Vibes after 3" lift - JeepForum.com
 
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post #1 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 12:16 PM Thread Starter
RobSheaTJ
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Vibes after 3" lift

So I know this topic has probably been beaten into the ground on this forum already but I need a solution before I end up needed a whole new drive shaft.

I am getting vibrations that aren't terrible but I want them gone. I just put on a 3" Zone suspension lift which included shocks, springs, sway bar links. I also put on a new adjustable front track bar while the rear track bar was given a relocation bracket. Steering is a little iffy too.

Here are my solutions to both vibrations and the shaky steering.

DPA

http://www.quadratec.com/products/26...googlemerchant

$69.99

http://jeep4x4center.amazonwebstore....source=froogle

$99.99

http://www.xtremeterrain.com/jeepyjt..._content=21915

$52.95

MML

http://browndogindustries.com/CU2883...ts-Rubber.aspx

$99.95

BL

http://shop.savvyoffroad.com/product...&categoryId=-1

$134

Adjustable rear sway links

http://www.4x4groupbuy.com/store/adj...42-p-5373.html

$67.50






Any thoughts on these products as solutions or suggestions for substitutions to these would be appreciated.


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post #2 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 12:19 PM
MotoSoul
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The DPA is going to make your steering worse not better. What are the issues currently with your steering?

Other then that it looks like a good plan of attack. You can also try shimming the transfer case skid plate with a couple washers if the motor mount lift isnt enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
I like the arms, they are a good solution, but they really aren't worth the effort for the average person and you already see the BS that goes on over bushings VS JJ's, the crap that would go on over J arms would be epic.
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post #3 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 01:05 PM Thread Starter
RobSheaTJ
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I've been getting a lot of mixed opinions about the DPA. It's my understanding that, because of the lift, the track bar and drack link are no longer perfectly parallel. A DPA would fix that. Is that wrong? As it is now, when I hit a bump the steering seems very loose and jumps back and forth. I still need an alignment so maybe I'll get that done first then come back to the idea of a DPA.

I also put a transfer case drop in with the lift. I'll hit it with a few washers if the vibes aren't gone after the MML. Thanks.

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post #4 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 01:13 PM
Gary2
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DPA is not needed and will make things worse . Your drag link and track bar should be fine . you look at the two from their mounting points as far as being parallel which they most likely are unless you added a bracket of some sort to the track bar which you shouldnt of . Did you get a front end alignment as your toe is way off and probably caster too if you did nothing to correct it . did you drop the TC , is the pinion angle correct . do some searches and find out what is really involved in lifting ,not just what the instructions in the kit say
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post #5 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 01:22 PM
Melissas6570
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Did you have an alignment done after the lift? If not, do that for the steering issue. For the vibes, try adding a few washers to drop the transfer case skid down and see it that helps. If so you can get a BL and MML and do the same thing.

I DO IT WITH MY TOP OFF!
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post #6 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 02:23 PM
jeepguner
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lift

did the same zone lift, and my steering wasnt the same until i had it alligned.as far as vibes went with the tranfercase drop, and know vibes. no adjustable track bars drilled the front and used the bracket in the rear.think you need a allignment.
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post #7 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 02:52 PM
MGoBlue
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http://www.4x4wire.com/tech/pinionangle/

What happens when the pinion angle is off?

Improperly set pinion angle causes vibration which can lead to early parts failure. The vibration results from unequal velocities at the opposite ends of the drive shaft. When a U-joint is run at an angle the drive shaft will actually speed up and slow down twice during each revolution, due to the changing angular velocity of the U-joint ends.

Don't fear the regear!
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post #8 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 03:00 PM Thread Starter
RobSheaTJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGoBlue View Post
http://www.4x4wire.com/tech/pinionangle/

What happens when the pinion angle is off?

Improperly set pinion angle causes vibration which can lead to early parts failure. The vibration results from unequal velocities at the opposite ends of the drive shaft. When a U-joint is run at an angle the drive shaft will actually speed up and slow down twice during each revolution, due to the changing angular velocity of the U-joint ends.
I understand this idea. Fixing the angle is what is confusing me. I have a transfer case drop. I just ordered a 1" MML from Brown Dog and a 1.25" BL from Savvy. The idea being that a lifted motor will change the angle of the driveshaft and cause the U joints to spin at the same speed again. That's the hope anyways.


Anybody got anything to say about these:
http://www.4x4groupbuy.com/store/adj...42-p-5373.html


Do they help adjust the pinion angle at all or am I misunderstanding their purpose?

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post #9 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 03:34 PM
roosr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobSheaTJ View Post
I understand this idea. Fixing the angle is what is confusing me. I have a transfer case drop. I just ordered a 1" MML from Brown Dog and a 1.25" BL from Savvy. The idea being that a lifted motor will change the angle of the driveshaft and cause the U joints to spin at the same speed again. That's the hope anyways.


