As many of you know, Truck-Lite was nice enough to send a set of their updated and improved LED headlights to 3 members of JEEPForum; I'll install mine tomorrow.
I've marked the exact location of the Jeep for reference. Please take note of what you can see off to the sides of the road as well as the FedEx boxes that I've used for markers. Our peripheral vision and the ability to see to the sides is what keeps Bambi off our hoods.
Round one in the war will feature the set of Cibie Z-Beams that I have now. They were purchased from Daniel Stern Lighting. The bulbs are Osram Rallye 70/65 and they are harnessed/relayed/plugged by Rallylights.
Markers are at 25yards L/R, 50 yards L/R, 75 yards L/R
Jeep is on the right side of a 2-lane road; camera on hood in front of driver
Ambient temperature 35 degrees F; lens temperature 157 degrees F at 6"
Also, how are they for upward light bleed? I am concerned that with how bright they are, they would blind the livin' daylights outta ya in rain, fog, snow?
They retail for $535 each, no upward bleed, and the camera exaggerates the blueness of the light. In person the light looks very very white, especially from behind the glass.
Here's an important observation that even my wife noticed; they don't blind you as you walk toward them at all. Every other light that I tested had some bit of blinding effect, especially on highbeam. The IPFs were bad enough to make you look totally away and wince ---- I could walk right at these things without flinching.
Which is remarkable when you look at the lux numbers in dead-center; the highest (by far) of all the lights I tested so far, even the Osram bulbs.
But I haven't tested Osrams in Hella reflectors....
I left earlier than usual so I could hit some podunk dirt roads.
And, right on cue, I had a big deer jump a fence and land smack in the middle of the road in front of me. I saw it as made its leap and hit the brakes hard; got myself a little sideways and missed the beast by a good 15 feet.
I'd say the lights passed the test....
I got to the shop and adjusted the aim higher. The top LED is the lowbeam and I had them aimed thinking that the low LED did that duty. Should look even better tomorrow morning.
Yes; I used the Rallylights harness and they work flawlessly.
The will pulse slightly if you pigtail them --- same as the Truck-Lites. LEDs are just too good at what they do to be fed PWM power. Some people might not mind the flicker but it would drive me nuts.
Plus, people in front of you in traffic might wig-out and think you were law enforcement or something...
BTW,
Those interested in the TruckLites, the best price I have found was $409.99 per pair here: http://www.discountfleetsupply.com/tlc27250c-p.html
I don't know this company, but definitely aggressive pricing.
R
Hey Bill, do you have a wiring diagram for your harness that you are running? I was thinking of doing a harness for the lights to stop the slight flicker I have when stopped. I don't have the lights shutting off or anything like I have seen on youtube, just a slight flicker when the rpms are below 950. The voltage drops just a bit and then the pwm seems to space out the pulses farther.
You need a male H13 plug to trip a pair of dual relays. Run wires from the passenger side OE plug to the relays (by the battery is a good spot); split them to trip the relays ---- one dual relay gets tripped by the lowbeam circuit, one by the highbeam. Hook fused power from the battery to the relay for the power side and then just run wires off the switched circuit to a pair of H4 female plugs. I'd use 12 gauge wire.
Hilldweller, I e-mailed Stern about the lights and harness and Im patiently waiting for his reply. Are you stating above that the Rallylight harness is better than Sterns? I like the LED lights you have been testing, but I think Im gonna try these due to my financial situation....lol....They are pretty cool looking lights though....
There's no appreciable difference between the rallylights harness and Dan's. There is an appreciable difference between Hella reflectors and Cibies though.
Does anyody know the frequency of the PWM on the JK headlights? I see no caps on the Rallylights Harness, won't the Relays buzz? what about back EMF when the power is off the relays, don't you need a diode in the system to keep the TIPM alive? Just asking. For I have a slight flicker at 800 rpm, it seems to go away at 950 rpm and I don't notice it on the road, but if I can make this better I will.
