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Unread 11-18-2010, 11:05 AM   #121
tennistom1
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Originally Posted by paul84043 View Post
Not really in this case....the dealer does make the rules to a large extent. Jeep does not have a hard fast pass/fail criteria for warranty repairs, just like they don't for mods causing issues. In reality, the dealer can pretty much warranty anything they want. It just depends on how they feel about you, the day, if they argued with the g/f that morning, the phase of the moon etc....

I believe the dealer gets reimbursed from Chrysler for warranty work and the dealer wouldn't get paid if the work wasn't approved by Chrysler.

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Unread 11-18-2010, 11:15 AM   #122
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Would not have happened if you had outfitted your JK like this:
raidercleanforweb.jpg  
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Unread 11-18-2010, 11:16 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by paul84043 View Post
Gotcha, didn't realize that JK's were running different engines....
The air intake does seem to be in an iffy spot, seems to me that if water were to be forced up against the hood, it would actually channel it right to the air intake....
That is exactly the case. Open the hood of the JK. Look just in front of the air box inlet. There is a gap between the fender and the grill. There is also a gap in the fender liner there. Anything going up into the front of the fender will end up being deflected by the hood directly into the airbox. In the OP's video, the hard splash entering the puddle could have easily given the airbox a good drink of muddy water. Snorkel has now moved up the upgrade list.

EDIT: After looking at the video again, it looks like water is being channeled up through the front of the fender the entire time OP is in the water. I quick fix would be to add a piece of rubber mat as a baffle to the opening between the grill and fender. That's the opening that would be getting the water in.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 12:37 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by paul84043 View Post
Not really in this case....the dealer does make the rules to a large extent. Jeep does not have a hard fast pass/fail criteria for warranty repairs, just like they don't for mods causing issues. In reality, the dealer can pretty much warranty anything they want. It just depends on how they feel about you, the day, if they argued with the g/f that morning, the phase of the moon etc....
That is false..................

If a dealership does a repair under warranty they have to submit a claim to Chrysler to get paid back,they also must keep the part(s) for something like 90 days as Chrysler sometimes will call for that failed part to inspect.Also the regional reps like to grap the warranty claim paperwork and go through the dealers warranty parts storage room often when they show up unexpected.On something major like a engine a regional rep will be involved and they are very strict and do not work for any dealership but for Chrysler and if they say no then it's no go on the warranty.So basically if the dealership has any doubt that the claim will be denied they either get a regional rep involved or deny it if it is a high dollar repair like a engine,if it's a $20 part they will just replace it and not worry.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 01:54 PM   #125
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Oh i agree... I would do my best to check everything out for signs of damage, maybe even drop the pan and see...

at the least, draining the oil will let you know if water actually got in the engine or not, right?

If the inside of the air box is dry and there is no signs of sand/mud remnants, then you have a pretty decent indication that water didn't get in through the intake.

I bet we are just going to find out that this was an electrical issue.

I get the feeling that the OP didn't look for or didn't know what to look for as far as signs of water ingestion. I could be wrong, but I suspect this to be the situation. I'm like you, I would love to have been able to take a look see under the hood of this Jeek. It sucks that it happened, but hopefully, this will all lead to helping other Jeepers prevent damaging their engine.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 03:18 PM   #126
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That is false..................

If a dealership does a repair under warranty they have to submit a claim to Chrysler to get paid back,they also must keep the part(s) for something like 90 days as Chrysler sometimes will call for that failed part to inspect.Also the regional reps like to grap the warranty claim paperwork and go through the dealers warranty parts storage room often when they show up unexpected.On something major like a engine a regional rep will be involved and they are very strict and do not work for any dealership but for Chrysler and if they say no then it's no go on the warranty.So basically if the dealership has any doubt that the claim will be denied they either get a regional rep involved or deny it if it is a high dollar repair like a engine,if it's a $20 part they will just replace it and not worry.
Not to be argumentative but it's absolutely 100% true. I'm not arguing the semantics, I'm stating a fact.
It's all in the way the service manager decides to (or doesn't) write up the failure. I have personally had service managers tell me point blank that they will warrant items that did not fail under warranty. That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer. The service manager is awesome. So far that has brought me back for three vehicles. Treating your customers well pays big dividends.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 03:28 PM   #127
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Not to be argumentative but it's absolutely 100% true. I'm not arguing the semantics, I'm stating a fact.
It's all in the way the service manager decides to (or doesn't) write up the failure. I have personally had service managers tell me point blank that they will warrant items that did not fail under warranty. That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer. The service manager is awesome. So far that has brought me back for three vehicles. Treating your customers well pays big dividends.


It has been years since I worked in a Dealership, but back in the day, when there was a large item such as an engine, transmission, axle, etc., the Dealership had to secure pre-authorization which meant that the District Manager would come to the Dealership and inspect the damage before giving the authorization for warranty to cover item. I can't imagine in these times that a automobile manufacturer would not review such claims with a very large magnifying glass.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 04:01 PM   #128
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That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer.


VW is one of the most successful car manufacturers on the planet--Chrysler isn't. It's been having bankruptcy problems for at least a generation with many owners--Fiat/tax-payer, Cerberus, Mercedes, and a tax-payer bailout years before they became popular.

