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Unread 08-08-2012, 01:24 AM   #16
Necko2529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrankyGypsy View Post
since i've been considering electric, why not?
Do a search on this forum and you'll find out.

What's the reason for you wanting to go to electric setup?

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Unread 08-08-2012, 06:51 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Necko2529 View Post
Do a search on this forum and you'll find out.
What's the reason for you wanting to go to electric setup?
i did do a search last night and got the typical forum conclusion on a subject like this: mixed results. this one got my attention:

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/el...rsion-1400138/

i just searched again today and found this though:

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f9/el...tions-1384332/

outside the forum about JKs (notably post #4 comparing fans):

http://www.jkowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=76475

and why consider (not wanting yet) it? it seems like an interesting project. plus the threads i happened upon before claimed a mild increase in HP and very slight increase in MPG (every little bit helps, in my opinion), of course. the late 2.4L TJs and the JKs came/come with an electric, so that is enough for me to start considering it. i was planning to further the research on possibly upgrading the alternator/wiring as well.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 09:00 AM   #18
DanZ51
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Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
Have you seen sustained 3000+rpm driving under load? I ran the 2791 for a week. It squealed like a stuffed pig above 3000rpms and burned up a brand new serpentine belt.

I've got a 2771 on now, and it squeals too, but not as bad. It's doesn't start slipping until around 3500+ rpms.
If you're driving "3000 RPM sustained under load" you either have your 4.0 mounted in a boat or you're driving too damn fast (75+ MPH according to your profile)

Seriously, were you running the 6 blade fan with the 2791?

My 2004 only has about a half wrap on the water pump (flat) pulley, maybe slightly less than stock as I run a "P" series power steering pump which is mounted a shade higher. I went to the 2791 in February, which didn't need a lot of cooling at that time year, but this last month has seen some record temps up this way and I've done both highway and trail. I haven't heard so much as a chirp from it although my belt is good and my pulleys alignment is spot on.

The 2791 is noticeable as to when its engaged, like right after start-up or when crawling around. But it hasn't been a bother, and I kinda like that I can tell it's working.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 09:12 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by DanZ51 View Post
If you're driving "3000 RPM sustained under load" you either have your 4.0 mounted in a boat or you're driving too damn fast (75+ MPH according to your profile)
Or he's just driving a 4.88 geared 42RLE on 33s in the mountains. Mine runs at 3k+ easily in places like the Poconos or Catskills around here. Imagine if I lived in the real mountains like he does it would be a very regular occurrence.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 09:30 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by DanZ51 View Post
If you're driving "3000 RPM sustained under load" you either have your 4.0 mounted in a boat or you're driving too damn fast (75+ MPH according to your profile)
try driving steep grades at elevation....like I-70.



This is 2nd gear with the pedal to the floor, and I'm losing speed. I drive this on a regular basis to get to the wheeling trails, so I need to be able to do 4000rpms sustained for several miles in 100F+ temps....without overheating or destroying belts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanZ51 View Post
Seriously, were you running the 6 blade fan with the 2791?
I tried several different setups. Factory 5-blade with the 2791 and 2771, Explorer 9-blade and VDO (Dorman) 10-blade with 2793. As mentioned, the 2971 squealed the belt like a stuffed pig above 3000rpms. The 2771 less so, but its there if you listen above ~3500rpms. The Explorer setup was the worst, and caused overheating below 1500rpms, squealed very bad at higher RPMs, and noticeably drew power from the engine when locked up. Basically the engine could only operate between 1500-2800rpms...useless. Additionally, the belt tensioner is new, and the factory unit it replaced was just as tight...so belt tension isn't the issue.

The factory fan clutch with the factory 5-blade had no slippage issues, but does let the engine get a little too warm for my liking when using A/C...which is what prompted me to look for a better setup. Still haven't found it....I wish I could get a factory 7-blade TSB setup...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanZ51 View Post
My 2004 only has about a half wrap on the water pump (flat) pulley, maybe slightly less than stock as I run a "P" series power steering pump which is mounted a shade higher. I went to the 2791 in February, which didn't need a lot of cooling at that time year, but this last month has seen some record temps up this way and I've done both highway and trail. I haven't heard so much as a chirp from it although my belt is good and my pulleys alignment is spot on.
my guess is you're not pushing the motor hard enough to get the clutch to lock up under full load like I am.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 11:37 AM   #21
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Automatic and A/C on a Jeep? 'Never heard of such a thing

Well, it's pretty obvious you're dumping a lot more heat than I am (NV 3550, and 2 windows). I "tach-it-up" from time to time but there's not to many "passes" like CO. (but it's not Jersey flat up here either).

