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Unread 12-29-2014, 06:31 AM   #1
kevins05TJ
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NSG370 to AX15? How possible?

Hey giys I have a 2005 TJ with the 4.0 and a nearly crapped out NSG370 6 speed with 51k niles on it.. Since parts are insanely expensive and the transmission has a bad reputatuon I was wondering how hard it would be to swap to a 1995 YJ ax15? So far there are a couple things Ive read up on being problems: clutch, flywheel, pilot bearing and most of all the Crankshaft position sensor. If anyone has knowledge on the swap i would appreciate it because im looking at an ax15 right now possibly.

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Unread 12-29-2014, 09:05 AM   #2
mrblaine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevins05TJ View Post
Hey giys I have a 2005 TJ with the 4.0 and a nearly crapped out NSG370 6 speed with 51k niles on it.. Since parts are insanely expensive and the transmission has a bad reputatuon I was wondering how hard it would be to swap to a 1995 YJ ax15? So far there are a couple things Ive read up on being problems: clutch, flywheel, pilot bearing and most of all the Crankshaft position sensor. If anyone has knowledge on the swap i would appreciate it because im looking at an ax15 right now possibly.
I believe the only one of those that is tricky is the CPS. The rest is a straight forward swap to the other parts.

There is a thread on Pirate about swapping in another trans and the guy altered all kinds of crap to do it rather than buy the right parts. He even went so far as to make the new ring around the flex plate with the windows in it to trigger the CPS rather than buy the relocation kit.
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Unread 12-29-2014, 10:42 AM   #3
kevins05TJ
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Thanks for your input! I have been reading and it soumds like you are correct, people are mentioning drilling a hole in the bellhousing to mount the sensor. Would it be that hard to do so? Im pretty good at fabrication as I am a machinist, I just dont know how or where the sensor mounts. Also do you happen to know if my nsg370 clutch, throwout bearing and pilot bearing would work?
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Unread 12-29-2014, 12:50 PM   #4
cmecha
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is there a write up on this?
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Unread 12-29-2014, 01:03 PM   #5
mrblaine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevins05TJ View Post
Thanks for your input! I have been reading and it soumds like you are correct, people are mentioning drilling a hole in the bellhousing to mount the sensor. Would it be that hard to do so? Im pretty good at fabrication as I am a machinist, I just dont know how or where the sensor mounts. Also do you happen to know if my nsg370 clutch, throwout bearing and pilot bearing would work?

I don't know precisely where to drill the hole but I do know that the position relative to the outer diameter of the flywheel is about .010 +/- and too far in wipes out the sensor, too far out and it won't run.

I would bet clutch etc. is different. But, I have a pilot bearing adapter, clutch, flywheel, and pressure plate you are welcome to for the price of shipping and a few bucks for packing it all up.
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Unread 12-29-2014, 05:38 PM   #6
kevins05TJ
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Just took a look at the transmission, it appears that the cps is at about 1 o clock on the bell housing against the flywheel looking towards the front of the jeep while being under it. I also saw RTV sealant in between my cases on my 6 speed. Looks like the previous ow er had problems as well (keep in mind i got it with 35k miles)....sad. but what kind of condition are the parts? New or used? I really appreciate your generosity, Ill keep the parts in mind for sure
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Unread 12-29-2014, 06:24 PM   #7
joe_jeep
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Hesco or advance adapter makes a kit to relocate the cps to fire off the harmonic balancer. Then all the ax15 parts should bolt up, and work like factory.
Every used jeep 5spd has syncro issues.
The ax15 is the better shifting of the 2 options.
Even if it gets old, and dont shift well, it will normally still function.
Other than the synchros, they are pretty durable.

Call advance adapter. Tell them what u r trying to do.
they should have a brand new ax15, and the cps relocation kit.
Good company to work with.
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Unread 12-29-2014, 10:21 PM   #8
Partsmke
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The AX15 bell housing has a sensor boss for the CPS. I'm not certain but I think they used the same flywheel design, they may have changed the plug on the CPS "sensor" wiring, maybe someone can add their 2 cents that has done the swap or has both flywheels laying around. A wiring diagram would help.
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Unread 12-30-2014, 05:12 AM   #9
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The AX15 bell housing has a sensor boss for the CPS. I'm not certain but I think they used the same flywheel design, they may have changed the plug on the CPS "sensor" wiring, maybe someone can add their 2 cents that has done the swap or has both flywheels laying around. A wiring diagram would help.
Would they be able to use the same flywheel with the timing slots needing to be read from opposite sides of the block?

