Jeep Enthusiast Forums banner

Tackling Death Wobble 2004 TJ - Quadratec Parts

8K views 62 replies 22 participants last post by  red rubi 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi Gang

I've done a lot of reading here, and picked up some great tips about Front End Death Wobble. I'm a 62 year old Wrangler owner, and do NOT have any souped-up lift conversions, or anything like that. My Jeep is STOCK with 62K miles. However, even Stock Wranglers can be afflicted by Death Wobble. Three front end wheel balances and rotations have NOT cured the symptom. Therefore, based on what I've read here, I ordered the following parts;

Original Replacement Parts 52005740 - Right Hand Thread Tie Rod End for 91-06 Jeep® Wrangler YJ & Wrangler TJ & 91-01 Cherokee XJ Passenger Side Outer - Quadratec < Why did I order this particular tie rod? Because the current tie rod shows wear and play. The other part replacements are ALL recommended here and by Quadratec. My only hesitation has always been the quality of 'After-Market' parts.

With the exception of the Skyjacker Steering Damper, I'm trusting that these parts will live up to Mopar.

Original Replacement Parts 52088432 - TRACK BAR-FRONT 1997-06 TJ - Quadratec

http://www.quadratec.com/products/16071_99.htm

Thank You
Mike
 
See less See more
#4 ·
Does anyone have any other ideas - opinions - re-assurances?
I would put a damper on the steering link (not a steering damper). that thing is like a wet noodle and I wouldn't put it past it to oscillate at certain frequencies and cause the wheels to violently toe in and out at certain speeds (frequencies).

I'll see if I can find a pic from quadratec of what I'm talking about.

That, and or beefing up the steering link a little.
 
#8 ·
I have heard mutliple times on this forum that this is the most likely culprit.
 
#6 ·
^i can't find it online but it's in the latest quadratec catalogue. I think it's a damper that goes between the the long link and the steering box-to- spindle link. It dampens any compression forces on the long link between the tires. Those compression forces could cause oscillations in that long link and be a cause of dw. I've thought about putting one on mine for a while now, and I ran into a guy at the OHV park weeks ago that had one an loved it.

That's the extent of my knowledge on the subject.
 
#9 ·
Hi Guys

Thanx for all your replies

Please bear in mind, (as I mentioned), I do not have any modifications on my Jeep. It's totally Stock. And the parts I ordered were recommended by Quadratec. They are VERY FAMILIAR with 'Death Wobble'.

I'll have to understand the other part/suggestion that anymanusa mentioned. Perhaps the guys at Quadratec know what he's talking about?

In the meantime,
Can you guys please comment on my original question regarding those Quadratec parts above, and MOPAR?

Thank you so much
Mike
 
#12 ·
Mike, I find it best to ask about stuff BEFORE I order it if I want an opinion of any value. Saves time and money installing, removing, and returning bad parts.

Lastly, I know there's some folks that work at Q-tec that are pretty familiar with the TJ, but another good rule I follow is to temper any advice about diagnosing problems with the fact that the guy giving it has something for sale.

Based on the information you've given so far, I'm still pretty clueless as to what parts you actually need.
 
#11 ·
Hi Gang

I've done a lot of reading here, and picked up some great tips about Front End Death Wobble. I'm a 62 year old Wrangler owner, and do NOT have any souped-up lift conversions, or anything like that. My Jeep is STOCK with 62K miles. However, even Stock Wranglers can be afflicted by Death Wobble. Three front end wheel balances and rotations have NOT cured the symptom. Therefore, based on what I've read here, I ordered the following parts;

Original Replacement Parts 52005740 - Right Hand Thread Tie Rod End for 91-06 Jeep® Wrangler YJ & Wrangler TJ & 91-01 Cherokee XJ Passenger Side Outer - Quadratec < Why did I order this particular tie rod? Because the current tie rod shows wear and play. The other part replacements are ALL recommended here and by Quadratec. My only hesitation has always been the quality of 'After-Market' parts.

With the exception of the Skyjacker Steering Damper, I'm trusting that these parts will live up to Mopar.

