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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:27 PM   #1501
SuperWade2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
Not cast, made in the USA, and at least as attractive as a basic steel wheel such as the soft 8.
"attractive" is very subjective since I personally think the Soft 8's are one of the gawd awful ugliest POS's on the planet...

Eagle Alloy 185 fits your description and nearly as butt ugly as a soft 8, and awful close to $100/side

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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:28 PM   #1502
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
Explain to me how that replacing the undersized bolt with a properly sized one, and a proper alignment that corrected the issue of too much toe with 2 deg of caster that removed the death wobble was somehow wrong?

Oh, and the videos of the JKs floating around where someone put 4" of lift with the factory wheels/tires and experience death wobble after the lift.. you gonna blame that on the OEM wheels also?
I believe he was talking about toe, but I am still an alignment noob, and have almost no idea what I am talking about. Yep, that is after reading Flatlander's thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
One of the highest quality wheels made are the Walker Evans which are cast in China. As I've stated repeatedly, just because something is made in China, does not automatically make it junk.

Handsome is subjective, get over it.



Attractive? The only thing I've ever found attractive about a steel wheel was it's ease in welding a pipe to when I needed a vise stand.
Sounds like the Jackstands my dad made when he was in HS. We still have them, and they are my favorite since they are much sturdier and don't wobble like the regular ones do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lumpster View Post
I hate steel wheels, they are for offroad use only IMO. They arent round, they arent true, they look like crap, etc...


I bought some summit racing 050/051 wheels 15x8, 3.75 BS, for 85 each. I like them, after i made them hubcentric like the factory wheels, but steel would have never been right.

Ive owned steel wheels, it wont happen again.
What was wrong with the Moabs other than the size and BS?
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:28 PM   #1503
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Originally Posted by spyder6 View Post
those are quality, would you consider Walker Evan's quality? did you know the rim blanks are forged in China?
Don't know anything about Walker Evans other than they don't make a 15x8 in anything for under $325, they're not street legal, and no one around here sells them. They're not forged either, they're cast.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:29 PM   #1504
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
Honestly, the only three Jeeps that I've personally seen that experienced true death wobble all had the OEM alloy wheels. Needless to say, the DW had nothing to do with the wheels. It was the trackbar mount on the axle side with an undersized bolt allowing the trackbar to wobble in combination with
This can cause DW, but it wont cause the initial wobble that leads to DW


Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
too much toe-in
causes tires to wear faster, and probably makes the jeep track straighter by scrubbing the crap out of the front tires

Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
and not enough caster.
makes the jeep wander, and you lose the return to center on the steering wheel


Anyone want to correct me on this?
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:31 PM   #1505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckRider View Post


What was wrong with the Moabs other than the size and BS?
nothing, you summed up the wrongs. I wasnt running spacers at 200 bucks when for 440 i can run new wheels. and not have to run a load range E tire.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:32 PM   #1506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asknight View Post
Explain to me how that replacing the undersized bolt with a properly sized one, and a proper alignment that corrected the issue of too much toe with 2 deg of caster that removed the death wobble was somehow wrong?
Because you can't dial the caster back out, add the toe and make it wobble again.

Quote:
Oh, and the videos of the JKs floating around where someone put 4" of lift with the factory wheels/tires and experience death wobble after the lift.. you gonna blame that on the OEM wheels also?
Don't know, but what I do know is very few folks understand DW and most attribute either the incorrect fix or don't know DW from peanut butter.

What I do know is steel rims are very often out of round and out of true and wobble side to side. I've not seen an alloy rim do that yet.

You run what you want. You are incapable of changing my mind on this as I've endured far too much time and expense fixing something that a simple rim swap cured.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:36 PM   #1507
asknight
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lumpster View Post
Anyone want to correct me on this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lumpster View Post
This can cause DW, but it wont cause the initial wobble that leads to DW
Yes. All three of the Jeeps that had DW had all three of those symptoms. So you guys picking them apart and saying they won't cause DW are overlooking the issue of those three problems combined.

Go stick a 5/16" or it's metric equivalent bolt in your axle side trackbar mount, set your caster to 2 deg, and your toe-in to 0.5" and see if you don't have DW.

Unless you drive on smooth as glass highways, simply falling off on the shoulder and trying to correct it back, or hitting a pothole can cause the "initial wobble."

