Champion 3 row aluminum radiator (review) - Page 18 - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep Wrangler Forums > TJ Wrangler Technical Forum > Champion 3 row aluminum radiator (review)

ANOTHER Rockridge4wd Creation!! Spare Tire Carrier Delete ROCKRIDGE4WD Introduces a NEW Jeep Wrangler JK *led* tail Engo winches available at www.rockridge4wd.com! Free shipp

Reply
Unread 07-07-2011, 11:33 PM   #256
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 23,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by Knuckelhead View Post
You know the one I put in and it wasn't cheap.

Cool the tranny and best of luck to you...
Thanks What radiator are you using? I don't remember, and I can't read the brand name on that little picture of yours. Low res pic + big arse monitor I'm liking the looks of this Champion...but some of the reviews are hit or miss.

tranny has a cooler, and i did switch the lines so the inlet is on the bottom....

Unlimited04 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-08-2011, 10:35 AM   #257
Knuckelhead
AFSOC Retired
 
Knuckelhead's Avatar
2000 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 15,490
Novak...
__________________
TSB Information: http://www.automd.com/tsb/jeep_m/wrangler_mm/2000_y/
Knuckelhead is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-08-2011, 11:24 AM   #258
Robert J. yates
Registered User
1998 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: mars
Posts: 3,011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04

alrightly...can't say I like 230°. If it would stay at 220° I wouldn't be as bothered as I am, but it won't. If I don't change something (pull over, turn off A/C, turn on heater), it'll keep climbing till it hits 250-260° and a CEL is tripped. That tells me something ain't keeping up with the cooling needs. Does yours stay at 220° or 230°, or does it keep climbing over time?
Mine used to climb and the highest temp I ever saw was 236*.

I'm on my phone and I can't see your profile so a few things for you to consider.... do you have a transmission temp gauge if you are running the 4 speed auto? That trans is known to run hot which will affect engine temps. Once I got my 32rh cooled down so that it rarely tops 175*.... my engine temps also dropped.

Have you gone through the ac to check high side and low side pressures and condenser temps? I had my ac serviced after I found the condenser running at 325*.... that is alot of heat to shove into the radiator.

I'm using a Novak radiator myself and have found it to be rather reliable. In addition to multiple after coolers and a bunch of the same Hesco crap you have, I also have my hood vented and my exhaust ceramic coated. My take is that poor aero allows for heat to pool at the firewall and under the tub allowing heat sink into both the motor and trans. Getting rid of that will help lower overall temps over time.

Lastly.... have you been through that fan clutch yet? Make sure it's working and that you hear it kick in.

220* on these things is probably alot more normal than most people think. It took alot of IR temp gun work and my scanguage to figure out that it is a pretty common occurrence.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by samgm2 View Post
And yes, I am an exceptional scientist and engineer.
Robert J. yates is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-08-2011, 12:09 PM   #259
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 23,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert J. yates View Post
Mine used to climb and the highest temp I ever saw was 236*.

I'm on my phone and I can't see your profile so a few things for you to consider.... do you have a transmission temp gauge if you are running the 4 speed auto? That trans is known to run hot which will affect engine temps. Once I got my 32rh cooled down so that it rarely tops 175*.... my engine temps also dropped.

Have you gone through the ac to check high side and low side pressures and condenser temps? I had my ac serviced after I found the condenser running at 325*.... that is alot of heat to shove into the radiator.

I'm using a Novak radiator myself and have found it to be rather reliable. In addition to multiple after coolers and a bunch of the same Hesco crap you have, I also have my hood vented and my exhaust ceramic coated. My take is that poor aero allows for heat to pool at the firewall and under the tub allowing heat sink into both the motor and trans. Getting rid of that will help lower overall temps over time.

Lastly.... have you been through that fan clutch yet? Make sure it's working and that you hear it kick in.

220* on these things is probably alot more normal than most people think. It took alot of IR temp gun work and my scanguage to figure out that it is a pretty common occurrence.
yup, i've got a transmission temp gauge & cooler - B&M with sensor clamped to the hot side line at the outlet of the tranny, so far its been pretty accurate vs my IR temp readings on the pan & trans housing. My tranny temps have been staying below maybe 180°-190°ish since installing the cooler, no matter what the engine is doing. It usually runs between around 120° to 140° as long as I'm not climbing a mountain in 2nd. In winter it barely budges off 120°. The sensor is wrapped with header wrap to reduce heat soak from the cats.

