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So you want a Tummy Tuck...

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#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
So you want a Tummy Tuck

I am aware there is a thread out there similar to this in the fact that it list some of the facts about several skids on the market, but this one is complete and it just for setting up a tummy tuck. This thread will be devoted to the TJ, as this is the TJ Technical Forum and that is what most have on here. LJ's are a bit different when it comes to driveshaft requirements, but most principles still apply.

Everyone thinks they need a tummy tuck these days. They are very useful off road and even make a TJ look better because you are no longer seeing the ugly shovel. A tummy tuck takes more than just several hundred bucks to buy one, there are other things that have to be dealt with. Most decide they don't need one when they figure out how much it will cost. The stock skid not the stoutest, but will hold up to mild wheeling, and comes in at 41.5 lbs.

Depending on the Jeep you have and which route you intend on going you might need one or more of these for your tummy tuck:

1" Body Lift- All depends on how much hammering (or 'modification') you want to do on the transmission tunnel. There are various routes to go with body lifts which include JKS ($135), Daystar, Performance Accessories, Currie, etc. It seems like everyone is scared to do one of these[, whether it be due to looks or difficulty of installation.] I have seen at least 30 posts asking if they can get away with doing such and such skid without one. A lot of people that are concerned with performance think that every Jeep should have came with one from the factory. The 1" body lift is hardly noticeable and will allow other mods like a high clearance gas tank skid. They also help lift the body without changing the COG very much, reducing the amount of bumpstop you need to clear a given tire size.

Motor Mount Lift (MML)- Is needed when doing any high clearance t-case skid on a Jeep that has a suspension lift of 2" or more. Stockers can usually get away with out it, but if you are doing a tummy tuck chances are you aren't keeping the stock suspension height. The reason this needs to be done is when you are stuffing your tranny and tcase farther up you want to tilt the output shaft of the tcase down to help with the geometry you are messing with. By bringing the front of the engine up, you will be able to tilt the output shaft of the tcase down. There are various ways to lift your motor which include JKS(spacers-$60), Brown Dog(full replacement-$84), and M.O.R.E(full replacement-$139). If you choose new motor mounts instead of the spacers, get the rubber bushing versions to reduce engine vibrations. Poly bushings **can** transmit more engine vibrations, but they greatly reduce engine movement and will not degrade as fast as rubber. Rubber's lifespan is usually a few decades...so its your choice.

Double Cardan Driveshaft- Is needed when doing any skid on a Jeep that has been lifted 1.5- 2" or more via its suspension. Stockers can usually get away without it, but if you are doing a tummy tuck chances are you aren't keeping the stock suspension height. Will be needed, Rubicon or not. There are a few out there (Currie, Teraflex, ect, but only one that I would go with- Tom Woods which run around $315 (Quadratec).

Slip Yoke Eliminator (SYE)- Is needed when doing any skid on a Jeep that has been lifted 1.5-2" or more via its suspension. Stockers can usually get away without it, but if you are doing a tummy tuck chances are you aren't keeping the stock suspension height. If you have a Rubicon, you will not need one of these. Many people say that the Rubicon already has an SYE, but that is incorrect. It would have to have a slip yoke in the first place to elimininate it - Rubicons have fixed flange rear outputs. There are several good kits on the market such as Advance Adapters ($270 Quadratec), JB Conversions($300-$400), Rubicon Express ($330)

Rear upper adjustable control arms- Will be needed to rotate your pinion upward. There will be some fine tuning to eliminate driveshaft vibrations. Rokmen and Currie are the only ones I would consider when dropping money on them as of right now. Rokmen-$249. Currie- ($229)

More info on SYE/CV shafts & pinion angle: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/what-cv-shaft-why-do-i-want-one-854790/

CV trackbar bracket-This angled bracket will be needed for your trackbar when rotating the pinion. With out this bracket your stock or adjustable trackbar will bind. Rubicon Express-$70

