Drop Pitman Arm on 3" lift? - JeepForum.com

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:10 PM Thread Starter
TwistedDrum5
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 264
Drop Pitman Arm on 3" lift?

I know this gets covered a lot, but I feel like I have special circumstances that usually don't get brought up.

It's a 2004 LJ and this weekend I will be doing the classic junkyard lift with V8 XJ Springs and putting my front springs in the rear. This thread is not about whether that's a good idea or not, so please don't' comment on that.

I already have One ton steering, and stock track bar.

My understanding is that if I use a trac bar bracket on the top of the trac bar then I will need a drop pitman arm.

As of right now I am planning on using the bracket at the bottom of the trac bar (front bracket is on the right)


I feel like if I use both the DPA and the trac bar relocation bracket its really going to screw things up. But maybe I'm just crazy.

Should I use the DPA or not?


EDIT:



If you look in this picture, pushing the trac bar to the right from the bottom of the bracket will give it a steeper angle. Then if I put the DPA on it would give the drag link a less steep angle. The angles would be really off, causing crappy driving conditions, right? I realize the pic is not one ton steering, which is why I decided to make a thread.


CHRISTIAN JEEP member #173
TwistedDrum5 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:24 PM
Jeepson33s
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kennesaw
Posts: 452
I just went through this with my lift...if you use a front track bar relocation bracket then you need to use a drop pitman arm. I was lazy and didnt want to pull my old one off so i tried it without it and had a large amount of bump steer...put the arm on and bump steer was gone.

2003 Wrangler Rubicon Intense Blue- 4" Rough Country X-Series lift - Bilstein 5100 Shocks - Currie RockJock V-Bumper and Rock Crawler Rear bumper - Badlands 12K winch - Tom Woods DS - KC Slimlites - KC Headlight conversion with 4300K HID - 285/75/16 BFG MT KM2 on Rubicon Wheels
Jeepson33s is offline  
post #3 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:28 PM Thread Starter
TwistedDrum5
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepson33s View Post
I just went through this with my lift...if you use a front track bar relocation bracket then you need to use a drop pitman arm. I was lazy and didnt want to pull my old one off so i tried it without it and had a large amount of bump steer...put the arm on and bump steer was gone.
Now im worried about using that bracket. Reading some bad things on here about it. That bracket actually attaches to the bottom mount, not the top. Is that the same one you used?

CHRISTIAN JEEP member #173
TwistedDrum5 is offline  
post #4 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:30 PM
Gary2
Registered User
2012 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 2,700
thats the key thing here read ...........
Gary2 is offline  
post #5 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:31 PM
Barcus
Registered User
2000 XJ Cherokee 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Duluth
Posts: 756
On 3" of lift you don't need a DPA or a drop bracket with your TB. You'll be fine not using either one of them

98 TJ Currie arms-RC 2.5 coils-RC 2.0 shocks-1.25 BL-TF rear track bar-custom bumpstops-mud-scratches-gas.
Barcus is offline  
post #6 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:33 PM Thread Starter
TwistedDrum5
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 264
Would putting a DPA on hurt it? I ask because I have the opportunity to get a DPA for free for my stock one. Eventually I'll probabaly go a full 4/4.5in kit. But don't want to put parts on now that are only going to hurt me in the long run.

CHRISTIAN JEEP member #173
TwistedDrum5 is offline  
post #7 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:36 PM
Gary2
Registered User
2012 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 2,700
and the same for a 4" , no matter how many Rough Country or any one else puts in the box without a track bar drop bracket for the frame end
Gary2 is offline  
post #8 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:44 PM
Jerry Bransford
Administrator
 
Jerry Bransford's Avatar
2004 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Escondido, California
Posts: 65,332
Installing a dropped Pitman arm when the right angles requiring a DPA are not present will result in bump steer... unwanted left/right steering in response to the front suspension cycling up/down.

A dropped Pitman arm is only needed when you have dropped the driver's side (upper end) of the track bar. That lowers the driver's side of both of them, keeping the track bar and drag link parallel (the never ending goal) with each other.

If you were to use a passenger-side drop bracket for the drag link, as that bracket is for, a bad idea no matter how you look at it, that means you absolutely cannot drop the Pitman arm.

The goal is to keep the track bar and drag link parallel. Period. If you drop the top end of one, you have to drop the top-end of the other to keep them parallel. Following so far? So if you drop the passenger side of the track bar via that bracket, a bad idea anyway, then that means you would need to drop the passenger-side of the drag link (which you can't do) to keep them parallel.

Non-parallel trackbars and drag links mean bump steer.

Leave well enough alone, don't install that bracket and don't install a dropped Pitman arm. The ONLY time you should install a dropped Pitman arm is when you have dropped the upper/driver's side of the track bar.

Getting Savvy...

