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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:16 AM   #1
WR4NGLER
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Update on transmission issues

This got long so I had to shorten it. I have a 2000 TJ 6cyl Auto. Maybe the only relevant mod (that I cna think of) is a transfer case skid that's basically only as low as the frame. So that changes the angle of the whole engine/trans/tcase.

2008

I milkshaked my transmission. And got Aamco to rebuilt it. $2000.

Few days later, check engine light. I bring it back, they replace spark plugs. $??

Few weeks later, misfires. I think I called them or brought it back and they said bring it to an auto electric specialist. So I did, and they couldn't figure it out, and charge me $130. They had it for like a month.

Few weeks after that, I bring it to another garage, and I ask them to do an engine clean and to help diagnose. They clean the engine internals, can't figure out the misfires. I only pay for the engine clean.

Meanwhile the entire time I was looking at similar threads online. I pull the coil pack rail, test the voltage. Every pack seems to be within spec, so far as I could tell.

I give up.

2013

I go to OK4WD and they say do a full engine diagnostic and say the engine is great and the sound is coming from the transfer case. They do not indicate any other issues. I think it ended up being like $300.

2014

I go to a different Aamco because there aren't many other local transmission options that have good reviews. I don't know if the previous Aamco is at fault with the original rebuilt, but they went out of business so I definitely can't go there. And other local places couldn't diagnose the problems back in 2008. And Aamco is free to look at it, so why not take the gamble.

I drop off my Jeep at the Aamco and they call and say they can hear arcing in the coil pack rail and it needs to be replaced for sure. And they said a couple O2 sensors are busted based on codes. They tell me the price of the parts, which are like double of what I can get online. But I want to get it fixed and back offroading, so I agree to to the $800 charge for labor, rail, and 3 bosch o2 sensors. I pay and bring it home happy. They were not able to reproduce the noiss from the transmission.

Within 24 hours, the sound from the transmission area comes back. I bring it back and tell them to run it hot. They can reproduce it now, and say they firmly believe it's the flex plate. And they said to be sure they need to drop it, and they want to order the part. I give them the thumbs up.

Few days later, they call back and say it's fixed. I asked for the flex plate, which doesn't seem damaged at all, but with such little clearance I guess any little warping or micro crack could have been the cause. ALso, I'm not sure what the difference is and I need to wrap this up so I'll google it later, but the box I got back my part in was a manual transmission fly wheel. For the record. I pay $800 and bring it home. Runs great, but at 65 mph I feel it might have a little more vibration than before. I shrug it off and plan to drive it more to determine if that's true.

Within 24 hours of getting it back, it makes a whining sound anytime (EDIT) I press on the gas hard causing the RPMs to spike (like If I was getting up a hill or entering a highway). I don't think it did that on the ride home. Either way, that's the current issue.

This morning, I call Aamco back and they said they would look at it. They were quick to say that it sounds internal and they weren't inside the trans or torque converter. I say I understand that but I'm concerned because this only came about after you were in that area. We agreed to drop it off within the next few days to take a look.

QUESTIONS...

Since so much time has elapsed between the original rebuilt, I can't say for sure that the original rebuilt is at fault. Even though less than 2-3k miles have been put on it... and now that torque converter could be busted... it feels like a botched rebuild. But it's not fair to make that a statement. So I'm going to ignore that.

So, focusing on the present, how do I handle this current issue? Lets say they say the torque converter is messed up. I could ask what the cause is. They'll want to drop the transmission again to give me a firm answer. Probably looking at another $600 then. Is this within the bounds of the warranty they issued me for the work on the fly wheel? Could work on one cause an issue with the other?

I honestly just want to say "why didn't you see this when I asked if everything down there with the transmission looks good" ????? But can I really be that idealistic about it? I don't think so, they're only human and if it wasn't making the issue until I put 20 miles on it how realistic is it that they would uncover the issue, if it truly has nothing to do with the work they did?

I'll drop it off and let you guys know what they tell me.

Sorry this was so long. I wanted to be as thorough as I could considering if things don't work out I might give up again.

Blair

EDIT

1. Appears to be more significant with higher RPM. However, I'm not 100% sure it's related to a downshifting scenario.

https://soundcloud.com/wr4ngler/whine-sound-short
https://soundcloud.com/wr4ngler/whine-sound-long

2. The shop I took it to modified my dust cover (see before and after images here: http://imgur.com/a/mN3Hg), but I'm asking them to install a full one.

3. Fluid is pink and clear of bubbles and within the OK area on the dipstick, running warm in neutral.

4. Confirming from shop what fluid they put in it.

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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:20 AM   #2
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Genesis 1
New International Version (NIV)
The Beginning

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6 And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” 7 So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9 And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:28 AM   #3
robncar
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I guess I'm trying to figure out what overdrive you're talking about with a 2000 TJ that would have a 3-speed auto?

Also, please fill out your Jeep Info...
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:30 AM   #4
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it was very good.
haha. I'm waiting for my version of this part.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:33 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robncar View Post
I guess I'm trying to figure out what overdrive you're talking about with a 2000 TJ that would have a 3-speed auto?
Sorry, I'm using the wrong words. I thought overdrive was when the torque converter kicked in. And I'm also not familiar with exactly how the TConv works.

When I am going up a hill, accelerating to get on a highway, or otherwise pressing the accelerator harder than normal, my jeep shifts into some gear or mode that spikes the RPM so to achieve the needed boost that my foot is demanding from the engine. During those situations, I hear a whining sound.