Rear lower shock mount extenders- When rotating your pinion up, you will find that the can of your shock (if you have piston down, you may not have this problem) will rub the axle. Some extensions like those from Currie-$30 will get the job done. If you're looking for maximum flex, this is a good time to consider shock mount relocation to use long travel shocks - read here: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/low-lift-long-shocks-diy-shock-shifters-whats-advantage-852221/

Spring perch modications- Will sometimes have to be done, but I personally have not seen a Jeep that has absolutely needed it. Rotating the pinion will cause the spring sit a bit different- resulting in the spring trying to arc...meaning the bumpstops will no longer align. This mod is not absolutely necessary with smaller lift heights, and mainly helps suspension geometry on taller lifts.
Read Humbolt's write up: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/outboarding-rear-shocks-upper-spring-bucket-relocation-929056/
Also see this thread: http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/rear-spring-relocator-kit-856163/

Transfer case bracket- Anyone that knows transfer case brackets know that Novak ($150) is in the top of the game. There are others out there like the one from Advance Adapters or Skyjacker that are cheaper alternatives, but just doesn't work like the Novak. The stock shift lever can often be used when a TT is install in conjunction with a MML & BL, since these keep the drivetrain and accessory angles as close to stock as possible.

Skids

Kilby- I really haven't seen many people run this skid, but looks to be well made. Skid is made from 3/16" bare steel (you will need to paint or powdercoat it). Skid can be done without a body lift. Incorporates Rubicon locker pump mount. Clearance gains?
Weight- 38lbs
Price- $340

AEV- I haven't seen one complaint with this skid. Skid is made from 1/4'' gusseted steel and 2.75" more clearance is possible with this skid, but where the tcase sits it has less clearance. Uses a super low-profile tranny mount. Skid comes with flat bolts that cannot hang up on rocks and comes powdercoated. Skid can be done without a body lift, but 42RLE auto owners might need to 'modify' the firewall/trans tunnel. Incorporates Rubicon locker pump mount.
Weight- ?
Price- $529

Rokmen- Beautiful skid, best tig welding I've seen for mass production Skid is made from 1/4" laser cut bare steel (you paint it) that is CNC formed. Gains of 2.25" will be seen. Uses stock tranny mount. Body lift is suggested. I have seen the back of this skid bend from mild wheeling, but this skid provides one of the best all around deals.
Weight-?
Price- $344. +$20 for Rubicon locker pump mount.

Clayton- This skid uses the 2 piece design. I haven't seen many people use this skid. It might have something to do with it only advertising .5" gain for 97-02 and 1" gain for 03-06 Wranglers. Uses 3/16" steel for the cradle and 1/4" for the skid plate. Comes with a finish, but not specific. Works with their long arm set up if you ever decide to go that route.

Price- $475
Weight- ?

Skyjacker- Zinc coated skid made from 3/16" steel with gusseted corners. Comes with shifter bracket. Gain in clearance is not specified. Only made for 97-02 Wranglers. Body lift required
Price- $410 (Quadratec)
Weight-?

Teraflex- Up to 2 3/8" gain. Made from 3/16" steel. Body lift recommended for Rubicon. Comes with finish, but not specific. Comes with a 5/8" MML.
Price- $450 + Rubicon compressor mount for Rubicons
Weight- 79 lbs

Under Cover Fabworks- Made for 97-06 Wranglers, the skid is fabricated from 3/16" thick carbon steel plate (with optional upgrade to 1/4" plate). The parts were designed in 3D CAD software and laser cut then bent on a CNC press brake. The UCF Transfer Case Skid Plate is reinforced in the middle of the skid from one side to the other with a stiffening channel/transmission mount. The front and rear edges are ramped to increase strength and aid in sliding over obstacles. Clearance gains of about 2" over the factory skid plate will be seen. The total height of this skid is about 2". Skid comes bare and does not include hardware.
Price- $169 for 3/16 and $229 for 1/4"
Weight- 60lbs (Im guessing for the 1/4")
New:
Under Cover Fabworks has released a skid that has the exact characteristics of the steel skids they produce, except they will be offered in 304 Stainless and 6061-T6 Aluminum.
Price- $329: 1/4" Aluminum
Weight-26 lbs

33 Engineering- As far as I know they are out of business, if you can still find one it is the 1 of only skid made that can be dropped without supporting the tranny. It uses a crossmember and a skid that is bolted to it. 2.75" of added clearance are said to be gained from the skid. that was ordered bare or powdered. 1" body lift required.

