Which front drive shaft did you use for 2" suspension + 1" BL 1" MML, and Tummy Tuck? - JeepForum.com
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Unread 05-16-2011, 12:35 AM   #1
awalp
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Which front drive shaft did you use for 2" suspension + 1" BL 1" MML, and Tummy Tuck?

Looking for a pre-built (non-custom) front driveshaft for...
-- ~2" (2" OME) Suspension lift
-- 1" BL
-- 1" MML
-- UCF Ultra High Clearance Skid w/ Lowpro transmission mount.
2004 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon

Putting the Jeep at what would be 4-6" of lift for the rear drive shaft
-- Got that taken care of with a Tom Woods Driveshaft for 03-06 Rubicon w/ 2-6" of lift.

My front drive shaft is already overstressed with only 2" suspension lift. I need my Jeep 24/7 for towing lawn service equipment, so I cannot wait while a custom one is made.

I need a pre-built after-market FRONT drive shaft, for a Jeep 2004 Rubicon lifted 4-6"!!
-- 2" Suspension lift + ~2.5" TT lift,... about 4" lift at front driveshaft...

Anyone know if the Tom Woods front driveshaft on quadratec will work on a Jeep with 4-6" of lift?
http://www.quadratec.com/products/52300_900_07.htm
-- There is no information, but it is priced like it should be what I need.
-- I believe a stock front drive shaft has only a 3" movement, so at 4" of lift I'm screwed.
-- All Tom Woods rear drive shafts on quadratec are for 2-6" of lift, maybe the front one is too? that would be perfect.

Summary: Where can I find a FRONT drive shaft that is already built, buyable, and is designed to properly fit a Jeep TJ Rubicon (2004) with 4-6" of lift?

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Unread 05-16-2011, 12:53 AM   #2
saddis
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Explain why your stock DS is overstressed with only an OME lift and TT? You can run 4" lifts and TT's and still be fine with stock front DS. People do it all the time! The front DS is already a double cardon shaft, and it's really long compared to rear shaft.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 05:03 AM   #3
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Here goes the over-analyzing again....

I can assure you the front shaft is fine. Adjustable control arms will allow you to dial in pinion angle/caster so that it's not "overstressed" anymore.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 06:16 AM   #4
conceitedjake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awalp View Post
My front drive shaft is already overstressed with only 2" suspension lift. I need my Jeep 24/7 for towing lawn service equipment, so I cannot wait while a custom one is made.
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Are you towing in 4x4? You should'nt be.......if not then the time to make your custom driveshaft shouldnt be an issue. I doubt you need it anyways.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 06:20 AM   #5
MAMMOTH
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Your stock DS is just fine.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 06:31 AM   #6
Jeffro06
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First off, why another thread?

Second unless you're going wheeling, while pulling your lawn equipment, you should be able to wait for a new front drive shaft. IF it is in fact a hunk of junk, order a new custom one, AFTER you do the Tummy Tuck. Until then remove the front drive shaft.

It's always better to measure how long you'll actually need you drive shaft to be, than get one that's built for 3-6" lifts, since jeeps are odd animals.

I also doubt your front drive shaft is currently overstressed, mine isn't. You may have a worn out u-joint, but it's not overstressed due to it's angle.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 07:03 AM   #7
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Call Tom woods directly. I have a 3 inch ome with 1.25 bl. I ripped the rubber boot off of my front shaft, therefore stripping off the Teflon. I called them for a custom built shaft and they advised me that unless I had a v8 and more than 8 inch of lift that a custom shaft is not needed. I ordered a stock one from qtec and picked it up that day, well I'm also 5 min from there.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 08:29 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imped View Post
here goes the over-analyzing again....

