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Unread 09-08-2010, 09:27 PM   #16
IrishLillard
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snap thanks buddy I think i'm going to get this for her...

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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:05 AM   #17
mthomp83
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so apparently the thread was derailed.....has anyone purchased this kit and used it and have any feedback?!?!

i have been seriously looking at this kit too so i'd like to hear any positive or negative feedback
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:32 AM   #18
frankie945
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I just talked my friend out of buying this kit. Got him into a 3.5 Rock Krawler kit. I would never own a Rough Country product. If you want Cheap quality go with RC.
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:34 AM   #19
mthomp83
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why is it cheap quality though?

do you have the kit yourself or have you had this specific kit in the past? have you run it on your JK?

the rock krawler lifts are nice for 3x the price....
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:38 AM   #20
JelloJeep
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Yeah I would be interested in hearing some specifics of why people don't like the RC stuff. I am in the market for a lift also. What about their stuff makes it "cheap"? I'm thinking quality, not price.
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:44 AM   #21
frankie945
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Every jeep I've been in with a rc lift rode really rough for one. The shocks suck. And both had spring sag over time. You get what u pay for. And if your driving a 20k and up jeep why put a cheap lift on that u will probably end up ditching down the road for a better one. Just do it right the first go.
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:57 AM   #22
qf4phlyer
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I have a 2.5" RC progressive rate lift kit with their 2.2 shocks, and 1.25" body lift. I have 30,000 miles on this lift and it hasn't failed me. It works very well on and off road. Over 30 years of Jeeps, with many manufactures lifts, springs, and shocks, I have found this kit to be a good value and performer.
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Unread 09-09-2010, 07:57 AM   #23
mthomp83
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ok, i'm sorry, i'm not trying to question your judgement but you aren't making a compelling argument about why Rough Country is not good quality

are the parts made of substandard materials? does RC not warranty their parts? was the sag a result of the quality of lift or of usage (if the springs sag even after no offroad usage, i would be concerned)? why do the shocks suck? i have heard nothing but good things about the 2.0 shocks....are you basing your assumption on the previous shocks on cheaper subpar RC kits?
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Unread 09-09-2010, 08:04 AM   #24
planman
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Quality kits from Currie, Clayton, Teraflex, Rock Krawler, Poly Performance, etc. all cost about the same for a reason. They use similar quality tubing, joints, bushings, brakelines, springs, etc.

If you could hold an RC arm im one hand and a Teraflex or Currie in the other to compare the weight, powdercoating, bushings, joint ends, etc., you would easily be able to tell the difference.

RC may try to say there is no difference in quality and that the difference in price is only due to factory direct sales and limited sponsorships.

Does anyone really believe that?
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Unread 09-09-2010, 08:22 AM   #25
mthomp83
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so there is no empirical evidence that suggests that RC is worse (or better for that matter) than any other manufacturer out there?

i'm still not seeing anyone show objectively that the quality of materials is less than other manufacturers
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Unread 09-09-2010, 09:13 AM   #26
planman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomp83 View Post
so there is no empirical evidence that suggests that RC is worse (or better for that matter) than any other manufacturer out there?

i'm still not seeing anyone show objectively that the quality of materials is less than other manufacturers
The ones to do it would be the magazines, and they aren't going to show a major advertiser in a negative light.

One way to inspect the difference would be to attend a vendor show with several manufacturers present, but I don't think RC participates in those.

Another way would be for the companies to actually release the specs of their products (DOM thickness, strength ratings of their ends, etc.), but they won't do that.

Because I was going to run a set of wheel spacers to fit my 40s, I had a pair of RC wheel spacers sent to a lab for testing. The results were that the strength of their spacers was less than most wheels, and the studs they used were more like a grade 5 than a grade 8. So that would be empirical.

The anecdotal evidence is on the forums from people who ran their progressive springs that sagged, their ubber stiff for a 2 door JK 2.2 shocks who switched, their minimalist trackbar relocation brackets that resulted in ripped off factory trackbar brackets, etc., etc.

A high quality 3.5" to 4" lift from Clayton, Currie, JKS, Rock Krawler, etc., sells for around $2,000 compared to RC's 4" kit at $1200.

Do you really believe they used the same quality materials and processes to manufacture the components when they are the lone company selling their product for that much less?
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Unread 09-09-2010, 09:46 AM   #27
mthomp83
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first of all, we aren't talking about wheel spacers here, we are talking about one specific lift from RC, although i HIGHLY doubt that you actually took wheel spacers to a lab to have them tested, it would prove empirically that the wheel spacers may be of lesser quality than other wheel spacers assuming that you had those tested as well

second of all, there are MANY things that go into pricing a product, not just material costs...it's counterintuitive to say that just because the product costs less, that it is of lesser quality

is there anyone who actually has had or used this kit and has any feedback not bashing RC without any actual proof as to why it is of lesser quality than any other 3.5" kit?
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Unread 09-09-2010, 10:24 AM   #28
planman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomp83 View Post
i HIGHLY doubt that you actually took wheel spacers to a lab to have them tested...
I shipped them to the lab instead of carrying them.

Here is a copy and paste of my post on JKF about it:

I anticipated needing wheel spacers to run 40s on my 4.5" backspaced Walker Evans beadlocks.