Never buy anything directly from these guys or anything that will be drop shipped from them. Buy from people that have the skid in stock or do not buy at all.
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f176/offroadtoystore-33-engineering-kaput-so-my-dough-811839/
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f176/dont-buy-anything-offroadtoystore-com-809307/index2.html
Offroad Toy Store Reviews

Price-?
Weight-?

Jeepmedic-. Although no longer in business, you may be able to find one used. Skid is made from 1/4" gusseted steel with quality powdercoating. Gains of 2.25" will be seen from this beefy skid. Reuses stock trans mount and includes Rubicon locker pump mount. This was regarded as the best skid on the market at the time JeepMedic closed.

Price - ~$200-400 used in good condition
Weight-?

Goferit- Im not sure if these guys are still around. There isn't much info about these skids and not many people run them. Steel thickness? Clearance?
Price?
Weight?

Savvy Offroad- Everyone is talking about this skid. Will be made from aluminum and there has been word that it will be a completely flat skid. This not only will have the highest clearance, it will have a chance (with the UCF skid) to be the lightest of any skid listed. Savvy has some competitive pricing so I like most people I can wait to see this thing. You will most defiantly have to run a body lift if this skid is flat or do some serious modding to the tub.
Clearance gain-?
Price-?
Weight-?

*Exhaust mod- For every skid listed you will likely have to mod your exhaust so it will not contact the skid and or the lower control arm. Some people can get this done by themselves while others need to go to an exhaust shop. Going to an exhaust shop usually isn't too expensive for this fairly simple mod.

*BL or No-Some skids say body lift required or recommended, but can be done with out with enough hammering on the tranny tunnel as stated in the beginning. While most skids can be done without a body lift, you are tucking the transfer case closer to the body. There will be more noise as well as more heat coming from the exhaust as well as the tcase transferred to the floor board. Keep in mind - with a tummy tuck you are lifting the entire drivetrain up 2" or more - meaning you're changing the output shaft angle and you need to make room for the relocated components. The easiest way to do this is a 1" MML + BL.

*Prices are from the manufacturer unless stated otherwise

Do the math on the products you need for your specific Jeep, can you afford a Tummy Tuck?? Do you play in the rocks enough to justify one? If there are any errors or anything that needs to be added, let me know. Thanks. Thank you Unlimited04 for your help.
 
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#1,021 ·
I spoke with UCF about it, their warranty covers their defects, not my choice of obstacles, I can't blame them for that.
Matt did offer to help me with the cost of a 3/8", but I'm just gonna run this until it doesn't work anymore.
He said he's only ever had 1 other 1/4" AL plate get bent, so it must not be common.
It's got a little more clearance for next time I guess.
 
#1,024 ·
This is a very good read, and I read over most of the first page but did not read all 68 pages, but am looking at making a decision soon and would like to get some opinions on some parts I'm looking at and what all I need.
First off about my jeep. I have a 1.25" jks body lift and 2" springs but after some measurements compared to my stock TJ, my jeep is really at 1.5" of suspension lift.
So, I need an SYE because recently an unknown bad u-joint caused a drive shaft and subsequently a transfer case output shaft failure so I figure its the same labor to replace with stock or upgrade to an SYE, and if I'm doing a SYE why not finally do a tummy tuck.