I tried to use my IR temp gun to get A/C condensor readings but it wasn't working too well. Pretty sure the hot underhood air & radiator were throwing off the readings. My cheapo IR temp gun doesn't seem to be good at seperating differnet temps when they're so close together and surrounded by hot air. How did you do your readings? Where did you point the gun?

I've got Grand Prix GTP hood vents waiting for install - based on this write up. I know this will greatly reduce the underhood temps, but I can't bring myself to cut holes in the hood yet. I'd rather have it done professionally by a body shop and have the vents paint matched. I've also got a fully wrapped header I can install, but keep in mind I've got two cats running at 600°+ just inches below the intake manifold. And the tranny lines literally run less than 1/4" from the cats, and I actually found one line touching one cat. I wrapped the tranny lines closest to the cats with header wrap.

I agree 220° is more common then people think, especially after seeing how inaccurate the stock gauge is compared to the Scangauge II. For my LJ, if the needle is pointed slightly past 210° it can mean real temps anywhere between 215° to 240°.

I think I'll try replacing the fan clutch next.
Unlimited04 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-08-2011, 01:04 PM   #260
Robert J. yates
Registered User
1998 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: mars
Posts: 3,011
I found I had to spray certain parts with flat black paint for the IR gun to give anything of value.

What are your trans temps when climbing? You may need an auxiliary fan driven cooler to complement your current set up... heat soak over time is a huge problem IMO so having the fan cooler engage say at 185* would be helpful on this long climbs. That is typically how mine works.

Get a thin disk blade on your angle grinder (I used my air grinder as it's easier for me to control because is smaller) measure 3 times, use good 3M painters tape and have at your hood.... that is how I did mine LoL.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by samgm2 View Post
And yes, I am an exceptional scientist and engineer.
Robert J. yates is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-08-2011, 04:30 PM   #261
TJeeper
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Lindon, UT
Posts: 899
I found the best way to cut the hood is with a jig saw and a fine metal blade. When I use cut off discs the paint would chip a bit, making it more to paint after cutting. Don't forget the painter's tape, and check underneath before cutting.
__________________
Patrick
'99 TJ
TJeeper is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-09-2011, 10:47 AM   #262
Border Dave
Got Sand?
 
Border Dave's Avatar
2001 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Bellingham, WA
Posts: 2,577
Quote:
Originally Posted by TJeeper View Post
I found the best way to cut the hood is with a jig saw and a fine metal blade. Don't forget the painter's tape, and check underneath before cutting.
X2. That's how I cut my hood for my vents and it turned out really good.
Border Dave is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-09-2011, 12:12 PM   #263
TJdualsport
Registered User
2002 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: OC, California
Posts: 2,707
out of the 3 cut outs i have the gen right cutout above the radiator made the most difference for my under hood temps. also the hardest one to cut lol
TJdualsport is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-09-2011, 12:21 PM   #264
Unlimited04
This post/info=my opinion
 
Unlimited04's Avatar
2004 LJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 23,429
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert J. yates View Post
What are your trans temps when climbing? You may need an auxiliary fan driven cooler to complement your current set up... heat soak over time is a huge problem IMO so having the fan cooler engage say at 185* would be helpful on this long climbs. That is typically how mine works.
my tranny temps stay around 160° driving 75mph on the highway in fairly demanding conditions (I-25 )...where I'm using 75%+ throttle. Around town they're staying under 160°. Climbing the mountains tranny temps are halfway between 160 and 220° on the gauge, so my guess is 180-190°...and thats when my engine is seeing 225°+. so i don't think tranny temps are much of an issue.

btw, with my hood closed the fan is sucking air nicely....i can feel it. how would I tell if the fan clutch is bad? when I turn the fan by hand, it moves with some resistance, but not stiff and not free-wheeling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert J. yates View Post

Get a thin disk blade on your angle grinder (I used my air grinder as it's easier for me to control because is smaller) measure 3 times, use good 3M painters tape and have at your hood.... that is how I did mine LoL.
yup got all that...eeeek!!! pretty apprehensive about taking a GRINDER to my HOOD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TJeeper View Post
I found the best way to cut the hood is with a jig saw and a fine metal blade. When I use cut off discs the paint would chip a bit, making it more to paint after cutting. Don't forget the painter's tape, and check underneath before cutting.
Good to know.... Glad I bought a nice Dewalt jig saw on craigslist a few weeks back. I'll have to think about it a good bit before cutting holes in my hood tho.

hmm...new idea...I wonder if cutting some 1" or 2" holes in to the cowl would help exhaust air....
Unlimited04 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-09-2011, 06:15 PM   #265
TJeeper
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Lindon, UT
Posts: 899
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04 View Post
hmm...new idea...I wonder if cutting some 1" or 2" holes in to the cowl would help exhaust air....
Bad idea, you don't want engine fumes in your cabin air.

