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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:35 PM   #1
SolidBrass
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Bump steer makes me look foolish - what now

So after my death wobble trouble (fixed with adjustable track bar) and got bump steer instead. (I'll take bump steer over death wobble any day) but it does make me drive more erratic.

When I put in the new track bar I removed the lower track bar relocation bracket that came with the lift. It's holes were elongated and no longer round. I figured at the time it was only there to help the stock bar fit. (wrong again)

The problem with that is now the track bar and drag link are are no longer parallel. I can't re-install the bracket because of the holes are fubar. I could buy a new bracket I suppose. I don't think my pitman arm is a "drop pitman arm" but stock.

What would you suggest for resolving bump steer issues.

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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:39 PM   #2
Imped
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Stock pitman arm + stock track bar frame mount = parallel. You shouldn't have bump steer. What are you defining as bump steer?
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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:44 PM   #3
TJdualsport
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do you mean your wheel shakes back and forth when you hit a bumps??
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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:45 PM   #4
SolidBrass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imped View Post
Stock pitman arm + stock track bar frame mount = parallel. You shouldn't have bump steer. What are you defining as bump steer?
When the road is not 'flat' like black top with to much truck traffic it will pull hard right or left. It also pulls when I brake, accelerate. Generally driving down the road I'll feel the wheel pull one direction and then the other and back and forth depending on the road conditions. My alignment in the rear could be off a bit with the control arm changes that I've never really finished correctly. (if you think that could be it). It did seem to get a bit worse with new longer rear springs.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:52 PM   #5
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That's not at all bump steer. Pulling is pulling. Something is loose, worn, or just completely wrong.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 05:56 PM   #6
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Yep what you're describing is not bump steer. Bump steer is when the steering is "bumped" left or right as you drive over bumps or dips on the road.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:03 PM   #7
SolidBrass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford View Post
Yep what you're describing is not bump steer. Bump steer is when the steering is "bumped" left or right as you drive over bumps or dips on the road.
** EDIT Here is where I stupidly AGAIN question Jerry's & Imped's precise brief and correct assessment. END EDIT**

Hmm, Well what you describe I have. If i hit a bump it "pulls" the wheel left or right. (usually left) It's not violent just a strong pull. So what you describe I feel. If the road is dead flat It doesn't pull. But my commute is on the heavily used road so it's rutted most of the way. (but the breaking and accelerating pull is not bump steer you're saying?)

Quote:
Could be the angle the pic was taken but your tie rod looks bent in pic #2.
It doesn't look bent in real life 3D.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:05 PM   #8
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Could be the angle the pic was taken but your tie rod looks bent in pic #2.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:17 PM   #9
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Could be the angle the pic was taken but your tie rod looks bent in pic #2.
The tie rod could be shaped like an S. As long as the toe is correct, it doesn't matter. That's not the issue.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:18 PM   #10
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if you have no other worn out parts ( ball joints ,steering gear, wheel bearings , bushings and so on ) I'd say a complete front end alignment may be in order . How you accomplish that is up to you pay or search here for the infamous alignment thread.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:25 PM   #11
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What I struggle with is that it started with the track bar swap, it went from a 'little' pull to a much stronger one all at once with the change. I ignored it as it did kill the death wobble (it's why I'm still alive). It seems to have gotten worse with the rear spring change. I went from rear sagging a bit to the rear being higher than the front a little bit.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:33 PM   #12
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Neither of those changes should cause a pull. I'm looking at your picture. The track bar and drag link connection points are parallel or very close to it so you don't have bump steer.

Is the front axle centered? Toe set right? Are all control arms torqued down? Are all of the CA bushings in good shape? Are the rear track bar ends in good shape?
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:40 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imped View Post
That's not at all bump steer. Pulling is pulling. Something is loose, worn, or just completely wrong.
I know this to be common with "toe-out"

Wheeling commonly causes toe-out. Your jeep should have 1/8" toe-in preferably but say you turn your wheels hard to the right as you climb up something with the front right tire. It then turns further under pressure than designed and tweaks some things. This then happens to the other wheel and both end up with toe-out. As a result the wheels fight for traction, each wanting to turn opposite directions, as the weight of the jeep rocks left and right through bumps and simple weight shifts between lanes the jeep pulls randomly in different directions. ALSO, under braking your steering wheel (and jeep) may tend to wander hard, this is likely because the shifting weight mentioned prior is now more on the front wheels than the rear as you brake. This makes the situation even worse. If these things I'm talking about seem to be what you're experience I suggest you start with the easy fix, toe-in to 1/8" and go from there.

You can do it yourself follow stu's guide on his site.... google.

Also, just $.02... your DW isn't fixed, your components are worn and your mounts out of round because your tire balance (along with toe-out perhaps) caused them to be. Hope you fix the real issue so it doesn't repeat itself. I'm sure it "appears" to be fixed at the moment but I would be willing to be it's really just closed under wraps.... for now.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:42 PM   #14
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A word on the track bar, if it didn't do the job of centering the axle you essentially end up with one side of the jeep doing the braking since the wheels are offset in that manner. This applies also to those with too little lift to need a track bar since it's hard to find one with 0-2" lift adjustment (such as myself), in that case better to avoid it all together as you'll just set the axle to the other side more instead. As a result under braking my jeep pulls to one side just slightly though aligned perfectly.
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Unread 03-24-2011, 06:45 PM   #15
05TurboS2K
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imped View Post
That's not at all bump steer. Pulling is pulling. Something is loose, worn, or just completely wrong.
I know this to be common with "toe-out"

Wheeling commonly causes toe-out. Your jeep should have 1/8" toe-in preferably but say you turn your wheels hard to the right as you climb up something with the front right tire. It then turns further under pressure than designed and tweaks some things. This then happens to the other wheel and both end up with toe-out. As a result the wheels fight for traction, each wanting to turn opposite directions, as the weight of the jeep rocks left and right through bumps and simple weight shifts between lanes the jeep pulls randomly in different directions.

Common. Get your front alignment setup properly. You can do it yourself follow stu's guide on his site.... google.

Also, just $.02... your DW isn't fixed, your components are worn and your mounts out of round because your tire balance (along with toe-out perhaps) caused them to be. Hope you fix the real issue so it doesn't repeat itself. I'm sure it "appears" to be fixed at the moment but I would be willing to be it's really just closed under wraps.... for now. I see your steering damper is changed, hopefully not to cure DW as that would not be a cure but a band-aid fix as well.
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