So first question is whether to get regular SYE or super short style? I understand some of the benefits but i found the rugged ridge regular SYE for 150, and that price is a lot easier on the pocket over the 260 at least for every super short SYE. So is it worth the money to go super short for any lift/tummy tuck height? I was thinking since I'm doing some kind of SYE I may go up almost another inch in suspension since my fenders are all stock and are really close to the tires right now anyways so my height would be higher than I indicated earlier. Next, does anyone have any experience with the Teraflex Extreme short shaft SYE kit? its a few bucks less than JB super short kit and its actually in stock right now, so is it any good if I went super short style?

Next question, I'm debating what skid to get, I'm thinking UCF skids but cant decide which one based on a few factors. I know I dont have the money to go aluminum so I know it will be steel. But is there any chance that with an SYE and a skid near stock height I wont need adjustable upper control arms or will I no matter what need adjustable upper rear control arms. I was thinking if I didnt move the skid up too much I might not need the uppers, but if I need them no matter what then I might as well go with the skid that gives the most clearance.

Also one more question, I see on their website the low profile transfer case mount, what is that needed for? will I need it or is it just optional?
 
#1,025 ·
But is there any chance that with an SYE and a skid near stock height I wont need adjustable upper control arms or will I no matter what need adjustable upper rear control arms. I was thinking if I didnt move the skid up too much I might not need the uppers, but if I need them no matter what then I might as well go with the skid that gives the most clearance.
If you install an SYE, you need to change the pinion angle appropriately:

http://www.4xshaft.com/images/2joint_angle.gif
http://www.4xshaft.com/images/cv_angle.gif

It will be easiest to do so with adjustable control arms.

As for SSYE vs SYE, it never hurts to have a longer driveshaft in this situation. The SSYE will be more expensive in the long run, but it can be very beneficial. But then again depending on your lift height and everything else an SSYE might not be necessary.
 
#1,026 ·
By the time you replace the seal that comes with the rugged ridge sye you could have bought a jb conversion sye. Even the standard jb is shorter then the rr sye. if you go ssye you will need a speedo healer to correct the speedometer.

The low pro mount is for improved driveshaft angles and clearance above the transmission and transfer case.
 
#1,027 ·
I just picked up a Barnes 1/4" steel flat skid for $140 shipped. Going to be interesting to see how it will all work with my new 44re. Also picked up a clock ring for the transfer case.

Got to see if the teraflex seal spacer will work with the overdrive transmission and clock ring. Any other longer seal suggestions would be great.
 
#1,028 ·
I just picked up a Barnes 1/4" steel flat skid for $140 shipped. Going to be interesting to see how it will all work with my new 44re. Also picked up a clock ring for the transfer case.

Got to see if the teraflex seal spacer will work with the overdrive transmission and clock ring. Any other longer seal suggestions would be great.
I just looked them up, seems like a really good price, anyone have any experience with them? that might be a good solution for me to save a few bucks and just have to drill out some hols for the t-case mount. Also, would I need the low pro transfer case mount? I understand that it lowers the transfer case closer to the skid but is this really needed or is it optional depending on lift height. I may get the Barnes 0" drop skid and be at a total suspension lift height of 2-2.5", and trying to figure out if I would need the low pro transfer case mount if I go with the teraflex extreme short shaft SYE.
 
#1,030 ·
ive got the barnes flat belly skid. get some good drill bits and pilot the holes 1/4" is thick!! ive got some vibrations because i wasnt able to get an aftermarket tranny mount i have the unfortunate luck of the 30rh. i plan on adding a few washers to try and lower it im not sure if the vibes are from contact or the new bd motor mounts that i installed at the same time but skids good i also plan on counter sinking the holes that mount to the frame. not sure what to do about the motor mount though id love to have the lowpro mount.
 

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#1,031 ·
rbkelley89 said:
ive got the barnes flat belly skid. get some good drill bits and pilot the holes 1/4" is thick!! ive got some vibrations because i wasnt able to get an aftermarket tranny mount i have the unfortunate luck of the 30rh. i plan on adding a few washers to try and lower it im not sure if the vibes are from contact or the new bd motor mounts that i installed at the same time but skids good i also plan on counter sinking the holes that mount to the frame. not sure what to do about the motor mount though id love to have the lowpro mount.
How much suspension lift do you have? Your lower control arms are steep! Did you have to modify the floor or clock the 231 to run the flat skid?
 
