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Unread 12-02-2011, 03:09 PM   #316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
If you ship it to me, I'll put even more IAT & MAP data together of K&N vs stock, and post it here for reference.
That's awesome! I'd pitch in $5 towards shipping or the "donation cost". Anyone else?

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Unread 12-02-2011, 06:41 PM   #317
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Well, gonna try to sell if for a few bucks and recoup the cost of the OEM stuff I put back in this afternoon. You know, it may be a placebo effect, but dang if the engine didn't feel torquier with the stock airbox in it. I've only had the jeep a week and it came with the K&N CAI installed...any validity to that?
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Unread 12-03-2011, 10:47 AM   #318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhopton View Post
Well, gonna try to sell if for a few bucks and recoup the cost of the OEM stuff I put back in this afternoon. You know, it may be a placebo effect, but dang if the engine didn't feel torquier with the stock airbox in it. I've only had the jeep a week and it came with the K&N CAI installed...any validity to that?
If the K&N was dirty and restricting flow then yes, putting the stock stuff in with a new filter may have made it feel torquier.
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Unread 12-06-2011, 11:37 AM   #319
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Thanks

Excellent original post...learned a lot from it.
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Unread 12-12-2011, 06:50 AM   #320
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I put the Banks Ram Air CAI on my 05 LJ and noticed a definitely seat of the pants change as well as better throttle response.
I also did before and after dyno pulls and saw a 9.5 hp change at the high rpm range and a steady hp increase across the entire range. So I don't know why everyone hates CAIs so much unless it's because of the relatively high price. They certainly do increase power. That being said, I have not seen any increase in gas mileage, but no loss of mpg at least.
Look for a full write up with dyno results as I install the rest of the Banks kit, I am expecting some quality gains from the header and programmer.
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Unread 12-12-2011, 08:41 AM   #321
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Be sure to link to your write up here, Bashcraftag.
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Unread 04-04-2012, 12:20 PM   #322
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keep the stock set up unless you absolutely "have to" put in a new intake.
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Unread 04-04-2012, 12:25 PM   #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashcraftag View Post
I put the Banks Ram Air CAI on my 05 LJ and noticed a definitely seat of the pants change as well as better throttle response.
I also did before and after dyno pulls and saw a 9.5 hp change at the high rpm range and a steady hp increase across the entire range. So I don't know why everyone hates CAIs so much unless it's because of the relatively high price. They certainly do increase power. That being said, I have not seen any increase in gas mileage, but no loss of mpg at least.
Look for a full write up with dyno results as I install the rest of the Banks kit, I am expecting some quality gains from the header and programmer.
Haha 10 horses from a CAI on the TJ huh? Is that with or without a Throttle body spacer and 50MM Throttle Body?

For the hell of it I tried out one of these banks kits that my buddy gave me off his 'vette and hooked it up to my Z06 LS7, the increase was 1.3 HP the first pull and -2.3HP the second pull. CAIs are snake oil at its finest.
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Unread 04-04-2012, 12:33 PM   #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bashcraftag View Post
I put the Banks Ram Air CAI on my 05 LJ and noticed a definitely seat of the pants change as well as better throttle response.
I also did before and after dyno pulls and saw a 9.5 hp change at the high rpm range and a steady hp increase across the entire range. So I don't know why everyone hates CAIs so much unless it's because of the relatively high price. They certainly do increase power. That being said, I have not seen any increase in gas mileage, but no loss of mpg at least.
Look for a full write up with dyno results as I install the rest of the Banks kit, I am expecting some quality gains from the header and programmer.

Well, it's been nearly 4 months and we're all waiting for results to be posted...
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Unread 04-04-2012, 12:39 PM   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MFERNICO

Haha 10 horses from a CAI on the TJ huh? Is that with or without a Throttle body spacer and 50MM Throttle Body?

For the hell of it I tried out one of these banks kits that my buddy gave me off his 'vette and hooked it up to my Z06 LS7, the increase was 1.3 HP the first pull and -2.3HP the second pull. CAIs are snake oil at its finest.
Some cars use random air cavities molded into the intake for various reasons like noise reduction, those engines stand a better chance seeing an improvement bc the intake goes straight to the TB, instead of twisting around different chambers. I'd venture to say an LS7 does not have such an intake.

