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Unread 02-18-2013, 07:18 PM   #631
Jetfixer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetfixer View Post
2012 2DR Sport. Ticked on driver side from day one. Dealer replaced lifters at 3K miles but would not replace the cylinder head due to no CEL fault and some denial of the issue. Tick remained after lifter install. Yesterday at 20,400 mi, CEL light came on. Dealer diagnosed as cylinder misfire. Service Mgr says they've seen all of the ones with bad cylinder heads throw a CEL at between 16K-20K miles. New cylinder head in stock and being replaced. Fingers crossed...
Update: Checked in on it mid repair (dealer provided rental car). Pretty big job. Lots of parts removed and replaced. Pretty scary but, after working on jet aircraft for years, it didn't bother me too much. Picked it up today. Sounds great. Runs great. And no leaks. So far, so good. Hopefully nothing more to report.


Last edited by Jetfixer; 02-18-2013 at 07:20 PM.. Reason: sp
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Unread 03-01-2013, 10:52 PM   #632
djm
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My turn ....my 2012 JKU is in the shop for a new head. CEl and the oil change required memo came on around 14,900 miles while on a long (750 mile ) trip. This was the first real road trip for the new jeep, drove 14 hours 750 miles from NJ to Tennessee, spent a few days local driving around Tennessee and then back home 750 miles to NJ. The trip down was a pretty steady with the CC set at 70mph, the ride home had a substantial portion of 40 mph driving on the interstate because of snow. About 75 miles from home the CEL and oil change required message appeared. I tried to check the CEL code and instead of reading it I apparently just cleared it. I drove the rest of the way home without issue, after about 50 miles local driving the CEL came on again. I took it in to the dealer, no problems at all, gave me a rental car, told me the head had to be replaced. My dealer service mgr said he stocks the head because he is replacing so many of them. I believe he said he is allowed 2 a week, and he orders them if he needs them or not so he has them when he does need them. He is the warranty dealer for the State Motor Pool so he has thousands of vehicles he does the warranty work on.

Not being a mechanic ..how much work is involved ? Are there a lot of parts that have to be taken off the old head and installed on the new head or is it like one complete unit ?


Thanks


Dan - NJ
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Unread 03-01-2013, 11:12 PM   #633
badtux
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Originally Posted by djm View Post
My turn ....my 2012 JKU 14,900 miles
Not being a mechanic ..how much work is involved ? Are there a lot of parts that have to be taken off the old head and installed on the new head or is it like one complete unit ?
Alldata tells me it's a 12.3 hour job (book rate, generally measured as amount of time it takes for a mechanic who has never done that particular head replacement before), meaning it's still an all-day job for an experienced mechanic who's done it before.

Let's see, just looking at the underhood of my Jeep, spark coil packs, fuel line for the injector manifold , intake manifold and throttle body, exhaust pipe, accessory belt, timing chain cover, timing chains (there's two on the driver's side if I recall correctly), cylinder head cover, and finally you can remove the cylinder head. Internally the only parts they would possibly remove and reuse would be the camshafts and the hydraulic lash adjusters and I believe those are already part of the assembly. Things are complicated somewhat by the fact that the cams have cam phasers on the end for the VVT and there's various sensors and such too, not to mention that some of the accessory bolts may go into the head meaning that the power steering pump in particular needs to be removed according to Alldata...
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Unread 03-02-2013, 03:10 AM   #634
djm
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Badtux ....

thanks ....explains why they told me Friday afternoon that they will try and have it ready for me by Tuesday. Reading you post had my head spinning, a lot of work, thankfully its all warranty work.


Dan - NJ
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Unread 03-02-2013, 10:52 AM   #635
badtux
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My post actually simplified it a bit. The procedure in Alldata to do a head replacement is way long and I stopped reading after the first page(!). And Alldata usually doesn't do "long" procedures, most of their procedures read more like "remove component X, remove component Y, then remove and replace component Z and replace components X and Y." I.e., not much detail, they just assume you know how to remove/replace just by looking at the component. (And in fairness, usually that's true).