Just install the GTP vents and be done with it.

__________________
Patrick
'99 TJ
TJeeper is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 07-10-2011, 10:57 AM   #266
Robert J. yates
Registered User
1998 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: mars
Posts: 3,011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unlimited04

btw, with my hood closed the fan is sucking air nicely....i can feel it. how would I tell if the fan clutch is bad? when I turn the fan by hand, it moves with some resistance, but not stiff and not free-wheeling.
Throw a shop rag against the grill.... at idle, it should not drop down but rather the suction from the fan should hold it there.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by samgm2 View Post
And yes, I am an exceptional scientist and engineer.
Robert J. yates is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 08-25-2011, 10:24 AM   #267
wkglenn
Registered User
1979 CJ5 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Westfield, NJ
Posts: 31
Has anyone used the Champion in the CJ5? I have been seeing that all the new replacement radiators for the CJ5's have the filler in the middle and mine is on the drivers side. Any guidance on a replacement for CJ5 would be great. Thanks
wkglenn is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 10-28-2014, 10:57 PM   #268
Gorving3
Registered User
2001 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Ponca City, Ok
Posts: 34
I've seen the web sites showing the Champion radiators have 2 rows of 3/4" tubes and the American Eagle has 2 rows of 1" tubes. Has anyone compared these two aluminum cored/tanks for fit and cooling?

I've had fairly good luck with my original radiator but it's been leaking around the top tank for 3-4 years and I keep procastranating about deciding on which type of new one to order but I don't want anymore of those plastic tanks.
Gorving3 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 10-29-2014, 08:39 AM   #269
mrblaine
Wizard of Brakes
 
mrblaine's Avatar
1999 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Quail Valley, California
Posts: 26,365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorving3 View Post
I've had fairly good luck with my original radiator but it's been leaking around the top tank for 3-4 years and I keep procastranating about deciding on which type of new one to order but I don't want anymore of those plastic tanks.
That is like saying you want your bulletproof vest made out of steel because you don't want one with plastic in it.

Not to mention that yours lasted this long and even with a weeping o-ring that quits when it warms up, it still hasn't failed.

Go get another one. They work well. There are several versions of the ones you are comparing that developed leaks similar to what you have in less than a year.
__________________
I am Savvy
blackmagicbrakes.com
mrblaine is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Unread 10-29-2014, 03:33 PM   #270
SpaceWrangler
Gnarly Adventurer
 
SpaceWrangler's Avatar
2001 TJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Where the Girls Dance Different With Familiar Grace
Posts: 1,499
Wow, this old thread's still around.

This is my experience with factory Jeep TJ PAL and Champion aluminum radiators. Take it for what it's worth...

In my two other vehicles, a '67 Mustang and a '94 F-350 4x4, I went with the biggest, baddest, most row-iest high-performance radiators I could find. They've been great.

So four years ago when my factory TJ radiator started weeping fluid from around the tank / core joint, I picked up a three-row Champion all-aluminum radiator.

It arrived... warped. It was so deformed from the welding process that it wouldn't even bolt in place. So I returned it and waited for its replacement. I shouldn't have bothered.

The second aluminum Champion arrived and fit properly, so I was happy. But it didn't cool as well as the stocker. Instead of a hair below 210˚, the gauge read a hair above 210˚. WTF? But it never got hotter than that, so I just lived with it. I even drove cross-country in the late summer, wheeling and galavanting along the way (see signature).

But in less than a year the second aluminum Champion started leaking from one of the core tubes. F*ck it, I quit. Too much trouble from a marginal item. Into the recycling bin it went.

I bought a new OEM (that's Original Equipment Manufacturer, i.e. factory Chrysler Jeep part, not a cheap parts-store copy) PAL radiator. The original lasted for 90,000 miles, so if I can get that from the new one, I'll be happy. The temp was back to a hair below 210˚. All is well.
__________________
"It always seems impossible until it is done." -Nelson Mandela

My Epic Five-Week Cross-Country Jeep Safari
SpaceWrangler is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Tags
aluminum , install , jeep , radiator , review , tj

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the JeepForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid e-mail address for yourself.
Note: All free e-mails have been banned due to mis-use. (Yahoo, Gmail, Hotmail, etc.)
Don't have a non-free e-mail address? Click here for a solution: Manual Account Creation
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.


Thread Tools


Suggested Threads





Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.