The 2791 locks up pretty good, you can definitely feel/hear it. But again I have no belt issues. I wonder if the A/C equipped Jeeps have a different (pitch) fan?
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Unread 08-08-2012, 02:13 PM   #22
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I used to GAS about keeping up my speed up passes...but trying to maintain 60mph by running >4k RPM...you're way more stubborn than I ever was. Maybe I'm just getting mild in my old age, but I don't mind rolling up really long grades at 35-45mph. If If i cared that much about uphill highway speed i wouldn' be driving a Jeep. Unless you're rolling up some mythical hill for hours on end, dropping down 15-20mph is far less harsh on your engine and you're really only adding a few minutes to the drive. (all just my opinion...to each his own)
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Unread 08-08-2012, 02:26 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by SHoppe715 View Post
I used to GAS about keeping up my speed up passes...but trying to maintain 60mph by running >4k RPM...you're way more stubborn than I ever was. Maybe I'm just getting mild in my old age, but I don't mind rolling up really long grades at 35-45mph. If If i cared that much about uphill highway speed i wouldn' be driving a Jeep. Unless you're rolling up some mythical hill for hours on end, dropping down 15-20mph is far less harsh on your engine and you're really only adding a few minutes to the drive. (all just my opinion...to each his own)
I normally stay around 3000-3200rpms and live with whatever gear & speed that puts me at, but you still need to downshift occasionally and run higher RPMs. The problem is being a hindrance to traffic, endangering yourself & your passengers. The 40mph range is dangerous because you're moving too fast to follow the semi's in the right lane and going 30mph slower than cars in the other lane...and you can't regain any speed until the next downhill stretch, or bouncing off the rev limiter. It's a problem for lots of vehicles...about the only thing that does really well is turbocharged/supercharged vehicles, like diesels, WRX's, Mercedes, etc. Hence my Jeep may get a boosted.....
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Unread 08-08-2012, 03:23 PM   #24
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I hear that. I drove a bus up and down the Parks Hwy in Alaska more times than I can count. From a commercial driver's POV, the safest thing to do is live with following the creeping trucks until it's safe to pass then get back over. Agreed...sucks...but a longer following distance lets you time your speed-up to pass.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 03:25 PM   #25
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I'm from the school of thought that an I6 has no business revving over 4k for more than a few seconds at a time.
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Unread 08-08-2012, 04:10 PM   #26
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I'm from the school of thought that an I6 has no business revving over 4k for more than a few seconds at a time.
Wouldn't the red line be a lot lower if that was the case?
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Unread 08-08-2012, 04:48 PM   #27
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The valves don't even rotate until your past 3k so I don't see an issue with running 4k on a healthy motor.
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Unread 08-09-2012, 04:46 AM   #28
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Wouldn't the red line be a lot lower if that was the case?
No. I didn't say pushing it up to redline or even bouncing off the rev-limiter from time to time is bad. (mud, sand, snow - wheelspin) I meant sustaining that kind of RPM for extended periods of time or for miles up a long grade is not so good. Jeeps were designed to go slow off the pavement very well, not go fast and pull hills on the hwy like a sport car.
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Unread 08-09-2012, 05:47 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SHoppe715
I used to GAS about keeping up my speed up passes...but trying to maintain 60mph by running >4k RPM...you're way more stubborn than I ever was. Maybe I'm just getting mild in my old age, but I don't mind rolling up really long grades at 35-45mph. If If i cared that much about uphill highway speed i wouldn' be driving a Jeep. Unless you're rolling up some mythical hill for hours on end, dropping down 15-20mph is far less harsh on your engine and you're really only adding a few minutes to the drive. (all just my opinion...to each his own)
Obviously you've never driven I-70.
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Unread 08-14-2012, 08:29 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
I tried several different setups. Factory 5-blade with the 2791 and 2771, Explorer 9-blade and VDO (Dorman) 10-blade with 2793. As mentioned, the 2971 squealed the belt like a stuffed pig above 3000rpms. The 2771 less so, but its there if you listen above ~3500rpms. The Explorer setup was the worst, and caused overheating below 1500rpms, squealed very bad at higher RPMs, and noticeably drew power from the engine when locked up. Basically the engine could only operate between 1500-2800rpms...useless. Additionally, the belt tensioner is new, and the factory unit it replaced was just as tight...so belt tension isn't the issue.

The factory fan clutch with the factory 5-blade had no slippage issues, but does let the engine get a little too warm for my liking when using A/C...which is what prompted me to look for a better setup. Still haven't found it....I wish I could get a factory 7-blade TSB setup...
I'm still baffled why you're having such a belt squealing issue. As you probably know, the factory 5 blade is the same with or without A/C. But the A/C belt routing offers much more wrap around the pulley than the non-A/C (2000 - 2006).

Curious, what brand belt ya running?



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