Given that, they can't afford to be as generous with warranty claims. I wish I even had a Jeep dealer near me. There's not one within sixty miles of me now. The two I've bought Jeeps from over the years have both shut down. I'm glad mine haven't had any issues and I'm taking it slow through the puddles this winter.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 04:12 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by paul84043 View Post
Not to be argumentative but it's absolutely 100% true. I'm not arguing the semantics, I'm stating a fact.
It's all in the way the service manager decides to (or doesn't) write up the failure. I have personally had service managers tell me point blank that they will warrant items that did not fail under warranty. That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer. The service manager is awesome. So far that has brought me back for three vehicles. Treating your customers well pays big dividends.
If small items they will,large items they will not.A good service manager will spend shop money to fix small items on there dime to keep repeat customers happy and coming back.In the long run they will make more money off of you then you think.

But.....................

Any service manager would look twice if a vehicle that was just sold at his/her dealership less then 30 days ago come back with a hydrolocked engine.


That is very different then giving a customer a free $50 part,a $5000+ engine is not a give away for free item and is not a good way to run a shop.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 04:36 PM   #130
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VW is one of the most successful car manufacturers on the planet--Chrysler isn't. It's been having bankruptcy problems for at least a generation with many owners--Fiat/tax-payer, Cerberus, Mercedes, and a tax-payer bailout years before they became popular.

Given that, they can't afford to be as generous with warranty claims. I wish I even had a Jeep dealer near me. There's not one within sixty miles of me now. The two I've bought Jeeps from over the years have both shut down. I'm glad mine haven't had any issues and I'm taking it slow through the puddles this winter.
Okay, I'll give you that one.
I had my turbo replaced (3500$) and it was my wife's fault, she drove into a curb. The SM covered us..... There were numerous other times that weren't that major...
I never really considered Chryslers current position, that will probably play a huge role in what they're allowed to do, or maybe the point that they begin to question claims....

Maybe it's not right, or economically correct for the corp...but it brought us back twice...
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Unread 11-18-2010, 05:34 PM   #131
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Okay, I'll give you that one.
I had my turbo replaced (3500$) and it was my wife's fault, she drove into a curb. The SM covered us..... There were numerous other times that weren't that major...
I never really considered Chryslers current position, that will probably play a huge role in what they're allowed to do, or maybe the point that they begin to question claims....

Maybe it's not right, or economically correct for the corp...but it brought us back twice...
And you got to think that Fiat is controlling it now and they are very strict on warranty claims.
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Unread 11-18-2010, 06:58 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by paul84043 View Post
Not to be argumentative but it's absolutely 100% true. I'm not arguing the semantics, I'm stating a fact.
It's all in the way the service manager decides to (or doesn't) write up the failure. I have personally had service managers tell me point blank that they will warrant items that did not fail under warranty. That's one reason I keep going back to the same VW dealer. The service manager is awesome. So far that has brought me back for three vehicles. Treating your customers well pays big dividends.
I'm a master tech, and also worked as a warranty adjuster for Ford for 6 years (the guys the came in and inspected the parts...).

Think about these few facts.

1. Under warranty almost all engine replacements are to be reman engines from the mfg's reman distributer.

2. All engines replaced under warranty are sent back the remanufacturer to be remaned.

3. Guy has a brand new Jeep with a blown engine that is getting submitted through Chrysler for a warranty replacement. You can bet your *** that dealership is getting pre-approval for this replacement so they get paid for it.

4. Jeep see's a brand new Jeep with a known reliable engine (20 year old design) blow.

How many red flags do you see here. No matter how that dealer writes this they are going to get found out. All engines get sent back under all warranty repairs. Engines, trans, Diff's ect... are not like other things that sit in the hold and never get called for, these items are 100% called for either because they are large items, or rebuildable. The remanufacturers will take all of these items apart and must fill out a form describing what the cause of failure was so everyone will find out what happened. Yes you can tell how an engine failed even if it was hydrolock.

So a dealership has near a 100% chance at getting caught falsifying information on this one and getting caught. Which if they do not charge the customer for this repair they will end up having to eat several thousand dollars worth of repair work. PLUS a good chance of going through an audit because they lied to the mfg. This means a mfg rep standing over every technician and parts guys shoulders every day until they are satisfied nothing fishy is going on and going through months of back warranty claims trying to find out how many other false claims have been filed. On top of that if technicians are found with parts in there tool box (and every tech has a surplus of parts in there tool box new in box every single tech in this world at a dealership) the audit will conclude they were claiming parts were replaced under warranty and kept the parts which could lead to the techs loosing there jobs or worse criminal charges.

So chew on that then think what the dealership would do in this situation....
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Unread 11-18-2010, 07:25 PM   #133
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Kind of makes you wonder why there's so much leeway on modified vehicles and warranty repairs...
I see your point and understand why the dealer does what they do and with this engine, I can definitely see them getting busted when you lay it out the way you did.
I would really like to hear more info on the vehicle in question....
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Unread 11-18-2010, 10:59 PM   #134
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Kind of makes you wonder why there's so much leeway on modified vehicles and warranty repairs...
I see your point and understand why the dealer does what they do and with this engine, I can definitely see them getting busted when you lay it out the way you did.
I would really like to hear more info on the vehicle in question....
The leeway on modified vehicles is much much harder to get busted on. First off the dealership would not warranty a non factory part so they are not going to be replacing extended sway bar links that are worn, or after market control arms ect.... They may repair some broken axles, worn bearings, anything else that is not modded as long as the failure "could appear to be a defect in materials or worksmanship of the factory part". The mfg has no way to know what vehicles are modified because they are not on the ground 100% of the time, if the dealership decided to omit this info the mfg will never know.
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Unread 11-19-2010, 04:27 PM   #135
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That's crazy. Some of you have probably seen this, but here's my pre-snorkel water run my buddy caught on his camera:

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