(EDIT) Googled this. Not overdrive. Not sure what to call it other than my description above. I edited the OP, thank you.

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Also, please fill out your Jeep Info...
Ok, I'll do that now. (EDIT) Done.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:42 AM   #6
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I have nothing good to say about Aamco. They ripped off my parents twice and several other people I know. I would not let a transmission place do engine work, that makes no since. You will have problems with those Bosch 02 sensors shortly. I would also like to know what spark plugs they installed? Our engines are very picky on the model plug they run, wrong type of spark plug will cause mis fires on your engine. As far as transmission repair, I'd find another company. There must be someone else in your area.

I would be sure that they used ATF+4 fluid and it's at normal operating temp full. That is engine running and in neutral.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:43 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WR4NGLER View Post
Sorry, I'm using the wrong words. I thought overdrive was when the torque converter kicked in. And I'm also not familiar with exactly how the TConv works.

When I am going up a hill, accelerating to get on a highway, or otherwise pressing the accelerator harder than normal, my jeep shifts into some gear or mode that spikes the RPM so to achieve the needed boost that my foot is demanding from the engine. During those situations, I hear a whining sound.



Ok, I'll do that now. EDIT: Done.
You have the 32RH 3 speed transmission, a very good one at that.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robncar View Post
Genesis 1
New International Version (NIV)
The Beginning

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.

3 And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

6 And God said, “Let there be a vault between the waters to separate water from water.” 7 So God made the vault and separated the water under the vault from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.

9 And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.

11 Then God said, “Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds.” And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.

20 And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”

27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

29 Then God said, “I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds in the sky and all the creatures that move along the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.” And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:52 AM   #9
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You will have problems with those Bosch 02 sensors shortly.
Oh boy. Why?

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Originally Posted by JBTJ View Post
I'd find another company. There must be someone else in your area.
My zip code is 19355. There are some other places and I'll take a look depending on what happens with this next checkup. But they all have good and bad reviews. I live near Quadratec and asked them, they referred me to someone 2 hours away (they may have been closer in 2008).

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I would be sure that they used ATF+4 fluid and it's at normal operating temp full
As of right now, I don't know what fluid is in there. I'll wait to hear from what Aamco says they think is the issue before draining and adding new fluid. Would wrong fluid cause a whining sound all of a sudden?
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:57 AM   #10
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Just to clarify...

The only issue presently surfacing is a whining sound when RPM's spike getting on a highway or pumping the gas. All posts are welcome, but I really want to know how to handle the next 24 hours talking to the shop about whether they may have done something to cause the sound. I understand internet diagnosis is difficult and maybe impossible in this case. But someone may have prior experience. Up to this point, this Aamco has been just fine. However, now there's a new sound and I'm trying to figure out whether I should blame them. haha.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 07:59 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by WR4NGLER View Post
Oh boy. Why?



My zip code is 19355. There are some other places and I'll take a look depending on what happens with this next checkup. But they all have good and bad reviews. I live near Quadratec and asked them, they referred me to someone 2 hours away (they may have been closer in 2008).



As of right now, I don't know what fluid is in there. I'll wait to hear from what Aamco says they think is the issue before draining and adding new fluid. Would wrong fluid cause a whining sound all of a sudden?
Bosch may make some good products, but not 02 sensors for our JEEPs. Mark my words, you will have problems with them. I've been here on this forum long enough to read all the problems that other people have had with them. Aamco does not have good reviews, you are better off taking your chances elsewhere, or your local Boy Scout group. You can not tell what ATF is installed cause it all looks and smells the same. Yes, having the wrong type of fluid will cause a whining sound. You must have ATF+4 and nothing but ATF+4. The crap they sell that they claim is a universal ATF will not work.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 08:03 AM   #12
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Get them to tell you what ATF was installed. If they say something other than ATF+4, there is your problem.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 08:15 AM   #13
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Get them to tell you what ATF was installed. If they say something other than ATF+4, there is your problem.
Would they normally drain the transmission fluid when dropping the transmission? I know it's connected to the radiator, just not sure if it's a requirement.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 08:15 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WR4NGLER View Post
Sorry, I'm using the wrong words. I thought overdrive was when the torque converter kicked in. And I'm also not familiar with exactly how the TConv works.

When I am going up a hill, accelerating to get on a highway, or otherwise pressing the accelerator harder than normal, my jeep shifts into some gear or mode that spikes the RPM so to achieve the needed boost that my foot is demanding from the engine. During those situations, I hear a whining sound.

(EDIT) Googled this. Not overdrive. Not sure what to call it other than my description above. I edited the OP, thank you.

Ok, I'll do that now. (EDIT) Done.
What happens when you put your foot down and RPM's spike is the transmission shifting into a lower gear (kick-down), not the torque converter.
If you are in third gear and floor the pedal, it'll downshift to second gear. If you are in second gear and floor the pedal, it'll downshift to first gear.

The torque converter is a hydraulic device that allows the engine to run (idle) while it's in gear, as when at a stop sign etc., it takes the place of a clutch.
Once a predetermined RPM is met, the converter activates and the vehicle moves forward.
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Unread 05-12-2014, 08:21 AM   #15
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Would they normally drain the transmission fluid when dropping the transmission? I know it's connected to the radiator, just not sure if it's a requirement.
If they remove the pan, 3 quarts of ATF will come out. If they remove the TQ about 6 or 7 more quarts will come out. So just dropping the pan to change the filter is only removing 1/3rd of the total amount of ATF in the system.
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