In short, I'm very happy that this problem is happening during the warranty period. The TJ folks with the 2005/2006 TJ's whose OPDA is crapping out at around 80K miles and taking out the camshaft with it are SOL because they're out of warranty, but it's just as much a design flaw as this problem. Let's hope us PentaJesus owners don't have another design flaw like that which shows up after 60K miles...
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Unread 03-02-2013, 01:45 PM   #636
blackjeep05
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badtux View Post
My post actually simplified it a bit. The procedure in Alldata to do a head replacement is way long and I stopped reading after the first page(!). And Alldata usually doesn't do "long" procedures, most of their procedures read more like "remove component X, remove component Y, then remove and replace component Z and replace components X and Y." I.e., not much detail, they just assume you know how to remove/replace just by looking at the component. (And in fairness, usually that's true).

In short, I'm very happy that this problem is happening during the warranty period. The TJ folks with the 2005/2006 TJ's whose OPDA is crapping out at around 80K miles and taking out the camshaft with it are SOL because they're out of warranty, but it's just as much a design flaw as this problem. Let's hope us PentaJesus owners don't have another design flaw like that which shows up after 60K miles...
Well the OPDA isn't as big as what some make it out to be. I have 100k on mine with no problems never even had it out.
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Unread 06-17-2013, 08:57 AM   #637
JKUnlimitedgirl
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Well I finally got my Head replaced by the dealer under warranty after arguing with my mechanic, the lady that books my appointments, and the service manager. The mechanic thought the ticking noise was from my clutch, which gives me very little confidence in the mechanics at my dealer.. I told the mechanic it is not my clutch because when you push in on the clutch and engage the pressure plate the noise stays the same, but he wanted to change it.. Of course chrystler would not approve it. Before they replaced the head, they tried changing the oil and said the mechanics may have put the wrong oil in it. Then, they tried the lifters which of course did not fix the ticking noise. I have since had a door panel replaced, because it had something wrong with it.. My e-brake replaced (gear shifter due to the mechanic busting it up while changing out my e-brake), air blower motor replaced, and now about to have the air blower motor resistor replaced (for the same issue.. not sure why they are trying a new part since the first one fixed the issue for about a month or two). I have had so many issues with my jeep that I tried calling chrysler to fill out a complaint which lead to me telling the girl forget it I will just get a lawyer and file lemon law or trade for a chevy or something that will at least be reliable. She had nothing to say. You would think a company would want to send out quality products, like they used to with the older bodystyle jeeps. I am 100% over my jeep and ready to sell/trade. I am over going back to the dealer for a new problem or re-occuring problem every two months, when I have only had my jeep a little over a year.

Has anyone else noticed 2012 JK wranglers being traded after a year with very few miles on them where y'all live?
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Unread 06-17-2013, 09:32 AM   #638
mike95376
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http://www.pentastars.com/engines/tech.php
Just some interesting reading about Pentatstars. i.e.., the 3.6L V6 in the Jeep.
Like all the specific details about the head problem. Click on tab marked "Repairs".

Last edited by mike95376; 06-17-2013 at 09:45 AM..
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Unread 06-17-2013, 09:52 AM   #639
badtux
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Has anyone else noticed 2012 JK wranglers being traded after a year with very few miles on them where y'all live?
I know someone who did that, but it was because he bought a Wrangler Sport and realized what he really wanted, after he attended one of our Jeep club meetings, was a Rubicon.

Around here low-end Sports are on the market all the time when people bought them because they looked cool, and then realized that, well, yes, it looks cool, but it's still a Jeep with all that implies -- mushy handling, cramped interior, drinks gas like it's free, and so forth. They usually trade it in on a CSUV (Car-based SUV). But you will *never* find a recently used Rubicon on the market. Seems that people who buy Jeeps to use them as Jeeps realize there's nothing else on the market like a Jeep Wrangler. Alas. (Because having no real competition has led Chiseler to taking the Wrangler fans for granted).

