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Unread 05-17-2006, 08:25 PM   #31
ODAMO
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Maybe what they should have done is never built the Commander and named the 4 door Wrangler the Commander. I think Jeep is headed towards having too many models that do nothing but overlap each other. When the Unlimited comes out I don't see that many Commanders being sold. With it's lack of off road ability you might as well get the Grand, it's more refined. The Cherokee was offered in 2 or 4 doors so why not the wrangler. Ford attempted to correct their mistake of doing a second attempt at a small bronco with the bronco II.... too bad it was no match for the original, in looks or performance.

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Unread 05-17-2006, 11:28 PM   #32
Karamba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ieatchickens
Why make the wrangler something its not?
Pardon me for repeating myslef in a second thread: what other 4dr convertible would you suggest people should buy instead?

You short WB Wrangler is still there.
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Unread 05-17-2006, 11:31 PM   #33
Karamba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bgeddes
Screw that I want a 4:1 transfer, D44s, 5 sp and a CRD.
With electric drive you do not need 4:1. All the torque at 0 rpm. And computers can control your wheel rotation with any precision you want. And it will be stronger and more reliable.

(Oh, well, guess I like new doodads, even at my age..)
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Unread 05-18-2006, 05:59 AM   #34
xj-boonie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ieatchickens
I guarantee they would have sold more if the would have offered the full size 78' style AND the 77' short wheelbased Bronco. The Bronco was Ford's only sport ute.

If you want extra size in Jeep you can always go Liberty, Grand Cherokee or even a Commander. Why make the wrangler something its not?
I don't think it's quite an even comparison: full sized bronco vs swb bronco to TJ vs JK...
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Unread 05-18-2006, 07:21 AM   #35
ieatchickens
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xj-boonie
I don't think it's quite an even comparison: full sized bronco vs swb bronco to TJ vs JK...
Not yet. Wait until the next generation Wrangler comes out. "We made the all new '17 Wrangler the best Wrangler yet! It's bigger and has more capablities!"-Jeep

The idea of the original Jeep is a small 1/4 offroad vehicle. Jeep is getting away from Wranglers unique presence in the 4wd market.
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Unread 05-18-2006, 07:26 AM   #36
ieatchickens
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karamba
Pardon me for repeating myslef in a second thread: what other 4dr convertible would you suggest people should buy instead?

You short WB Wrangler is still there.
I guess we see the Wrangler differently. I see it primarily as a capable 4wd vehicle first that happens to be a convertible. You see it as a convertible that happens to be a 4wd.

Based on your point of view, specialty vehicles like Porche, Corvette, Miata, Soltice, etc should all be making 4 door convertibles. I mean, what other 4 door convertibles are out there?

Why does Jeep have to use its brand icon to be the first in a market that automakers have always ignored?
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Unread 05-18-2006, 08:57 AM   #37
Rommel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepinYahoo
I'm with you dude, I dont have plastic bumpers either, these guys are nuts.

There were plastic endcaps on your front and rear bumpers if you had a TJ. They are notoriously weak and crumple on any kind of impact. Personally I hated them and took them off.

Just to note, the plastic on the bumpers is an OVERLAY. Underneath the plastic it looks like the bumpers are almost identical to the current TJ "beams". The plastic is much harder and seems like it would stand up to casual impacts much better than the TJ endcaps.

Besides, any Jeeper worth their salt replaces their bumpers anyway.

-Romm
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Unread 05-18-2006, 11:51 AM   #38
Karamba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ieatchickens
I mean, what other 4 door convertibles are out there?
None. That's why I am glad that the new JK comes out. That - and it will take me to some remote spots in Sierra Nevada. unlike our 330CiC. I am not even sure I will upgrade the new Rubicon after I get it. It should make it as is.

I used to own a Wrangler. Nice car - not practical for me anymore.
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Unread 05-19-2006, 10:30 PM   #39
ieatchickens
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karamba
None. That's why I am glad that the new JK comes out. That - and it will take me to some remote spots in Sierra Nevada. unlike our 330CiC. I am not even sure I will upgrade the new Rubicon after I get it. It should make it as is.

I used to own a Wrangler. Nice car - not practical for me anymore.
The 2wd will get you there?

I am not arguing the point of someone making a 4 door convertible, I just don't want it to be the Wrangler.
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Unread 05-19-2006, 10:39 PM   #40
Karamba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ieatchickens
The 2wd will get you there?
Quote myself: "the new Rubicon". I am glad I would not need to compromise utility for fun.

2wd will not get me there - I have argued that it still has a lot of utility for a lot of people.

So, your point is that you are against overloading the "Wrangler" designation and design.

But why would DC design a brand new platform when they have a really good one for such a vehicle?

Maybe its just the name? But it would be odd if a car that is exactly the same, but for a 20 inch stretch, would require a completely new brand.

Just let's call it "Unlimited". Not a bad designation.
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Unread 05-20-2006, 10:06 PM   #41
MT3Geiger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ieatchickens
Why does Jeep have to use its brand icon to be the first in a market that automakers have always ignored?
I agree with this and I have to say that i'm pretty upset with the decision to make a 2wd version of the Wrangler.

I can understand the selling point for the new 4 door convertible and realize there is certainly a market for it, I cannot however understand the desire to dilute (read: castrate) a vehicle that has the history and clout that the Jeep does with Wrangler, CJ or otherwise with a 2wd.

Sure they will probably sell a couple more units but doesn't that alienate the image that caused most of us to buy our Jeeps in the first place?

I know its a futile rant from someone stuck in his ways but don't we have enough of these vehicles already.

Whats next? A 4 cylinder Vette, all the presence but more MPG? The argument for it could be that the large majority of owners don't race them and therefore are able to get by without the added power. Heck, its even more "practical" with fuel prices being so high.

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Unread 05-20-2006, 10:37 PM   #42
Reswob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ODAMO
Maybe what they should have done is never built the Commander and named the 4 door Wrangler the Commander. I think Jeep is headed towards having too many models that do nothing but overlap each other. When the Unlimited comes out I don't see that many Commanders being sold. With it's lack of off road ability you might as well get the Grand, it's more refined. The Cherokee was offered in 2 or 4 doors so why not the wrangler. Ford attempted to correct their mistake of doing a second attempt at a small bronco with the bronco II.... too bad it was no match for the original, in looks or performance.
How do you see any correlation between the 4-dr Wrangler and the Commander?? People who want a large, 7-passenger, luxury SUV would buy a Commander, as opposed to people who want a Wrangler, who will buy Wranglers. They're nothing alike. The only Jeep models that 'overlap' would be the WK and XK - both large luxury-oriented SUVs intended for on-road driving (not that what people do with them is allways what Jeep intended them to do ).
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Unread 05-22-2006, 06:57 AM   #43
keithert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MT3Geiger
Whats next? A 4 cylinder Vette, all the presence but more MPG? The argument for it could be that the large majority of owners don't race them and therefore are able to get by without the added power. Heck, its even more "practical" with fuel prices being so high.
Seen the pics of the new Saturn Sky?
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Unread 06-03-2006, 11:12 AM   #44
dwales31
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not a jeep

i hate the new wrangler its not a jeep.....2wd? plastic bumpers? 4 door? its too big to fit down most trails in my area
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Unread 06-03-2006, 06:59 PM   #45
Sk[pperB
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I have seen CJ, TJ, and Cherokees that were 2wd also
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