At any rate, this has absolutely nothing to do with my hoisting of the BS flag on Blaine to post links of quality aluminum wheels for $100 or less. Someone posting links of cast chinese junk has no place in this challenge, because those have been blacklisted.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:37 PM   #1508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Don't know, but what I do know is very few folks understand DW and most attrribute either the incorrect fix or don't know DW from peanut butter.

What I do know is steel rims are very often out of round and out of true and wobble side to side. I've not seen an alloy rim do that yet.
That was me last April. I thought I had DW when it turns out the diagnosis was warped rotors.

For the second part, I noticed the issues got worse when I rotated the tires. I think the rears needed to be balanced. I have noticed that steels have to be rebalanced more often (my sister's car has 50k on it, and we bought it new. It has been balanced 4 times in that period with no new tires, similar situation with my dad's truck, but not the case with my mom's van. Sis and Dad have steel, mom has nice Aluminum rims).
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:38 PM   #1509
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Originally Posted by asknight View Post
Don't know anything about Walker Evans other than they don't make a 15x8 in anything for under $325, they're not street legal, and no one around here sells them. They're not forged either, they're cast.
street legal? you're an idiot

there is no reasoning at all to determine why a 1 piece beadlock wouldnt be street legal.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:41 PM   #1510
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Originally Posted by spyder6 View Post
street legal? you're an idiot

there is no reasoning at all to determine why a 1 piece beadlock wouldnt be street legal.
The issue of the legality of beadlocks have been covered many times on this forum. To sum it up, the closest we have seen to illegal is a state that will fail inspection for having them installed. That does not mean they are illegal in that state.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:41 PM   #1511
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You know Blaine... when we were dealing with a bunch of DW issues years ago, I recall that a number of them were related to the 10.50 width in the BFG's. Maybe you new friend Mr. Knight might want to consider a different tire or at least a 12.50 width BFG
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:43 PM   #1512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckRider View Post
The issue of the legality of beadlocks have been covered many times on this forum. To sum it up, the closest we have seen to illegal is a state that will fail inspection for having them installed. That does not mean they are illegal in that state.
even then it'd be out of a technicality, nothing really legally binding
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:50 PM   #1513
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Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Because you can't dial the caster back out, add the toe and make it wobble again.
Like I said, all three of the Jeeps that I personally seen DW on, had a COMBINATION of all three of those issues. Since all three were out of spec, I didn't waste time test driving between each issue repair to determine what the cause was. I learned all I needed to know that a combination of those three can cause DW. On the other hand, I've seen many Jeeps with undersized TB bolts from the factory that did not have DW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
What I do know is steel rims are very often out of round and out of true and wobble side to side. I've not seen an alloy rim do that yet.
As are all tires manufactured out of rubber. That's the point of wheel/tire balancing machines. If you hit the steel wheel enough to make it wobble, bending the mounting flange, then you probably would have cracked a cheap cast wheel all the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
You run what you want. You are incapable of changing my mind on this as I've endured far too much time and expense fixing something that a simple rim swap cured.
So far the only wheel you've mentioned to my challenge is Walker Evans and at $325 each, not street legal in any 15" size (beadlock) I don't think you've met the challenge. For the cost of five of those Walker Evans, I can buy 37 soft 8s.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:52 PM   #1514
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Originally Posted by LuckRider View Post
That was me last April. I thought I had DW when it turns out the diagnosis was warped rotors.

For the second part, I noticed the issues got worse when I rotated the tires. I think the rears needed to be balanced. I have noticed that steels have to be rebalanced more often (my sister's car has 50k on it, and we bought it new. It has been balanced 4 times in that period with no new tires, similar situation with my dad's truck, but not the case with my mom's van. Sis and Dad have steel, mom has nice Aluminum rims).
It very well could be the tires and not the wheels at fault. Nothing you said is substantive. We aren't talking about rotors here, either.
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Unread 05-04-2010, 10:53 PM   #1515
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Originally Posted by asknight View Post
So far the only wheel you've mentioned to my challenge is Walker Evans and at $325 each, not street legal in any 15" size (beadlock) I don't think you've met the challenge. For the cost of five of those Walker Evans, I can buy 37 soft 8s.
I guess you haven't taken the hint yet that Blaine doesn't play games.
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