Anybody got anything to say about these:
http://www.4x4groupbuy.com/store/adj...42-p-5373.html


Do they help adjust the pinion angle at all or am I misunderstanding their purpose?


These aren't going to change your pinion angle. What you want to get for changing the pinion angle are the adjustable upper control arms. The parts you have noted are for the swaybar. The only advantage you could get changing the swaybar endlinks is going with quick disconnects to increase articulation.

You'll need adjustable upper control arms to do pinion angle. Really, if you do an engine lift, and the transfer case drop, you should resolve your vibe issues. I installed a 3in lift in my TJ and with a skyjacker TC drop kit resolved my issues. Just my 2 cents.
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post #10 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 05:05 PM
MGoBlue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roosr View Post
Really, if you do an engine lift, and the transfer case drop, you should resolve your vibe issues. I installed a 3in lift in my TJ and with a skyjacker TC drop kit resolved my issues. Just my 2 cents.
He's right. Any you don't disconnect the rear sway bar only the front. Longer links in the rear are needed to match the suspension lift.
The way to correct the pinion angle is to rotate the axle up in the front w/ the adjustable upper control arms. It looks like Zone's 3" uses factory control arms? You may have a real fun time trying to get rid of your issue if that's the case.

Do your MML and BL then see if you still have problems.

Don't fear the regear!
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post #11 of 15 Old 05-18-2012, 06:52 PM
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How big is the tcase drop with the zone lift? With my 3.25 rc it was roughly 1.25" and though it looks bad until i get an SYE and double cardigan, i dont have any u joint binding other than in reverse. Even then, it is VERY slight.

97 TJ with some stuff.
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post #12 of 15 Old 05-19-2012, 05:17 AM Thread Starter
RobSheaTJ
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I didn't measure the transfer case drop but if I had to eyeball it I'd say it's right about 1.25". I'm gonna throw some washers in there temporarily until the MML and BL get here, both of which are on backorder.

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post #13 of 15 Old 05-19-2012, 07:57 AM
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For what its worth. After I installed my RE 3.5"SA lift. I had some vibes too. Most noticeably when accelerating under heavy torque load. I immediately went to the hardware store and bought longer bolts for the belly pan as I was adding more spacers/washers to reduce the vibe from the rear axle/pinion angle. It solved the problem, or I should say made it tolerable. Not my belly pan was hanging out low and the look was awful.
I started researching other solutions and it all came up the same. SYE (slip yoke eliminator) new CV drive-shaft and lets not forget the all too important Adjustable upper rear control arms to get the proper pinion angle. Now with this properly installed, I was able to remove all the spacers on the belly pan and jeep looked better as well as no drive-line vibrations. So much for a inexpensive 3"-3.5" lift. If I had known I was going to have to do all the extras on this lift I would just as well have gone with a 4.5" lift from the git go.
Now as time went on, with the lift and bigger than stock tires (33's) and 60K on the odometer the front end started to develop a shudder at times, only noticeable when braking hard on bumpy roads or after hitting a pot hole usually at high speeds. I was having my diffs serviced and the tech had given the jeep the usual once over. He had told me that the ball joints were just starting to really show signs of wear and replacement should be considered.
I started researching options and for the difference in price vs. the labor, and what I was actually getting for the work,I opted for the Curry steering upgrade. I installed it myself and WOW is the best way to describe it. Not only did it eliminate any shuddering or shimmy from the front end, but it made the front of the jeep feel tight and solid.
I am not sure if this opinion is helpful as I am unsure as to the exact nature of your vibes. But this just my experience and remedy. Good luck and enjoy.

Rich G. 2005 Wrangler 4.0 6-Speed.
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post #14 of 15 Old 05-19-2012, 10:54 AM Thread Starter
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Cool. Always like to hear Jeep stories with happy endings that way I can know what paths have worked for others with certain problems. Thanks.

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post #15 of 15 Old 05-19-2012, 11:39 AM
99_TJ_Wyoming
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sc00bz View Post
How big is the tcase drop with the zone lift? With my 3.25 rc it was roughly 1.25" and though it looks bad until i get an SYE and double cardigan, i dont have any u joint binding other than in reverse. Even then, it is VERY slight.
I ran my 3.25 for 2 years with no TC drop at all, the angles arent bad........ Driveline angle flexed with no drops.
(I later added the 1"MML and the 1.25" BL, but even before there were no vibes).

What lift makes vibrations and which ones dont are very individual, the same lift on 2 Jeeps will make one vibrate and one not, slight vibrations can be any of a plethera of things.
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