Thanks
I am running the The JW Speaker 8700's like you. Directly wired, I just changed the plug to a H4. I have had mine for about a month and a half. They flicker slightly at 850 rpm when idling. The voltage drop is at it worst when down that low. At anything above 950rpm the LED's seem not to mind the PWM. If they flicker I don't notice it on the road. I have never driven into the oncoming light of the JEEP so I don't know if they flicker noticeably on th road. So I was going to try out a harness like you are using, but was wondering about the relays, I know guys using them for HID conversions are having issues with them buzzing due to the PWM. I also worry about the back EMF from Caps needed to keep the relays Locked. So you don't run any caps or diodes or your harness? What relays are you running? Bosch?
I know the circuitry in the Speaker lights is robust and able to work on different voltages; for the DRL's of the Canadian model work. The DRLS just widen the pulse so the High Beam light only sees voltage half the time. If your relays will hold with the PWM then I want a set. I will build up a harness and try that.
On a side note Canada's largest Dodge store is in our Dealership group, I was over there getting some parts and the President of Chrysler Canada saw the LED's in my Jeep. He walked straight over asked about them we talked for half an hour about them and then he took some pics with his phone and emailed them to Detroit. So maybe all Jeeps will get these.
On a side note Canada's largest Dodge store is in our Dealership group, I was over there getting some parts and the President of Chrysler Canada saw the LED's in my Jeep. He walked straight over asked about them we talked for half an hour about them and then he took some pics with his phone and emailed them to Detroit. So maybe all Jeeps will get these.
Just order a harness from Dan Stern; he's in Canada so it should be affordable for you. Or ping him and order the relays and plugs. He's been watching the same shootout on candlepowerforums and was interested in me expanding the comparison to include more manufacturers.
You'll lose DRL with a harness though; Dan can tell you what to do for that.
So, where are the Delta and Z-Beam/Hella reflector reviews? I am still in the dark here. Pun completely intended and poorly executed. I headed to my local 4wd tomorrow and am considering picking up a set of Trucklites as they are there, and are better than stock and this thread approved.
I haven't met anybody with Deltas installed to test; I'm curious about the coding stamped on them. I don't see how they can meet ECE or DOT regs with the bars in front of the bulb.
I have a set of Hellas and can put Xtreme Power bulbs in them. Maybe I'll call my friend Hank and put them in his JKU with some pigtails.
If you get the Truck-Lites, I recommend using them with supplemental lighting to fill in the gaps.
Indestructible lights have their place in our community for sure.
I have these on my 98 Sahara, and love them. I use them primarily for street driving and they are amazing. I have tried all kinds of bulbs including HIDs and nothing compares. I replaced my stock fog lights with the truck lite spot lights. The two combined are unstoppable. I went with the truck lite ones because they were cheaper than the JW speakers. I am constantly stopped by strangers asking were I got them and how much they were. I will try and post pics in the next couple days.
Rebased HID capsules placed in a reflector that was intended for a halogen bulb will always perform badly; the orientation of the capsule is completely wrong and the light is totally unfocused. It's also very illegal.
Every person's anecdote is always relative to the best light that they're personally experienced. If that light was a stock TJ headlight, then anything would be superior. Even dreck like IPF and Delta...
In a nutshell, the Deltas are legal. The "A" is the approval for the front position "city lamp" function and the HC/R means they met the criteria for Low/High-beam headlights, halogen.
They likely didn't do it with the blue bulbs since the blue bulbs aren't legal in many countries in Europe. Those under-performing "specialty" bulbs are for our ill-informed market.
By these merits, that they're legal at least, they're better than an IPF. I have no first-hand experience with the lights; only their reputation and inferences gleaned from the use of the trendy bulbs and dubious marketing.
I've contacted them and asked for photometry; they've asked for my "credentials".
I'd really like to test them. Not only with a pigtail connector, but with a proper harness.
