Goodbye Long Arms... hello short arms - Page 3 - JeepForum.com

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #31 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 08:47 AM
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley
Posts: 29,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterpsc View Post
I'll enjoy this thread.
Maybe, maybe not. I'm not posting any more updates or pictures until someone tells me about radius rod front suspensions.


I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
Knowledge does not equal understanding.
mrblaine is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 08:57 AM Thread Starter
Robert J. yates
Registered User
1998 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: mars
Posts: 3,079
LOL Blaine..... I guess the title was not enough on it's own to incite some difference of opinion.

As for the tank.... Some of you should cruise the for sale boards more often. I gave someone a smoking deal on it to get it out of my hair.
Robert J. yates is offline  
post #33 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:03 AM
Imped
Registered User
2004 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 20,309
From my limited research, radius rod suspensions are similar to radius arm setups but don't rely on such a large bind factor at the wrist. There is one link mounting point on the frame and two on the axle (upper and lower).

That's all I know. I could go into the why's but I'm not sure I'd be right. As to why it would be a good thing on a tall TJ......uuuhhh, it allows for a flatter link angle? That's assuming it's a GOOD thing. From my research with radius arms, it's not.

OlllllllO
Float Test Build
IndyORV

Last edited by Imped; 07-27-2010 at 09:16 AM.
Imped is online now  
post #34 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:12 AM
RikatyJeep
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lubbock Texas
Posts: 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Maybe, maybe not. I'm not posting any more updates or pictures until someone tells me about radius rod front suspensions.
There is no upper mount to the frame, so they would unload horribly on any kind of incline, and a lifted TJ, with its center of gravity higher than most, it would make the problem worse... Those were just my findings

-Dylan
RikatyJeep is offline  
post #35 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:15 AM
Deacon
Web Wheeler
 
Deacon's Avatar
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 5,109
Quote:
Originally Posted by breckboarder55 View Post
Why does the name Robert Yates sound so familiar?
Brock Yates was the Editor of Car & Driver for a long time and was a pit reporter for CBS back in the Dale Sr. heydays of the '80s. Maybe Robert is related?
Deacon is offline  
post #36 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:16 AM
AustinCJer
u mad, bro?
 
AustinCJer's Avatar
1978 CJ7 
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 2,383
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Maybe, maybe not. I'm not posting any more updates or pictures until someone tells me about radius rod front suspensions.
Am I understanding correctly that its part "swaybar" - part "trac-bar"? In this case, would it be used for further stability on your TJ?
AustinCJer is offline  
post #37 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:18 AM
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley
Posts: 29,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by RikatyJeep View Post
There is no upper mount to the frame, so they would unload horribly on any kind of incline, and a lifted TJ, with its center of gravity higher than most, it would make the problem worse... Those were just my findings
Not only does it unload pretty badly, but they are very difficult to adjust given that the front axle on a TJ has mild triangulation between the upper and lower arms.

A radius rod in it's pure form has no ability to change the angle at the chassis pivot, so as you adjust caster or wheelbase slightly, the links have to be distorted to line up with the mounts.

I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
Knowledge does not equal understanding.
mrblaine is online now  
post #38 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:22 AM
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley
Posts: 29,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinTJer View Post
Am I understanding correctly that its part "swaybar" - part "trac-bar"? In this case, would it be used for further stability on your TJ?
No, go to the link and arrow down to the front radius rod section to give an idea of what it mostly looks like and the concept.

Zig's Street Rod - Suspension - Front Components

I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
Knowledge does not equal understanding.
mrblaine is online now  
post #39 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:23 AM
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 24,172
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Here's your challenge for the day. Learn what radius rod suspension is and why it would or would not be a good thing on the front of an over height TJ.
why do I get picked on today

I'm assuming you're refering to radius arm suspension, like some aftermarket's like to run, or the old F150/Broncos.

Well, on a tall TJ, I would expect weird pinion/caster changes during flex & suspension travel since the housing remains fixed. so instead of the pinion moving with the two unequal radii, you'd get one radius. i suspect that would lead to rather interesting dive/anti-dive properties in the front end...making uphill climbing on rocks result in major unloading without a suckdown winch.

how close am I?