I can assure you the front shaft is fine. Adjustable control arms will allow you to dial in pinion angle/caster so that it's not "overstressed" anymore.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 01:45 PM   #9
danielbuck
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reguardless of which shaft you go with, you don't need to have the front shaft installed to drive the jeep around (and probably not needed when towing anything either, but I've not towed anything with my jeep so i can't comment on that 100% accurately). So you could remove it and drive around while waiting on your new or rebuilt shaft.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:04 PM   #10
awalp
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Explanation of why I need a drive-shaft, and three questions I have.

I started a new thread because this is a unique issue, requiring specific attention.
-- Not only is the "driveshaft" sticky thread wrong saying "CAM Bolt kits fix pinion angle" (when they don't, they fix Caster Angle)
-- No where have I ever heard of this "common" issue which I currently have, and I feel it is an important issue for Rubicon owners.

Quote:
Originally Posted by saddis View Post
Explain why your stock DS is overstressed with only an OME lift and TT? You can run 4" lifts and TT's and still be fine with stock front DS. People do it all the time! The front DS is already a double cardon shaft, and it's really long compared to rear shaft.

Why I need a longer after-market upgraded front drive-shaft....

1) The Jeep shop said that Rubicon's front the stock drive-shaft has a flaw....
-- A) they're not serviceable / grease-able;
-- B) dirt, water, & rocks gets in the boots and they dry rot.
(They said Jeep's at 40k miles have this problem, age not a factor)
-- C) The OME 2" Lift created enough additional stress that mine is now making noise and need replaced.

2) I currently have the options of...
-- A) $150 rebuild + $80/hr labor, not fixing the stock flaw,
-----I) Jeep not usable while being rebuilt
-- B) $199-299 After-market front drive-shaft with serviceable parts

3) A stock drive-shaft only has a travel length of 37" to 40", that's 3"
-- A) A 2" Lift + 3" Tummy Tuck, puts the stress of a 4-5" lift on the front drive-shaft, which only has a 3" travel distance.

4) 5" of lift... is gonna require a drive-shaft that is longer for lifted vehicles
-- A) Tom Woods drive-shafts's for example, are serviceable, are stronger, and are longer,

----------------------------------------
I) Back to my original question....

Does anyone know what the specs on this front drive-shaft are?
http://www.quadratec.com/products/52300_900_07.htm
-- It is a 'Tom Woods' front drive-shaft

1) I'm assuming it is for Jeep lifted 2-6", because every 'Tom Woods' rear drive-shaft on Quadratec is for Jeep's lifted 2-6".
2) I'm assuming it will fit a Jeep Rubicon, as there is no details saying it doesn't, it just says it fits Jeeps 97-06, 4.0L, Manual Transmission

-------------------------------------------------
II) Which brings up my second question....

Are 03-06 Rubicon's front drive-shafts's the same as all 97-06 TJs?

1) I know the rear is different.
2) I know the front differential is a Dana 44 on a Rubicon only, not on other TJs.
3) I do not know whether or not the drive-shaft itself is universal, independent of the differential size and transfer case model.

-----------------------------
III) Logically my last question is....

If the drive-shaft previously linked is not what I'm looking for -OR- If it won't fit my Rubicon, do you know of any non-custom front drive-shafts for Rubicon's 03-06 lifted 2-6"?
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:14 PM   #11
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As many people have told you, everything you are being told about front driveshafts being flawed is wrong. Yes, they aren't serviceable that's true, but so what? They all need fixed at 40K? Well, I have 95K on mine with 3" of lift and a TT and no problems at all.

Next, on your #2, why is the jeep not usable during rebuild? The front driveshaft can be removed and taken to the shop for rebuild and everything else about your jeep works great. Yes, 4WD not available, but jeep generally for getting around just fine.

Next, you are doing the math wrong in your #3. Think of your driveline as a right triangle. The increase in height (lift & TT) is an increase in the length of one of the legs, not of the hypotenuse (the driveshaft). If you go back to your high school algebra and think about the pythagorean theorem you will find that the increase in the leg has a much smaller increase in the hypotenuse.

