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Unread 04-16-2008, 10:05 AM   #46
cmulv
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How offten does a nutsert spin? I have and 02 and I am about to drop the tcase to cure some vibes after a 2.25 BB. Is this somthing I need to look out for? Can I get some blaster on them some how?

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Unread 04-16-2008, 10:06 AM   #47
cmulv
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How offten does a nutsert spin? I have and 02 and I am about to drop the tcase to cure some vibes after a 2.25 BB. Is this somthing I need to look out for? Can I get some blaster on them some how?
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Unread 04-16-2008, 11:12 AM   #48
cmulv
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How often does this happen. I have an 02 with some vibes from a 2.25 bb and about to do a tcase drop. Is spinning a nutsert somthing I need to look out for. Can I get some Blaster in the frame some how.
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Unread 04-16-2008, 11:18 AM   #49
tangofox007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmulv View Post
How offten does a nutsert spin?
Pretty often. I think the problem has more to do with the threadlocker applied to the bolts at the factory than it does with the nutserts themselves. Without the threadlocker, I think that the nutserts would not be such a problem.

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Originally Posted by cmulv View Post
Can I get some Blaster in the frame some how.
Problem with that idea is that you lubricate the nutsert as well as the bolt. It could be conterproductive.

Last edited by tangofox007; 04-16-2008 at 05:40 PM..
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Unread 04-16-2008, 03:43 PM   #50
Steelman
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Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
The manufacturer is AVK industrial products. The Rep for the industrial side of AVK for automotive fasteners is Tom McGee. I acquired the samples you see in the pictures from Marshall Sales in MI and the salesman was named Brian. AVK does not sell direct, only through distributors.

The standard pack quantity for this part number AVK 3047 is 500 and that's the minimum quantity I can purchase from Marshall. The lot number of that part is 0391192.

AVK is located in Valencia CA on Rye Canyon Road according to the invoice I have in front of me. They shipped me the samples per my request to Marshall Sales.

That particular number is a special fastener engineered for Jeep and is not available through any other method. It is not an off the shelf fastener listed anywhere. I had to jump through several hoops including finding the factory designation for that fastener and then several back and forth sessions with Brian at Marshall while he cleared the sale with AVK.

I gave you the part number, go to AVK's site, get the phone number and call them about it.
Can you be more specific?



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Unread 04-16-2008, 04:40 PM   #51
will228
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holy tripple post batman...
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Unread 04-16-2008, 05:35 PM   #52
mrunnell
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Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
I never never ever bluff. The manufacturer is AVK industrial products. The Rep for the industrial side of AVK for automotive fasteners is Tom McGee. I acquired the samples you see in the pictures from Marshall Sales in MI and the salesman was named Brian. AVK does not sell direct, only through distributors.

The standard pack quantity for this part number AVK 3047 is 500 and that's the minimum quantity I can purchase from Marshall. The lot number of that part is 0391192.

AVK is located in Valencia CA on Rye Canyon Road according to the invoice I have in front of me. They shipped me the samples per my request to Marshall Sales.

That particular number is a special fastener engineered for Jeep and is not available through any other method. It is not an off the shelf fastener listed anywhere. I had to jump through several hoops including finding the factory designation for that fastener and then several back and forth sessions with Brian at Marshall while he cleared the sale with AVK.

I gave you the part number, go to AVK's site, get the phone number and call them about it.



If you even remotely think that they are remotely the same fastener based on the pics, then we have much larger issues than you thinking you know anything about fasteners.

What are you basing your grade 8 designation off of, the color?


Not if you buy them 500 at a time.

Congratulations on doing your homework and tracking them down. Are you going to offer them to JF members at a low cost since it appears that you are going to end up with 500 of them. That is a big investment for fasteners.
After talking with AVK and Marshall are you able to explain to me why and how my fasteners will fail other than it not being the AVK engineered fastener? Give me some technical data on the fastener for comparison.
I am confident my setup will work, but if it does fail I know who to PM for top secret engineered Jeep fasteners. Will you cut me a good deal?
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Unread 04-16-2008, 05:42 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by mrunnell View Post
Will you cut me a good deal?
I actually got a price cut from the dealer. He said $7.50 was absurd, so he gave me a 40% discount.
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Unread 04-16-2008, 08:07 PM   #54
mrblaine
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Originally Posted by mrunnell View Post
Congratulations on doing your homework and tracking them down.
No congratulations needed. That's what I do. It's also the same way I put together the knuckle saver kit.