Bottom line, CAI's provide an efficient flow path, if the stock intake does the same thing, there won't be an improvement.
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Unread 04-04-2012, 06:25 PM   #326
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Well I'm nearly a year into my Cowl intake conversion and have not seen a MPG benefit or detriment, seems to be unchanged ....nearly always about 17 just like it was before. As for peak HP though, no data to support it but when I drop into a lower gear to pass someone my passengers are always surprised at how hard it pulls (admittedly this is probably mostly due to it SOUNDING so powerful ....as I've said before it really roars like an old 4V setup with open element air cleaner).

I am still using the K&N I found in my garage and have checked my intake twice and not found any dust on the inside as others have. This is not to advocate K&N's to be used on Jeeps that see the trails but to reassert my original position that dual filtering helps (filtering the cowl screen as well) mitigate the poor filtering of the K&N. I'm still happy with almost everything about my "conversion" (ran the stock tube to the firewall with cone filter mated up to it in the cowl) since it was so cheap and is one of the best ways to get cool air in (cowl style).

Removing the cowl and replacing it to service the filter isn't so bad since I don't have to do it but once a year putting less than 10K on the Jeep annually. Takes four minutes to remove. Unfortunately it's more difficult to get back on ....but still not so bad, a 20 minute venture maybe. That being said, now that I've tried it this way for awhile I think I'll get an F-150 or Windstar airbox as Unlimited04 has links about. Not a big deal either way though. All the K&N bashing and CAI bashing is a little over the top but what the hey ...mine was ultra cheap, gave me more storage (stock airbox) and a better angle and height for water crossings.

Honestly the biggest negative for me ....the whistling sound. That alone may have me convert back to stock. The main reason I might try an f-150 or Windstar box is to see if it can cut down that noise some. I love the roar at WOT but the intermittent whistling at part throttle is annoying. I noticed when snow covered my cowl opening last winter it quieted down a decent bit, I may foam the vent or something like that if a donor box doesn't help.

I think I agree with the sentiment that generally it's not worth doing unless you need to in order to accomodate other mods. In spite of that I have no regrets because I've enjoyed certain aspects of it and like tinkering ...sometimes you just have to find out for yourself whether or not you'd like something. Anyway ....I may try an F-150 or Windstar box if I can find one cheap and hope that quiets it down some. The ease of changing filters and being able to use paper filters will be an added bonus. lol maybe I can retain the K&N as a "prefilter" to use on the end of the Ford box inside of the cowl.
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Unread 04-05-2012, 08:29 AM   #327
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Good info, thanks for sharing!
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Unread 04-05-2012, 02:55 PM   #328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_dippert View Post
Bottom line, CAI's provide an efficient flow path, if the stock intake does the same thing, there won't be an improvement.
If this were true every car would have a CAI, if there were no side effects to having one.

Since every car does not have a CAI, you figure out the reason why every engineer spends hundreds and thousands of RandD researching micrometer tolerances in valve seals for 1% increase in power, rather than slapping on a $100 CAI and calling it a day.

If the engineers at chrystler didn't do it. There's a reason
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Unread 04-05-2012, 03:14 PM   #329
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Yes, it's always a reason based solely and strictly on which will give the best performance without any other considerations made. Obviously.
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Unread 04-05-2012, 04:02 PM   #330
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Originally Posted by MFERNICO View Post
If this were true every car would have a CAI, if there were no side effects to having one.
I would actually argue many cars do have a true cold air intake from the factory (disregarding restrictiveness issues that may be present inherently). Most people don't think of it that way because it's black ABS plastic and theres a paper filter in it...no chrome, shiny parts or stickers.

Regardless of make/model...ask yourself where is the air inlet source before the filter element? Many models are inside fenderwells, inside a bumper, or behind the headlight. Well when you're doing 65mph, those areas are damn cold compared to the engine compartment...where air has already passed through the radiator to get there, which heated up that air to ~150°F+. If there is crappy aerodynamics and no good escape for hot air that has become trapped in the engine compartment, like in our Jeeps, then the motor/exhaust/radiator start heating up that fairly stationary air. So, if that air inlet is drawing air from someplace much cooler...isn't that a cold air intake?

So...then ask yourself how do you know if you're actually drawing in cold or hot air...regardless of what type of intake you have. How many people actually install a gauge to monitor Intake Air Temperature? The engine monitors it...and that's what helps determine timing and fuel delivery...you'd think that would be an important part of making sure you are truely using air that is as close to ambient as possible. If you don't monitor the temps, how are you going to know otherwise? You going to use that scientifically calibrated butt dyno?
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