I ended up buying Spidertrax 1.5" wheel spacers.

Here is why:

Back in May I ordered a pair of Rough Country wheel spacers to have them tested.

A set of 4 would be $138 shipped instead of $199 shipped for the Spidertrax spacers.

I had run Spidertrax spacers on my 04 TJ for about 4 years with no problems, but I was curious.

It wasn't about the money. I was just curious. I am just an overanalytical financial planner with an expensive family hobby.

So, I ordered 1 pair of the RC spacers and had them shipped off to be analyzed. I didn't even open the box. I just forwarded them.

Then, I found out the specs of the Spidertrax spacers for comparison.

Here is the summary of the analysis of the RC spacers:
  • The 6061-T6 aluminum has a tensile strength of 31,400 psi. (The Spidertrax spacers have a 45,000 psi.)
  • Although the wheel studs have head markings suggesting they are Grade 8, the material and hardness supports they conform to Grade 5 or less. (The Spidertrax spacer studs conform to Grade 8 or better.)

So the analysis of the spacers answered the $61 question about why the RC spacers cost less than the Spidertrax spacers. The aluminum has a substantially lower tensile strength and studs that do not conform to Grade 8 hardness.

I am actually kind of shocked by the 1/3 less spacer strength and lower quality studs.

I am sure they are fine for a spare, but I question the liability of running the lower strength design on vehicles RC knows will be driven down the highway at 80 mph on oversize tires with families onboard--all to be able to undercut Spidertrax by $61.

Here is the analysis:





And here is a relevant post quoted regarding the Spidertrax spacers:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Widewing View Post
In another thread, I chronicled how we performed an FEA (Finite Element Analysis) on a Spidertrax spacer (1.5") and a factory Moab wheel.

"I recently installed a set of 1.5" Spidertrax spacers. However, prior to doing so, I took one of them, along with my spare wheel, into our engineering lab.

We modeled both in 3D using the latest NX CAD software. We did this by reverse engineering. That means taking all dimensions and determining the materials.

We identified the wheel material as alloy 356-T6. The spacers are made from 6061-T6 alloy. 356-T6 has tensile strength of 30,000 PSI. 6061-T6 has a tensile strength of 45,000 PSI. This means that in reference to the basic materials, the spacer is 50% stronger than the wheel for a given thickness, and the spacer is much thicker in section.

We ran an extremely complex finite element analysis of both to determine where peak stresses are and where each component is most likely to fail. The result is what I expected. In short, spacers are not the weak link. The wheel itself is 2x more likely to fail under severe loading than the well designed spacer.

Now, let me qualify our findings. Our corporate engineering team has designed significant portions of the Airbus A350 landing gear system. We engineered the latest landing gear system for the Boeing CH-47. Our hardware is on the F-35, F/A-18, F-16 and a number of other aircraft.

This same engineering team has analyzed the Spirdertrax spacers and concluded that they are extremely strong, stronger than they need to be. Over engineered. These spacers are utterly safe if installed properly. Like an offset wheel, they may accelerate bearing wear, but the offset is so little as to be of no great significance.

I installed the spacers very carefully. Not knowing specifically what brand and type of threadlocker compound was provided with the spacers, I tossed it and used Loctite 271 Red. Each spacer was torqued to recommended specs in a star pattern. The wheel was then installed and torqued to 95 lb/ft.

After about 150 miles, I pulled off the rear wheels and checked the spacer lug nut torque. No change... I'll re-check torque at each tire rotation.

Installed correctly, Spidertrax wheel spacers are not only safe, they're stronger than the wheels you bolt to them."

I didn't mention that we found areas of stress concentration in the factory wheels. We were able to pinpoint the most likely location of failure. I'll explain where that is...

The Factory Moabs have spotfaces milled into the wheel hub to provide clearance for assembly washers used during manufacture to secure the brake rotors on the hub prior to final assembly. Using an endmill, each lug hole is spotfaced on the inside (think of a spotface as a shallow counterbore). The edges and corners of these spotfaces are quite sharp. This is where the FEA predicted the greatest concentration of stress. Unfortunately, this is also adjacent to the where the studs transmit all rotational torque into the wheel. The failure to radius edges and corners is what leads to stress concentration. If your Moab is going to fail at the hub, it will crack at a spotface.

In short, Tom and Eddie at Spidertrax have designed and engineered a very high quality spacer, that if properly installed, will provide you with many years of problem free and safe use.
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Unread 09-09-2010, 10:32 AM   #29
mthomp83
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that's a very good write up. thanks for sharing the information, i'll be sure not to purchase RC wheel spacers in the future if i need them. sorry for doubting you, it just seemed like it would probably cost more to have the spacers analyzed by a lab than they actually cost

however, still looking for someone's feedback that has this kit :-/
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Unread 09-09-2010, 10:38 AM   #30
Croce
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Heard alot of good reviews about this lift on another forum.. Guess it comes with a Non progressive springs. Has a lifetime warranty (Except control arm bushings) and RC has great customer service too. I think if your in the $500 range for a kit, its a good deal compared to others such as Rancho for the same price, which has no front control arms
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