But I'm done removing my own lights. It took me too long to get the Speakers aimed correctly ---- I finally broke out a series of levels, laser level, clamps, etc. and did a proper job of it. And it was worth it; boy howdy.
Anybody around the Atlanta area with the Deltas installed?
But I'm done removing my own lights. It took me too long to get the Speakers aimed correctly ---- I finally broke out a series of levels, laser level, clamps, etc. and did a proper job of it. And it was worth it; boy howdy.
Anybody around the Atlanta area with the Deltas installed?
So how is the depth now that you aimed them? I know mine have awesome depth compared to the Stock Housings and the truck lights. I am interested to know how you rank them against the cibies?
I am hoping to try out some of JW Speaker's other stuff I want the 8701 Driving lamps and the 6 unit light bar, but they can wait till the tax return comes in. So if you could post some pics of the LED's aimed now that would be great.
Maybe I missed this, but I did not see the stock headlamps run through a separate harness. I wonder what would they look like? Certainly brighter. I know, this is not an optimal scenario, but a bypass harness would at least give them full power (avoiding the PWM power).
Then we would be comparing apples to "rotten" apples.
I remember doing just that with my WJ and using better bulbs. Was a definite improvement, at least to my eyes.
Ron
That would be fun to do.
Stock H13 reflector, H13 to H13 bypass harness, Phillips Xtreme Power H13 bulbs.
Now we just need somebody to either donate the stuff or buy it...
All this mad science boils down to an investment. Either our $$$, time, etc. or the vendors.
And I sincerely appreciate the participation by Truck-Lite and JW Speaker. It shows they believe in our community.
They're much better now that they're aimed right.
Still not the spread of the Cibies ---- I don't think LEDs will match that for a long while.
But they make up for it by their intensity in the middle and super long life. They're keepers.
I'll get to some pics eventually. Still waiting for the spots to come in.
No ---- my stock fogs will stay stock.
My HIDs will move to the hoop.
TruckLite spots will go on the fairlead and get relayed to come on with the highbeams.
I asked Rallylights for an H13 to H13 plus Xtremes in an H13 to try on somebody's stock headlight; I figure it will work pretty well and be a cheaper alternative for people who want to upgrade ---- an opportunity for Rallylights to offer a new product.
I've also got a set of H4 Hella reflectors to pigtail for somebody; they have H4 Xtremes in them.
I tell ya, after talking to the Speaker guys and Bogdan, it sounds like a fun way to make a buck.
...if it weren't for *******es like me, of course.
I admit that I've been harsh toward Deltas. But, and I told him this, it's due to the blue bulbs. He wants me to try them out and see for myself.
Fair enough, right?
I'll put them in the Hella reflectors but all I have is a pigtail adapter. I need a test subject now.
I have a neighbor with a JKU who's a sports trainer and doesn't spend much time on the boards. I haven't told him that he's volunteering yet but I think I can drag him out, feed him a few beers, and tear his Jeep apart...
Just have to find the time. And see what Bogdan and Rallylights might send. I still haven't heard from Rallylights...
Well, here's my pathetic contribution to this fine thread...
Side by side pic of three different lenses for the JK..
From left to right, Hella H-4 conversion lens, Cibie Z-Beam H-4 conversion lens, and the stock lens...
in this photo, stock, then Cibie, then Hella...
I can say that I've never really seen a headlight lens with the intricate diffusers like the Cibie Z-beam has....
Bill,
My vehicle is available if it will help. I am currently running IPF and a Rallylights harness. I also have available the stock lens and bulbs. When we measures the IPFs they were running on the stock wiring.
I have no issues swapping the lights out as needed to do more testing. I also have an extra pair of pigtails available.
If I get the Delta bulbs this week, would you have next Friday or Saturday night open, Chris? I'll gift you the Hella reflectors I have if you want.
We can test three different bulbs in the same reflector that way.
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