Original Replacement Parts 52088432 - TRACK BAR-FRONT 1997-06 TJ - Quadratec

Skyjacker Suspension 7009 - Skyjacker Steering Stabilizer for 84-06 Jeep® Cherokee XJ, Grand Cherokee ZJ, Comanche MJ, Wrangler YJ, TJ & Unlimited - Quadratec

Thank You
Mike
You state the tie rod has wear and play. What test did you do to determine that? What test did Quadratec have you do to determine and diagnose worn parts?

What did they ask you about your trackbar?

What did they ask you about your control arm bushings?
 
#14 · (Edited)
I wouldn't put too much stock in 'mopar' parts... that's what my distributor gear and cam gear are and they are garbage.
 
#15 ·
I wouldn't put to much stock in 'mopar' parts... that's what my disgri utor hear and cam gear are and they are garbage.
You're one of "them", aintcha? You know, the only time you open your mouth is to change feet.

If you're so disgruntled with Mopar, please go out to your rig and remove everything that is Mopar and get rid of it.
 
#18 ·
It sounds like you need new tires. A 2004 with 64,000 miles doesn't get driven much, so my money is on flat topped tires from setting to much. If a tire sits for to long in the same spot it can develop a flat spot. This gives it the same feel as death wobble. In fact I just had to replace all of mine with new because I have a 2002 with 71,000, and all my tires were the same way. Got new tires, and the thing drives like new.
P.S. I had had mine rebalanced twice.
 
#22 ·
Blaine just posts around this forum with a big chip on his shoulder. I've noticed it time and time again.
 
#20 ·
DEATH WOBBLE, TRACK BAR TRACK BAR TRACK BAR!!!!


I hate when people blame tires. why is it only the 3/4 1 ton fords and dodges and JEEPS that get death wobble with these flat tires... no other vehicles... Maybe it has to do with what they all have in common!!!! The straight axle with a track bar..

You buy the nicest low profile tires on the most perfect rims and it will STILL have death wobble... its the track bar or very worn tie rods..... but my bet every time is a track bar
 
#21 ·
DEATH WOBBLE, TRACK BAR TRACK BAR TRACK BAR!!!!

I hate when people blame tires. why is it only the 3/4 1 ton fords and dodges and JEEPS that get death wobble with these flat tires... no other vehicles... Maybe it has to do with what they all have in common!!!! The straight axle with a track bar..

You buy the nicest low profile tires on the most perfect rims and it will STILL have death wobble... its the track bar or very worn tie rods..... but my bet every time is a track bar
You do realize that folks have replaced every component under the fronts of their rigs including rims and tires only to finally have to replace control arm bushings before they killed the DW?
 
#27 ·
Well guys - like all other posts, (and it's nobody's fault), we're drifting off topic. :confused:

But from what I've read here, I can reach some common solutions.

First off; how did I determine the play in the passenger side tie rod? Two mechanics determined it. Am I strictly paying heed to a diagnosis Quadratec made? No.

Everything I've read here and elsewhere can only point out that 'Death Wobble' is a B....TCH to diagnose. So where do we go from here?

Ok, I see/hear the conflicting views about Mopar. So I think it's safe to say these Quadratec parts will be just fine. Thanks for you input. :2thumbsup:

Quite a number of you shout; TRACK BAR! TRACK BAR! Ok thanks. Since the one tie rod is bad, why not replace the track bar too? :2thumbsup:

The tires are FINE, and we can rule out Balancing. So I'm gonna go with this plan of attack.

In my opinion, (based on what I've read), I think I have a good starting point. I get a pretty good discount at Quadratec = $120 for all parts listed, and we're lookin at about $250 labor. There are NO Off Road specialists that I know or trust around here, and as I said, my Jeep is STOCK.

The ONLY thing I haven't considered are 'Control Arm Bushings' I'll look into that too.

Thanx again
Mike
 
#33 ·
Well guys - like all other posts, (and it's nobody's fault), we're drifting off topic. :confused:

But from what I've read here, I can reach some common solutions.

First off; how did I determine the play in the passenger side tie rod? Two mechanics determined it. Am I strictly paying heed to a diagnosis Quadratec made? No.
Few mechanics are familiar with the Haltenberger linkage to make accurate assessments. I'm not doubting it's bad, but if you don't know how to test it, how do you know they are correct? Trust but verify.

Everything I've read here and elsewhere can only point out that 'Death Wobble' is a B....TCH to diagnose. So where do we go from here?
First thing YOU do is the dry steering test. Have someone get in the rig and rapidly turn the steering wheel back and forth to the points where they feel good resistance, typically between 11 and 1, or a bit more.

YOU stick your head under the front of your rig and watch for stuff to move that isn't supposed to be. Do this with the motor not running.

If the tie rod is bad, you will see the body of the tie rod ends move before the steering knuckles start to wiggle. Same goes for most any other worn part under the front.

Pay special attention to the axle side trackbar bolt. The watch the steel part around the bushing and compare it to the bolt. An overly soft bushing will let the trackbar move on the bushing more than the 1/16" or so that is standard.

Ok, I see/hear the conflicting views about Mopar. So I think it's safe to say these Quadratec parts will be just fine. Thanks for you input. :2thumbsup:
Don't encourage him. Put his rant in perspective. He's all butthurt from a couple of bad parts which are causing him grief and he's taking it out on all things MOPAR.

That would be akin to me berating MOOG because I've had two sets of their balljoints go out in 5000 miles. I still believe MOOG makes good stuff, just not balljoints for TJ's.

Quite a number of you shout; TRACK BAR! TRACK BAR! Ok thanks. Since the one tie rod is bad, why not replace the track bar too? :2thumbsup:
YOu only have one tie rod, so I'm missing your point.

The tires are FINE, and we can rule out Balancing. So I'm gonna go with this plan of attack.
Fine as in they balanced out to zero or Fine as in you personally watched them spin true on the balancer? Those are two very different representations of fine.

In my opinion, (based on what I've read), I think I have a good starting point. I get a pretty good discount at Quadratec = $120 for all parts listed, and we're lookin at about $250 labor. There are NO Off Road specialists that I know or trust around here, and as I said, my Jeep is STOCK.
I don't see it that way at all.

The ONLY thing I haven't considered are 'Control Arm Bushings' I'll look into that too.

Thanx again
Mike
Those are much harder to diagnose, but in your case, I'd look at them before I replaced a tie rod. Especially with a stock replacement.
 
#29 ·
The Track Bar is the last sign for the Death Wobble once the track bar is worn you tend to notice the Death Wobble more often like every time your at 45 to 55 mph. The true cause is the tires, if you rotate the front tires to the back the first time you notice the Death Wobble it will go away. But sadly it does come back. The problem is inside the tires and its hard to find when the tires are rebalanced, it broken belts inside the tire. The belts tend to break when we hit the fine American Pothole and all the other crap that is on the roads or when you air down and climb over rocks and other obstacles on the trail. And for the more sporty cars They do get the same thing however, its less noticeable on them because of the independent suspensions.

If the tire is not replaced they will blow and look like a semi just lost the retread and do lots of damage to your vehicle. I left one on the rear of my F150 to long and it did blow causing lost of damage, destroying the wheel well and quarter panel of my truck.

I just had the Death Wobble on my 04' TJ and rotated the tires to the back and it is gone and sense my tires are very worn I will be replacing them in the next month or two.
 
#34 · (Edited)
Thanx for all your input

It's a bit too confusing, and most mechanics around here are not to be trusted. I've had the two mechanics try to solve it, and can't.

I'll try the test, but I'm not optimistic.

Sorry but it's too frustrating. I'll return all the parts, (unopened to Quadratec), and just put up with the wobble until I get new tires in about 6 months.

Sorry for creating a storm. Let's just close this thread and go to bed.

Good night
Mike
 
#38 ·
Hi again :(

Way too much information here. :confused:

But I suspected 'After Market Parts' to be generally inferior. :thumbdown:

I'll return all the parts and posssibly make an appointment with the Jeep dealer. But my local dealer went out of business - now it's 45-60 minutes away. Then I'd have to rent a car back. It's the same ole BS with ALL these F....ckers. I don't trust anyone anymore. :nono:

Good night :(
Mike
 
#39 ·
I don't trust anyone anymore.
Rather than feeling overwhelmed, coping with dealers or trying to navigate some of the detours that internet forums can take, maybe try finding some local offroaders. It may not be obvious from this discussion, but I assure you that everybody on here no matter which side of this discussion they were on would take the time to help you if they were local for you and you asked for help. There are people you can trust.
 
#40 ·
all of those posts and nowhere was a front end alignment mentioned that I saw. I saw R/B of tires but not FEA. (Before i get flamed by some of the forum homos i've noticed like to respond that set out to do nothing but prove people wrong or piss them off, i'll admit I COULD HAVE MISSED WHERE IT WAS MENTIONED.) I had a bit of front end wobble myself and when I had my new tires put on they did an alignment. No more wobble. My jeep is also an 06 with 22k miles so I'm not as much worried about the rod ends and other chassis components actually being bad.

If the alignment is good my guess is something else is causing your problem. I'd agree that there are many people out there to get your money that don't care to fix it correctly but surely there is someone up there you can talk to or a 4wd shop you can visit to get the name of a reputable front end shop. Good luck and don't let all the wise ***** on the forums run you off or scare you away from fixing your vehicle. It's got a few miles on it so swapping chassis parts up front isn't going to hurt anything.


...i wonder how many people will quote a particular sentence in this post before realizing it's a freakin' joke...
 
#41 ·
{168.1.92.2}
 
#46 ·
Well said ^^. Can I add Mike that you said you were 62 years old which tells me part of your frustration is coming from the Bull **** on this thread. You don't have the patients do deal with pi$$ing contests. We only get so pasionate about our opinions because we want to help you, and we all hope that we save you some money, and headache. (I am just as guilty as the rest at being confrontational about my opinions, sorry).

Only as an FYI
There are two types of tire imbalance. Most tire shops machines only check for one of them.
DYNAMIC IMBALANCE lies on either or both sides of the center line of the tire, which causes the tire to vibrate up and down (wheel hop) and from side to side (wheel shimmy). To be in dynamic balance, the top-to-bottom weight and the side-to-side weight must all be equal.

STATIC IMBALANCE , also called wheel tramp or hop, lies in the plane of wheel rotation, which causes the tire to vibrate up and down. For a wheel and tire assembly to be in static balance, the weight must be evenly distributed around the axis of rotation.

There are also the other things which mr.blaine just narrowed down into a list for you, of things mentioned by everyone. DW is a pain, and what causes it this time, may not be the same thing that causes it next.
 
#48 ·
Blaine is right. Quite simply, he is a TJ Steering/Suspension professional. I know this is frustrating for you, but try to run it down like he says, step by step. If you continue to drive your rig with the DW, it'll just compound your problems in the long run.
 
#56 · (Edited)
The latest;

Great controversy here JEEEZZZ! :eek:

Anyway, best as I can tell, there's play in the right 'outter' tie rod, and unfortunately I've been leaving out, (missing), the grease joint on the wheel end (driver's side), of the track rod. (my mistake). :mad:

I returned Quadratec Parts; Track Bar, & Tie Rod. Instead, purchased MOOG versions of BOTH. More expensive, but I already knew, (it's worth it in the end).

The New Quadratec Skyjacker Steering Stabilizer? Maybe I'll wait and see if the problem is corrected, then return it unopened as well? Or just have the mechanic put it in as well. One last thought; I do have some play in the Steering Gear Box, but there's no evidence from you guys here, or I've researched, that this would cause DW.

I've always believed in being an educated Jeep owner. The controversy here wasn't necessary to convince me of that, sorry for the friction :( Owned Jeeps for 25 years. I had a good contact/discounts/parts with the last dealer in my neighborhood. Unfortunately they're all gone now, out of business :mad:

But thanx for all the tips, and the entertaining exchange.

WOW WHAT PASSION! - PLEASE LOVE ONE ANOTHER MY BROTHERS.

And yes, I'm a believer in the 'Greatest Generation' (thus my Willy's limited edition). Please visit my film project (address below).
Mike
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top