I've not done this swap, I swapped an AW-4 into an 05 Unlimited and we used the CPS relocation kit.
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Unread 12-31-2014, 12:09 PM   #10
joe_jeep
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ignition is totally different. flywheel tone ring is totally different. sensor is totally different.
you might be able to somehow mount the new sensor on the old bellhousing, but i bet it wont be a bolt on mod.
the sensor relocation to the front, is probably the easiest option.
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Unread 01-01-2015, 11:14 AM   #11
Partsmke
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Originally Posted by joe_jeep View Post
ignition is totally different. flywheel tone ring is totally different. sensor is totally different.
you might be able to somehow mount the new sensor on the old bellhousing, but i bet it wont be a bolt on mod.
the sensor relocation to the front, is probably the easiest option.
I was instrumental in the Advance Adapters relocation kit, I furnished them with the first front damper that I had modified. The relocation works great.
I was only trying to find a way to use the stock bell housing that has the "boss" that a CPS bolts to.
LUK lists the same flywheel P/N LFW 193 that fits 1991 to at least 2004 for 4.0 Jeep engines.
Crankshaft Position Sensor Fits: 1997-2004 Jeep Wrangler TJ w/ 4.0L & Manual Transmission, Mopar P/N 56027865AB.
From this information it appears that the OE parts are interchangeable.
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Unread 01-01-2015, 03:16 PM   #12
mrblaine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partsmke View Post
I was instrumental in the Advance Adapters relocation kit, I furnished them with the first front damper that I had modified. The relocation works great.
I was only trying to find a way to use the stock bell housing that has the "boss" that a CPS bolts to.
LUK lists the same flywheel P/N LFW 193 that fits 1991 to at least 2004 for 4.0 Jeep engines.
Crankshaft Position Sensor Fits: 1997-2004 Jeep Wrangler TJ w/ 4.0L & Manual Transmission, Mopar P/N 56027865AB.
From this information it appears that the OE parts are interchangeable.
Do we know if the NSG 370's all have the same bellhousing? If so, the CPS info is incorrect. I looked at one 2 days ago and the CPS is a right angle plastic plug looking thing stuck into the bell housing right above the starter.

Also, none of the AX-15's, NV 3350's I've mess with have a "boss" but more of a hole in the bellhousing and a pair of shouldered studs that the two ears on the CPS bolt to.

Weird coincidence, but the 370 CPS I saw looked more like the speed sensor in the side of the AW-4 which uses a CPS like the AX-15 uses.
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Unread 01-01-2015, 05:27 PM   #13
joe_jeep
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partsmke View Post
I was instrumental in the Advance Adapters relocation kit, I furnished them with the first front damper that I had modified. The relocation works great.
I was only trying to find a way to use the stock bell housing that has the "boss" that a CPS bolts to.
LUK lists the same flywheel P/N LFW 193 that fits 1991 to at least 2004 for 4.0 Jeep engines.
Crankshaft Position Sensor Fits: 1997-2004 Jeep Wrangler TJ w/ 4.0L & Manual Transmission, Mopar P/N 56027865AB.
From this information it appears that the OE parts are interchangeable.
if his jeep was an 97 to 04 this is possible, mabey?
his jeep is an 05.
its the first year for the "benz" ignition.
its all different stuff.
none of those parts interchange.
its a different opda.
its triggered at a different signal rate.
the cps is different.
it fires the plugs twice per cycle.
the flywheel tone ring is different.

the cps relocation kit is also different, it fits 05 and 06 only.
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Unread 01-01-2015, 05:39 PM   #14
kevins05TJ
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Could i just use my 05 flywheel, 05 clutch, an ax15 trans and then hog out a hole in the bellhousing for my 05 cps?
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Unread 01-01-2015, 05:52 PM   #15
joe_jeep
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if you can get the sensor clearance correct, yes it could work.
i bet the 05 flywheel will work with either trans.
check the bolt patterns on the nsg 370 bell housing, it may work with the ax15 also?
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