#1,032 ·
its rc 4" springs but rotating the pinion so high it is now uneven with the front. the uppers are even worse there at the end of the thread on the currie adjustables. didnt modify the floor at all wish i hit it with a mallet a few times. i will be adding most likely two sets of washers to try and bring the pinion down a bit get rid of the vibes and counter sink the holes to finish it up. The stock tranny mount is why the pinion is so high
 
#1,035 ·
agreed. My jeep is no longer leval either so i am thinking about getting the 3" metal cloak dual rate springs and would love to cut 3/4" out of the stock mount, im kinda waiting for ucf or savvy to make a mount for the 30 rh but i dnt think i should hold my breath if i could i would go with the lopro!!
 
#1,034 ·
imped do you think id benefit at all from a lowpro mount? just put on the no bl skid and have 4" springs as well. pinion doesnt seem that bad but i dont really know whats good so? fan blade is close to the shroud but doesnt make contact at all. any mods to use it with the 42rle? i seen that pic the one guy said he modded the stock mount but i dont know what im looking at in the pic. matt said the no bl raises everything 1.25".
 
#1,037 ·
youll be fine but if you dont do any clearancing you might get a slight vibe from the slightest contact
 
#1,039 ·
Anyone know the height of a stock skid from an '02 vs a skid advertised as ' 2" drop' or ' 3" drop'?
After adding up all the costs for a flat skid, super short SYE low pro mount, UCA's and all the other little odds and ends I realized it was more money than I'm able to do at this time so I'm hoping to get a skid that is at least smooth and flat on the bottom and just somewhat higher than stock without having to run the Low pro mount and without having to replace my transfer case shift bracket.
I'm thinking of getting the Barnes 2" drop or 3" drop depending on how much clearance each will gain?
( My jeep is 200 miles away at my parents house right now otherwise I would try to take some measurements myself but I can't for at least a week and I need to get my parts ordered soon to get it put back together soon.)
I ended up ordering a advance adapters regular SYE this morning since I found it for 139 shipped, and some adjustable rear uppers.
 
#1,040 ·
jeepbro's said:
Anyone know the height of a stock skid from an '02 vs a skid advertised as ' 2" drop' or ' 3" drop'?
After adding up all the costs for a flat skid, super short SYE low pro mount, UCA's and all the other little odds and ends I realized it was more money than I'm able to do at this time so I'm hoping to get a skid that is at least smooth and flat on the bottom and just somewhat higher than stock without having to run the Low pro mount and without having to replace my transfer case shift bracket.
I'm thinking of getting the Barnes 2" drop or 3" drop depending on how much clearance each will gain?
( My jeep is 200 miles away at my parents house right now otherwise I would try to take some measurements myself but I can't for at least a week and I need to get my parts ordered soon to get it put back together soon.)
I ended up ordering a advance adapters regular SYE this morning since I found it for 139 shipped, and some adjustable rear uppers.
Here is a trick I used for a while until I could afford everything. It's an extra expense, but might save you money while you save money.

Buy the skid you want to eventually run, flat or 1" drop. Then buy a Tcase drop, or hockey pucks. I ran 3 per bolt between my frame and skid.

Check out that anti squat!
 

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#1,041 ·
I'm working on my tummy tuck and will purchase a skid from friend pretty soon except he forgot the name of the skid. Here's a pic I was wondering if anyone could help identify it, didnt wanna start a thread just for this so I thought this would be the appropriate thread to do so. Thanks



 
#1,043 ·
I'm working on my tummy tuck and will purchase a skid from friend pretty soon except he forgot the name of the skid. Here's a pic I was wondering if anyone could help identify it, didnt wanna start a thread just for this so I thought this would be the appropriate thread to do so. Thanks
33 Engineering. Pretty sure they're out of business now.
 
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