EDIT: ***aww you already answered as I was typing***
Unlimited04 is offline  
post #40 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:25 AM
Imped
Registered User
2004 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 20,309
Well damn. I put way too much thought into something once again. I already knew the answer.

OlllllllO
Float Test Build
IndyORV
Imped is online now  
post #41 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:26 AM
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley
Posts: 29,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
why do I get picked on today

I'm assuming you're refering to radius arm suspension, like some aftermarket's like to run, or the old F150/Broncos.

Well, on a tall TJ, I would expect weird pinion/caster changes during flex & suspension travel since the housing remains fixed. so instead of the pinion moving with the two unequal radii, you'd get one radii. i suspect that would lead to rather interesting dive/anti-dive properties in the front end...making uphill climbing on rocks result in major unloading without a suckdown winch.

how close am I?
Go to the link I posted and get a clarified view of what we're dealing with. It's an adjustable radius rod, not radius arm. Only make the links adjustable at both ends and now you have a triangle that has offset planes.

I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
Knowledge does not equal understanding.
mrblaine is online now  
post #42 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:28 AM
RikatyJeep
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lubbock Texas
Posts: 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Not only does it unload pretty badly, but they are very difficult to adjust given that the front axle on a TJ has mild triangulation between the upper and lower arms.

A radius rod in it's pure form has no ability to change the angle at the chassis pivot, so as you adjust caster or wheelbase slightly, the links have to be distorted to line up with the mounts.
Four Wheeler did an install on an 07 JK, and they seem to like it, maybe this is different that what you're talking about. Maybe with a longer wheel based JK it may not be so bad.

2007 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon Suspension - Four Wheeler Magazine

**EDIT** Wrong type, more of a radius arm like Unlimited04 was talking about
RikatyJeep is offline  
post #43 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:32 AM
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 24,172
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Go to the link I posted and get a clarified view of what we're dealing with. It's an adjustable radius rod, not radius arm. Only make the links adjustable at both ends and now you have a triangle that has offset planes.
ohhh i think i see now...two arms of near equal length that are fixed to each other at one end, which mounts to the frame, and two adjustable ends at the axle? vs the radius arm, which has one long arm and one short arm, with the short arm mounted to the axle and center of the long arm...or i guess a "wristed" radius arm?
Unlimited04 is offline  
post #44 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:35 AM
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley
Posts: 29,897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
ohhh i think i see now...two arms of near equal length that are fixed to each other at one end, which mounts to the frame, and two adjustable ends at the axle? vs the radius arm, which has one long arm and one short arm, with the short arm mounted to the axle and center of the long arm...or i guess a "wristed" radius arm?


Yes, radius rod, not wristed radius arm, which by the way, the article fairly well screwed the pooch on their reasons to install one.

I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
Knowledge does not equal understanding.
mrblaine is online now  
post #45 of 731 Old 07-27-2010, 09:40 AM
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 24,172
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
Yes, radius rod, not wristed radius arm, which by the way, the article fairly well screwed the pooch on their reasons to install one.
on that ford roadster example, i could see lots of torsional effects since the upper and lower mounts want to change planes under flex with the radii the axle housing travels in (with respect to each other - three mounting points wouldn't remain in the same plane). i could see how it would work on a roadster where the I-beam doesn't have a lot of travel, but the torsion of off-road suspension would place lots of stress on the union between the two arms and the axle mounts.

How close was that?
Unlimited04 is offline  
Reply

Tags
control arms , currie , custom , fabrication , long arms , mod , modification , savvy , short arms , suspension , tj , wrangler

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the JeepForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Jeep Forums Replies Last Post
short arms vs long arms AlabamaTJ98 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 15 03-09-2010 11:07 PM
Ride difference between long and short arms FatBuoy JK Wrangler Technical Forum 7 01-08-2009 03:20 PM
Short arms w/ tummy tuck, or long arms? P89Jeeper TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 5 08-16-2008 05:47 AM
Long Arms w/ rear Radius arms? YellowNJTJ02 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 22 12-06-2006 08:20 AM
Best TJ short arms smurison14 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 16 08-04-2006 07:59 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome