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Unread 08-06-2013, 07:36 AM   #136
SpoiledRotten
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Very good thread! I'm considering something like the Windstar intake. Thanks.

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Unread 09-07-2013, 03:54 PM   #137
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I just finished putting mine in. Like others, I did this to make room in the engine bay for future modifications. Any performance benefits are an incidental bonus.


One thing to note on the install and fabrication. I used the rubber horn from the Windstar. Here it is sticking through the firewall. This requires a 3.25" hole.



As a result, I will need to add a short length of pipe to push the new air box a little further into the engine bay. Once done, the wiring harness will tuck away more neatly. EDIT: I used a short length of fat radiator hose stuck on to the back of the air box to push it out more. Now it looks like all the others and the wiring harness lays down nicely.

Something that helped with drilling the hole is to first drill a template out of some thin plywood or cardboard. Find the spot on the firewall, allowing for the additional thickness of the saw, and mark the center


Something that has not been mentioned is the need to loosen the ground wire to the fuse box so it points down.

As far as numbers go, I drove around earlier today with Torque reading the intake temp. Ambient air temperatures have been in the high 80's low 90's.

My speeds ranged from stopped to 40mph with a rough average of 25mph.
Once warmed up, the stock intake fluctuated between about 145-190*. Typical idle temp was about 145*. However after quickly running into a store, I did see one startup temp at 205* before quickly dropping.

At this very moment, I am idling at full temp with the modified intake reading 140*.

I have a few errands to run. I'll watch the temps over the next couple hours.
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Unread 09-07-2013, 07:34 PM   #138
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I've been driving around town for the last 2 hours similar to this morning. Nothing faster than 40mph with lots of stop and go. The only difference is that it is now in the high 90's.

The idle intake temps are about the same with either airbox at approximately 145*F. The interesting thing is where the stock box lets the intake temps increase while driving in relation to the under hood temps, the cowl airbox actually cools the intake while driving. While driving, I never saw the modified intake temp go above 165*F. During one extended drive, I watched it go from 155* down to 125*F and then climb back up during idle while stopped. Heat soak in action! The stock box never behaved like that.

Other changes (or not):
The throttle might possibly feel a little quicker.
Acceleration might possibly feel a bit quicker. (i qualify these two, because I have my doubts)
The engine sounds exactly the same to me. I revved up the 4,000rpm, which I rarely ever do, but it sounded the same as before.

Tomorrow, I leave for Aspen for a week long project. I can routinely get 18-20mpg on this trip without trying too hard. We shall see if I can do better this time.
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Unread 09-08-2013, 09:45 AM   #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjvw View Post
I've been driving around town for the last 2 hours similar to this morning. Nothing faster than 40mph with lots of stop and go. The only difference is that it is now in the high 90's.

The idle intake temps are about the same with either airbox at approximately 145*F. While driving, I never saw the modified intake temp go above 165*F. The interesting thing is where the stock box lets the intake temps increase while driving in relation to the under hood temps, the cowl airbox actually cools the intake while driving. During one extended drive, I watched it go from 155* down to 125*F and then climb back up during idle while stopped. Heat soak in action! The stock box never behaved like that.

Other changes (or not):
The throttle might possibly feel a little quicker.
Acceleration might possibly feel a bit quicker. (i qualify these two, because I have my doubts)
The engine sounds exactly the same to me. I revved up the 4,000rpm, which I rarely ever do, but it sounded the same as before.

Tomorrow, I leave for Aspen for a week long project. I can routinely get 18-20mpg on this trip without trying too hard. We shall see if I can do better this time.
My windstar/cowl intake is pretty much the same as yours with almost identical seat of the pants "maybe's" that I feel when accelerating. LOL

I wrapped my intake tube and filter housing with this product for even cooler air.
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Unread 09-08-2013, 10:02 AM   #140
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I'm a firm believer in the placebo effect, which is why I have my suspicions about the tiny performance boost. Since I can't measure any of it, i won't make up any meaningful numbers. The Jeep's quickiness may have increased by a measurement of 0.8 giggles! How's that?

After I live with the current setup for a while and get a better idea of what it does, I might wrap it. I may be projecting, but I would think that the computer would prefer less fluctuation in the intake temperatures. I know I would if I were a Jeep computer with feelings and a heart of gold.
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Unread 09-08-2013, 01:00 PM   #141
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This will be my first week with the Windstar cowl intake installed. My intent is to record the any increases in fuel economy as well as any other observations. I will keep updating for the duration of this trip while making some effort to fill up between different types of driving. All tanks will be consecutive and will be averaged together for a broader picture.

2003 Rubicon
61,000 miles
32" BFG's
Everything is stock except for the intake.
With the stock air box, my usual mileage is 14-18mpg depending on the type of driving. My record so far is 20.38mpg.

Full tank in Denver
85*F outside temp
On the highway 70mph - intake reads between 105-110*F.

Update:
Denver to Leadville 60mph average speed, never exceeded 70mph. 106.6 miles between full ups.

106.6 miles / 5.302 gallons = 20.105mpg

That's better than I expected for what amounts to a 5,000 foot climb.

With sustained driving, the intake generally maintained 25-30*F above the ambient air temp.

When climbing some of the steeper grades, I did hear the louder drone from the cowl as the engine worked harder. On westbound I-70 heading up towards the Eisenhower Tunnel, it was noticeably easier maintaining speed up the hill. The return trip east will be interesting.

