors, soft-top
RC 2.5" Series II BB, JKS Quick Discos, JKS adjustable front track bar
15x8 Unique 297 (Soft 8), Goodyear MTR/Kevlar 35x12.50R15
5.13 gears, ARB front locker, Currie front shafts
Bushwacker flat flares, Rubicon rails with steps added
MrOrange is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-12-2010, 06:47 AM   #27
mattman8706
Web Wheeler
 
mattman8706's Avatar
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Lawrence, KS
Posts: 4,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrOrange View Post
The only flaw in this logic is that you're assuming the engineers have full control over the design. A lot of times it's a compromise between what the engineers come up with and what the bean counters approve. There are alot of decisions that are made that are solely to help increase satisfaction/sales. That is why the exhaust on all modern vehicles is significantly quieter than compared to aftermarket systems. Even stock intake systems are designed to minimize the noise of the air entering the throttle body. When it comes to tuning the computer, they have to leave some room for the common person who isn't going to take proper care of their vehicle to be able to abuse it and have it still be reliable. Just look at how rich most modern vehicles run. There's always room for improvements, but the balancing act is to make it cost efficient yet still desirable. I definitely think there's room for improvement in any vehicles fuel/ignition timing; some more than others. Just look at turbocharged vehicles from the factory. Everyone knows you can install a manual boost controller and slightly increase the boost pressure to produce more power. Why wouldn't the factory just increase it for you? It's the balancing act.

JP magazine did an unofficial test on programmers and found a slight increase in gas mileage. But they used real world testing which has plenty of errors and factors to consider. I guess if someone had a rolling dyno and didn't mind the abuse, a vehicle could be loaded up and tested in a controlled environment for hard, measured data.
hmm well a little more gas mileage would be great. Even if it is just in my head





bump for more thought about this.
__________________
-Matt

My Build Thread
JK Tech
mattman8706 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-12-2010, 10:44 AM   #28
asknight
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Southwest, Arkansas
Posts: 2,193
The OEM programming is a "safe and cautious" timing and fuel/air mixture program that covers all environmental conditions that the vehicle will ever be subjected to wherever the vehicle is sold in the world. In order to be able to send the OEM vehicle anywhere in the world and to have it perform acceptably, some of the performance and efficiency is handicapped.

Truthfully, in most moderate climates at lower altitudes, you can safely advance the timing and lean out the F/A mixture a considerable amount before predetonation pinging occurs. As with any electronically programmed or carbureted vehicle, you must pay attention to your engine and know when pinging occurs and back off timing advance when it does.

I've paid close attention to my JK after programming it with the 91 performance tune. I run Shell 93 octane. I have no pinging under acceleration or load, and due to the leaner burning programming increased fuel economy is realized. The key is to pay attention to your catalytic converter temps to be sure you're not running too aggressive/lean. The Flashpaq can monitor this temp for you during testing. Mine stays in the neighborhood of 1100-1200 degrees which is within specification.

I need to remeasure cat temps during the heat of summer and keep a keen ear on pinging when the ambient temps rise in a few months. If either occurs, I will back the tuning down to the 87 performance tune. I'm not expecting any pinging whatsoever, but I do think the cat temps will rise a little.

If you are the type of person who doesn't work on your own rig and aren't technically or mechanically inclined, I would say stick to the 87 performance tune, or the factory tune altogether.

Humidity, altitude, and temperature are key factors in tuning a vehicle. The factory tune is the best possible to cover the widest range of climate conditions. From -50F in the north, to +130 in the Middle East, from 5% humidity in the desert, to 100% of the pacific northwest.

Where I am, the temperature is continually moderate with mild seasons and hot summers. Humidity is relatively constant (high) and altitude is 400-600ft above sea level in most of my area. The factory tune is set to cover sea level-10k feet, IIRC. By shrinking that window of altitude compatibility, increased performance can be obtained, to put it in layman's terms.
asknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-12-2010, 10:49 AM   #29
mattman8706
Web Wheeler
 
mattman8706's Avatar
2009 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Lawrence, KS
Posts: 4,558
I am not afraid to work on my jeep so that isn't a problem.


I don't really understand the 87, 91, and 93 tune though. What is the difference?

Are they meant for 87 octane 91 octane and 93 octane?

Why would you use 93 octane when its tuned to 91.



someone explain that. I am not too saavy on the performance aspect of vehicles.
__________________
-Matt

My Build Thread
JK Tech
mattman8706 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-12-2010, 10:49 AM   #30
PartyBarge
Registered User
2008 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Costa Mesa
Posts: 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattman8706 View Post

bump for more thought about this.
Unless you add cylinders, the only "gain" you will see is the seat-of-your-pants effect. Same for those guys that say they felt a "boost" when they added a new hi-lift jack. Adrenaline is a mofo.

Will a SuperChips fix some "throttle lag"? Maybe - but so would weight reduction.

You are driving a > 4,000 pound behemoth with a squirrel for a 3.8L. My Jeep comes in at a respectable 4,870 pounds and still manage to pass people on the freeway.
__________________
Make way - the Party Barge is coming through.
PartyBarge is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


Suggested Threads





Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.