Quote:
Are you going to offer them to JF members at a low cost since it appears that you are going to end up with 500 of them. That is a big investment for fasteners.
My intent is to acquire and put together a kit that is much cheaper than what the dealer charges. The Nutserts can be retailed for about 1.50 each and I found a way to engineer a tapered washer that works with a normal grade 8 or class 10.9 bolt so I don't have to have the special tapered seat frame bolts made.


Quote:
After talking with AVK and Marshall are you able to explain to me why and how my fasteners will fail other than it not being the AVK engineered fastener?
I put up the pics for comparison. If you can't draw the conclusion that one is immensely stronger with a larger bearing surface area under the flange, then nothing else will convince you.

Quote:
Give me some technical data on the fastener for comparison.
Weight, strength, design, and upset force.

Quote:
I am confident my setup will work, but if it does fail I know who to PM for top secret engineered Jeep fasteners.
I am confident your set-up will fail. They aren't top secret, if they were I wouldn't have them.

Quote:
Will you cut me a good deal?
Do you think I should?

BTW- I've answered your questions, it's your turn. Why do you think yours are grade 8?
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Unread 04-16-2008, 08:52 PM   #55
mrunnell
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It is not possible to determine the differences viewing pictures without specific material characteristics and dimensions. The flange bearing surface will only matter when installing the fastener, after that it will not come into place because there are no upward acting forces and the skid will rest to the frame rail. "Weight, strength, design, and upset force" do not qualify as technical data. I am sure mine are grade 8 as it was listed in the order book as well as the packaging.
Mine are holding up great so I do not need a deal at this time.
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Unread 04-16-2008, 09:19 PM   #56
mrblaine
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Originally Posted by mrunnell View Post
It is not possible to determine the differences viewing pictures without specific material characteristics and dimensions. The flange bearing surface will only matter when installing the fastener, after that it will not come into place because there are no upward acting forces and the skid will rest to the frame rail.
If the part about the flange were true, then why do the ones you used have such a small flange? If that flange diameter and thickness is sufficient and only needed for setting the insert, then why go to the expense to make it thicker instead of using an off the shelf product?

btw- The wall thickness in the crush zone of your nutserts is .039 and the OEM one is .047.

The flange height of yours is .048 and the OEM is .117


Quote:
"Weight, strength, design, and upset force" do not qualify as technical data.
It's as technical as you calling it a grade 8 fastener based on color.

Quote:
I am sure mine are grade 8 as it was listed in the order book as well as the packaging.
Your turn to get your bluff called. I don't believe they are grade 8 anything and in fact, I can't find a reference on AVK's site for any of their off the shelf nutsert products for use with any bolt grade higher than grade 5 or the metric equivalent.

Let's see some proof.


Quote:
Mine are holding up great so I do not need a deal at this time.
For now. Kinda like the old Pro Comp lifts. They work until you need them to.
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Unread 04-16-2008, 09:40 PM   #57
will228
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im with Mr.Blaine on this one. The OEM equipment is what it is for a reason and i would never be able to justify the risk of loosing my driveline over the amount saved on cheap hardware.
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Unread 04-17-2008, 12:10 AM   #58
mrblaine
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im with Mr.Blaine on this one. The OEM equipment is what it is for a reason and i would never be able to justify the risk of loosing my driveline over the amount saved on cheap hardware.
The AVK inserts he has wouldn't be considered "cheap" by any stretch. I probably have a thousand of them in various sizes in the small flange versions and a couple of hundred of the other styles for various apps and I consider some of the best quality out there. AVK knows what they are doing when it comes to nutserts.

If you buy a console or insta-trunk, there is a little hardware kit in them with a nut setting tool and it all comes from AVK. Good stuff from a good company.

But, the reason for the wholesale price difference is the application and engineering behind the specialty fastener.
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Unread 04-17-2008, 05:41 AM   #59
will228
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oh im sry. i shouldnt have used "cheap". I was referring to the price not the quality. im sure they are good quality just that they are not intended for a high impact, skid plate oriented applications.
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Unread 04-19-2008, 12:08 PM   #60
mortalenema
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BDuece and mrblaine, thanks for the thread and thanks for the nutsert tool idea. They helped with my TC skid install for my XJ.

Last edited by mortalenema; 04-19-2008 at 12:47 PM..
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