Lastly, why are you shopping for generic driveshafts that work for a range of heights? Are you really saving that much money instead of calling Tom Wood (or any other reputable shop), give them the measurements and they will send you the right length? No guessing off of whatever you read on an internet site. But as said before by me and others, its not necessary.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:24 PM   #12
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1. dont replace your stock driveshaft untill it is broken or showing extreme ware.

2. if you do need to replace it call tom woods shop directly, they will tell you how to measure for yours correctly. My new front rubicon shaft was $350 shipped from them. they are very helpful and have good pricing.

if you are putting a driveshaft on a lifted jeep they are all custom there is no such thing as a stock from shaft for a lifted jeep. although tom woods has mastered the custom jeep shafts so that he can build them inexpensively with quality.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:27 PM   #13
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AGAIN, read more, post less. Read my post. Caster and pinion angle are adjusted around the SAME PLANE. When you adjust one, you adjust the other. What are you not understanding about that? You're making dumb statements because you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

The front drive shaft has more than 3" of total travel. And even it did only have 3" of total travel, you're making the wrong assumption that for every inch the transfer case goes up (via suspension or tuck) away from the axle, the drive shaft requires an extra inch of length. Draw out the triangle and you'll see it's closer to a 4:1 ratio, not 1:1. And that is also dependent upon shock travel, which you don't have enough of to warrant a longer shaft.

The factory u joints and center ball could probably use replacing. Buy the parts yourself and do the job yourself. It will save you money, you'll LEARN few things, and you'll have a fresh shaft. You're thinking that the stock drive shaft is "unserviceable" for no reason. You're right, the JOINTS are unserviceable but that has nothing to do with the drive shaft tube. You can pay ~$100 for new Spicer u joints and a center ball kit or $300 for a new custom drive shaft. Guess what that extra $200 will get you? The same tube you have now. DOES THIS MAKE SENSE?

If you REALLY want a new drive shaft (because you sure as hell don't need one), CALL up Tom Woods and tell him what you'll need. He'll ask for the yoke to yoke measurement and then maybe you'll understand that a drive shaft for "2-6 inches of lift" is pointless and doesn't tell you anything.

To put this in perspective--I run ~2" of suspension lift and a FLAT skid. The t-case is seeing somewhere around 5" of total lift, if you want to call it that. I run a stock front drive shaft with Spicer joints and center ball. The slip has plenty of travel in both directions for my 12" travel shocks, of which all of it I use. The only difference is that I have a HP Dana 30, which helps out quite a bit with balancing caster, pinion angle, and drive shaft length. If you want to achieve that same balance, I suggest you sell your front axle and go with an ARB'd HP30.

Quit messing with cam bolts, get some adjustable control arms, LEARN the relationship between caster and pinion angle, and rebuild your drive shaft. Oh, quit posting dumb threads.

/rant.

EDIT: Notice how the last three posts said the SAME thing? Quit arguing about things you don't understand.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:27 PM   #14
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I replaced my front driveshaft at 90k miles, due to the chirping sound it was making. I just replaced it with a factory spec shaft. I realliy don't think you need anything special for the front shaft, I'd only replace it if it starts making chirping noises (or any other symptoms of it needing to be replaced).

As others have suggested, I'd give Tom Wood Driveshafts a call. They can answer any question you have, and give you recommendations based on your setup and any changes to your setup that you have planned for the future. They seem to be highly reputable and very knowledgeable with modified setups.

I have almost the exact setup you have, 2" spring lift, 1.25" body lift and 1" motormount lift on a Rubicon.
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Unread 05-16-2011, 02:31 PM   #15
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As others have said your front drive shaft is fine, and increase in hight won't change the length that much. Yes the drive shafts are not serviceable, but I have 80K on mine and I have not had to mess with it yet. As others have said you can take the drive shaft out and have it serviced and drive around in 2wd just fine. The noise you have may be from a bad joint which you can fix in your garage. But until you are done with your mods I wouldn't mess with it. There are many people driving around with 5"+ of lift on the stock front drive shaft.
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