Note that out here in the West, we don't have "mudder" pickup trucks like Back East, because we do rock crawling, not mudding. We need narrow vehicles to fit between the rocks, not big fat tires and 500 horsepower engines to churn mud. So maybe that's the difference...
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Unread 08-01-2013, 05:12 PM   #640
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Just had mine fixed at 38k, which most '12 owners probably aren't at yet (I drive a lot for work and did a lot of traveling last year). Based on various threads and discussions, it seemed like most folks having this problem experienced the ticking noise and/or CEL misfire codes early on.

After hitting 20k miles with no issues, I figured I was in the clear. My first indication of the problem via a CEL happened around 35k, lasted a day, then turned off and was fine for a couple months. After a while it came back on, would disappear, but then return shortly after. This pattern repeated until eventually the CEL just stayed on.

Had the PCM flashed, CEL stayed off for a day, popped back on, and that's when it went in for the repair.

So, just a heads up... if your Wrangler was built in the late summer of 2011, you haven't had any problems, and you're still in the 15-25k mileage range, there's a pretty good chance you'll have this problem soon.
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Unread 08-01-2013, 05:23 PM   #641
DBA2GO
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Just had mine fixed at 38k ...
Did they give you any problem on being over 36K miles, warranty wise?
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Unread 08-01-2013, 05:34 PM   #642
badtux
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It's a 5 year/100K mile drivetrain warranty on my 2012.
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Unread 08-01-2013, 05:43 PM   #643
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Did they give you any problem on being over 36K miles, warranty wise?
I got a TON of bull**** from the two local dealerships in town, but that came as no surprise to me. I have yet to have either of them service any of the Jeeps I've owned under warranty without giving me grief, not getting the job done right the first time, or screwing something else up in the process.

I mentioned this is another thread, but one dealership won't even touch my Jeep because it's lifted. The other dealership wanted to pull apart my engine, swap heads and do a bunch of other pointless crap to see if a different misfire code appeared, charge me up the *** for it, then consider the PCM flash.

I also tried taking my Jeep to a Dodge dealership and they had no problem doing the flash, but they wanted to keep the Jeep for a week to do a 15 minute job.

I've got a trusty dealership that's always been good to me, but they're outside of town (and county). However, they took care of both the PCM flash and the subsequent repair under the powertrain warranty.
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Unread 08-02-2013, 01:56 AM   #644
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I was one event from a lemon claim on my 2012 JKUR, the p0304 code being last straw. Went in and talked with service manager, asked them for help with dealer sales manager. We all sat down and I detailed the issues, 20 in 13 months, two repeatable for three events each (29 days at dealer), I pleaded that this vehicle was completely unable to meet my desire of a reliable vehicle. To my shock, the sales manager agreed, agreed to make it work and would I like a 2013? So, I'm now in a 2013 JKR w/3 inch lift and 35's. Not even at 300 miles on the ODO, getting 19MPG with 35's in town. I couldn't break 15MPG in a stock tired JKU driving like a granny after 15,000 miles. It appears in my case, mileage was a leading indicator. Very pleased with dealer, but I will state, this is Mopars last chance.
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Unread 08-02-2013, 01:47 PM   #645
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The amount of power I've regained is substantial. I was losing a good 35% of compression in that cylinder prior to the repair. After driving it around all afternoon yesterday and today, it definitely feels smoother, runs better, and doesn't have that slight hesitation when putting it into 1st or 2nd gear. So far, so good.

My only consideration for going with a '13 is that damned sexy Commando Green color, but I love my '12 too much and aside from the TOB and this engine problem, I've had a blast driving and wheeling it and it's given me no trouble on the trail.
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