More to come as the day progresses...

Update:
Leadville to Basalt via Hagerman Pass. 30 miles of rough gravel road with a few sections of rocks. Nothing difficult. I find this trail to be a very relaxing and enjoyable drive, especially the western side that follows the old railroad grade. Did it all in 2H going roughly 5-15mph and faster when things smoothed out. 40 miles paved at about 35-40mph. 74.7 miles between fill ups.

74.7 miles / 3.776 gallons = 19.783mpg



Having driven this pass a few times, it did seem like the Jeep had a bit more torque this trip. Up at the top, temps were in the low-50's. The intake temp got down to 67*F at one point. The altitude was just below 12,000ft.
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Unread 09-12-2013, 11:25 AM   #142
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Update on my last day of this trip:

211.1 miles of city/highway driving between Aspen and Basalt along with a nice trip up to the Montezuma Basin yesterday evening.

211.1 / 13.264 = 15.915mpg

It has been raining several times a day all week in Aspen/Basalt. Several times, I have checked the new air box for any moisture and it has been bone dry every time.

I'm taking the long scenic route back to Denver via Schofield Pass/Lead King Basin to Crested Butte. That should give me another tank to average in.

Update:
Basalt to Crested Butte via Lead King Basin/Devil's Punchbowl/Schofield Pass
Crested Butte to Almont
Almont to Buena Vista via various forest service roads and Cottonwood Pass
Buena Vista to Morrison (very near Denver)
Roughly 100 miles of this tank was off road, much of which in 4L. The remaining 150 miles was mostly highway going 60-70mph. 250.3 miles between fill ups.

250.3 miles / 14.071 gallons = 17.189mpg
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Unread 09-12-2013, 11:20 PM   #143
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In Summary:
Denver to Aspen/Basalt to Denver with the Ford Windstar Cowl Intake
~400 miles of highway
~70 miles in town
~175 miles off road
Lots of elevation changes between 5250ft and about 12,500ft.

642.7 total miles / 36.413 total gallons = 17.65 mpg average for the trip

That's pretty good. I am confident based on past experience on many of these roads that I would have averaged at most 15-16mpg with the stock airbox on this drive--mostly due to the off road portions. After the trails today, I still am inclined to say that there is a small but noticeable increase in torque. It just feels easier to pull the Jeep up and over obstacles. On the highway, I had less trouble maintaining speed going up the many long sustained climbs.
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Unread 09-12-2013, 11:37 PM   #144
lpukas2
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I've had this set for years, love it and it's cheap!
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Unread 09-12-2013, 11:42 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpukas2 View Post
I've had this set for years, love it and it's cheap!
Somewhere earlier in this thread, it was mentioned that the computer would adjust to the cooler air and the milage and performance would return to stock levels. Have you seen any indication of this?
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Unread 10-05-2013, 09:23 PM   #146
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Installed Windstar cowl intake

I just did the mod today, first major mod I've made to my 2000 TJ.

A few things that I did a little differently (for better or for worse):

I used the airbox from a 2001 Windstar. When I was at the junkyard I had first pulled one from an older model, then I found the 2001. It was a bit smaller, which ended up being a bonus since I didn't have to cut it. Plus I got it for $15.

Instead of the 4" to 3" elbow, I found a 4" to 2.5" here: This was the most expensive part at $31.04 shipped. It was a bit of a tight squeeze on the stock pipe, but a little WD-40 helped.

My hole into the firewall was 2.5". I also had to move my ground wire and undo the clips on the wire bundles running through that area so that I could run them under the airbox. On the cowl side of the hole I put a 2.5" elbow, tilted slightly down. This also acts to seal the hole and adds extra support to keep the airbox from sliding back into the engine bay, although it holds pretty well even without this. With this setup, to change the filter you just undo the clip holding the two pieces of the box together and swing away the portion attached to the throttle body, similar to stock.

The airbox was a little long, so the pipe back to the throttle body is not exactly perpendicular across the engine like stock, but it works just the same.

TBD on any performance or efficiency gains, but I can feel it sucking and could hear it slightly when accelerating at 2500+ RPMs on my test drive. Fun mod that took me 3-4 hours.









I can't post images yet, so here are links:

1, 2, 3, 4
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Unread 10-06-2013, 11:20 AM   #147
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Man,that's about the best idea i've seen yet..nice job
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Unread 10-06-2013, 11:38 AM   #148
jjvw
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickhamm View Post
I just did the mod today, first major mod I've made to my 2000 TJ.

A few things that I did a little differently (for better or for worse):
....
I'm fairly certain that is the same air box we all used. Either way you may still want to shorten it.
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Unread 10-06-2013, 11:42 AM   #149
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that elbow under the cowl would put it directly under the vent, causing water to drip right into the air intake

ps, mine is off an 01 as well, but saved a ton of space by cutting it down
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Unread 10-08-2013, 09:30 PM   #150
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Appreciate the info guys. I hadn't seen anyone reference the 2001 model and the others seemed to be bigger since the fit on mine was so close without cutting it down. Based of this info I'll probably cut mine down as well.

As far as the intake tube being directly under the cowl vent, I thought dripping could be an issue, which is why I angled the tube down so that any water coming in would drip over and down. I actually drove it in pretty steady rain the other day without issue. But now that I think about it, better safe than sorry, and I'll try replacing that elbow with an piece of 2" tube I have.
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