When you have a choice, buy American.
Jerry Bransford is offline  
post #9 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:44 PM
Jeepson33s
Registered User
2003 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kennesaw
Posts: 452
I used the upper bracket that moves the aftermarket adjustable track bar down and so the steering line has to go down with it to prevent bump steer. I understand it as if the track bar goes down (imaginary line) then so does the steering. I have never seen one like that...i have seen people drill holes in the stock track bar location to center up the axle with a smaller lift.

2003 Wrangler Rubicon Intense Blue- 4" Rough Country X-Series lift - Bilstein 5100 Shocks - Currie RockJock V-Bumper and Rock Crawler Rear bumper - Badlands 12K winch - Tom Woods DS - KC Slimlites - KC Headlight conversion with 4300K HID - 285/75/16 BFG MT KM2 on Rubicon Wheels
Jeepson33s is offline  
post #10 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 06:56 PM Thread Starter
TwistedDrum5
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
Installing a dropped Pitman arm when the right angles requiring a DPA are not present will result in bump steer... unwanted left/right steering in response to the front suspension cycling up/down.

A dropped Pitman arm is only needed when you have dropped the driver's side (upper end) of the track bar. That lowers the driver's side of both of them, keeping the track bar and drag link parallel (the never ending goal) with each other.

If you were to use a passenger-side drop bracket for the drag link, as that bracket is for, a bad idea no matter how you look at it, that means you absolutely cannot drop the Pitman arm.

The goal is to keep the track bar and drag link parallel. Period. If you drop the top end of one, you have to drop the top-end of the other to keep them parallel. Following so far? So if you drop the passenger side of the track bar via that bracket, a bad idea anyway, then that means you would need to drop the passenger-side of the drag link (which you can't do) to keep them parallel.

Non-parallel trackbars and drag links mean bump steer.

Leave well enough alone, don't install that bracket and don't install a dropped Pitman arm. The ONLY time you should install a dropped Pitman arm is when you have dropped the upper/driver's side of the track bar.
Thank you Jerry, and everyone else who helped.

Looks like I will not be using the bracket, and I won't be switching Pitman arms out.

CHRISTIAN JEEP member #173
TwistedDrum5 is offline  
post #11 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 07:23 PM Thread Starter
TwistedDrum5
Registered User
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bloomington, IL
Posts: 264
Even with the One Ton steering ill get bump steer? Trying to help a friend out who needs to get rid of his drop pitman arm for a stock one. But I don't wan't to do it if its going to hurt me.

CHRISTIAN JEEP member #173
TwistedDrum5 is offline  
post #12 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 08:13 PM
Gary2
Registered User
2012 JK Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 2,700
I wouldn't use the drop pitman unless you are going to lift yours about 5.5" or taller and use the fore mentioned drop track bar bracket
Gary2 is offline  
post #13 of 29 Old 01-03-2012, 11:17 PM
dcope17
Registered User
2006 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,306
Here's how you want the trackbar and draglink relationship. PERIOD. Mine are both straight so it makes it easier to see but even with a bent trackbar and draglink... you would draw a line through the joints creating the straight line then they need to be parallel.


.

Life with Christ can be explained like a Jeep...
Being in the Word... grows your tire size.
Prayer... gains more ground clearance.
Fellowship... Is like having a good spotter.

The more of these you have... the easier it is to get over obstacles in your path.
.
.My Bible Thread
dcope17 is offline  
post #14 of 29 Old 01-04-2012, 06:19 AM
Imped
Registered User
2004 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 20,308
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwistedDrum5 View Post
Even with the One Ton steering ill get bump steer?
This is a matter of geometry, not tonnage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwistedDrum5 View Post
Trying to help a friend out who needs to get rid of his drop pitman arm for a stock one. But I don't wan't to do it if its going to hurt me.
Why do you think he wants to get rid of it?
You can pick up a stock pitman arm all day for $20 on Ebay. If he needs it that bad, then tell him to go buy it. A DPA is absolutely not needed with your setup, assuming your angles are already good with the stock mounting points.

OlllllllO
Float Test Build
IndyORV
Imped is offline  
post #15 of 29 Old 01-04-2012, 06:58 AM
Must-Be-A-Stang
Registered User
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
will result in bump steer... unwanted left/right steering in response to the front suspension cycling up/down.
Jerry,

Can you explain this? It sounds like an issue I may be having and wondering if I need to look at my trackbar and draglink relationship
Must-Be-A-Stang is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the JeepForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.



Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Jeep Forums Replies Last Post
3.5" RE Lift, Drop pitman arm needed? AD3 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 4 08-12-2010 06:58 AM
Drop Pitman Arm for a RC 2.5" Lift????? Tjosh97 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 28 11-21-2009 12:20 AM
Anyone running a drop pitman arm for 4-6" of lift? DeepSky JK Wrangler Technical Forum 5 07-01-2009 09:32 AM
Does a 4" lift require a drop pitman arm? enochstek TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 21 11-21-2008 03:06 PM
4" lift with Drop pitman arm or stock? JeepRocks86 TJ Wrangler Technical Forum 7 06-14-2006 10:51 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome