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Unread 06-26-2012, 04:59 PM   #16
Michele1221
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lol - no, not Firestone. A local mechanic on South Congress. I just picked up my Jeep - he ended up knocking $50 off for the thermostat ($108 with tax to replace the thermostat). It hasn't overheated since I picked it up, although really haven't driven it around that much - so I'll see. I'll give it a couple of days to see if it happens again and if it does I'll take it somewhere else to get checked. And girlie question here ....if a radiator is clogged, they can't just unclog or clean it?? The whole thing has to be replaced?? I'm wondering if my drive from NJ to TX is what clogged it to begin with - there were lots of bugs lol

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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:00 PM   #17
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and hey - thank you to all of you that responded!!!! Really appreciate it!
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:02 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by threeb

May I ask why so specific On the coolant?

Originally Posted by 09Hemi on JeepsUnlimited.com:


There are three different types of ethylene gycol coolant;

1) IAT ~ Inorganic Acid Technology type coolant ~ this is the traditional "green" formula coolant. This is the stuff that General Motors used until 1996, Chrysler used until 2001, and Ford used until 2002 in its trucks and 2003 in its passenger cars. This is the orginal "green Prestone" we all remember even though Prestone hasn't made this stuff in years! It is available from other manufacturers such as Peak and from NAPA, (their house brand is made by Peak) The green additive package contains phosphate and silicates, and provides good protection for cast iron and aluminum engine parts as well as copper/brass radiators in older vehicles and aluminum radiators in newer vehicles. The corrosion fighting chemicals are fast acting but wear out after two or three years or 36K miles of average use so original "green" IAT type coolants need to be changed out every year or two to minimize the risk of corrosion damage. The problem with "old type" IAT coolants is that the high levels of silicates in them eventually drop out of solution leading to loss of corrosion protection and cooling system problems.

2)OAT ~ Organic Acid Technology type coolant ~ is usually dyed orange to distinguish it from other types of coolant. In 1996 GM began a new extended life coolant call "Dex-Cool". This coolant contains a totally different type of additive package called organic acid technology (OAT). The OAT corrosion inhibitors are slower acting and provide protection over a longer period of time. OAT coolants typically have a service life of up to five years or 150K miles, making coolant changes less frequent, but still necessary.
OAT corrosion inhibitors provide excellent long term protection for aluminum or cast iron but may not be the best choice for older cooling systems that have copper/brass radiators or heater cores.
There have been many problems documented with this type of coolant. Other manufacturers that currently use OAT type coolant as factory fill include 1996 and up Audi, Jauguar, Porche, Volkswagen and Land Rover, 2001 and newer Saab, 1996 and newer Toyota, Nissan, Honda and Mazda.
Many GM vehicles that this coolant was spec'd for developed problems with engine cooling passage gaskets deteriorating to the point of failure, leading to expensive engine repairs. More importantly OAT type coolants have been found to form sludge deposits in engines that have open air, non-pressurized coolant overflow bottles as found in all Jeep WJ Grand Cherokees! It has been shown that Dex-Cool and its clones form heavy sludge deposits in the open to the atmosphere coolant recovery bottles of many vehicles, these sludge deposits are then sucked into the radiator and engine as normal coolant heating and cooling cycles occur. Once this has happened, it may be impossible to fully remove these deposits from your radiator or engine! Dex-Cool also contains a known plasticizer in it's corrosion inhibitor package. That means some cooling system components and seals may eventually fail after prolonged contact with Dex-Cool. The end tanks found in all WJ radiators are made of plastic and will weaken and eventually fail with prolonged contact to Dex-Cool and it's clones. Other cooling system components may or may not be compatible with OAT type Dex-Cool...... do you know how long they might last exposed to it??

Virtually all Prestone coolant products are OAT type coolants and should not be used in 2001 and newer Mopar vehicles. This includes Prestone Any/Make Model, it is a Dex-Cool clone, read the label! Don't use it!

This doesn't make OAT type coolants necessarily bad, in a perfectly maintained cooling system, seviced every year or two not every five years (with a closed, pressurized coolant recovery bottle) they work just fine! These OAT type coolants are just a bad choice for our open air coolant recovery bottle WJ's, especially since there is a better alternative developed by Mercedes and adopted by Mopar in 2001.......... HOAT type coolant!!

3) HOAT Hybrid Organic Acid Technology coolant ~ this type coolant is usually dyed yellow, but may also be dyed orange, or red (Orange is the way Mopar dyes it!). HOAT type coolants are currently used as factory fill by Ford, Chrysler, Mercedes, BMW and Volvo. This coolant has been in use by Mercedes for almost 20 years with excellent results. It was first developed for long haul, over the road, truckers who wanted a coolant that could be used safely for hundreds of thousands of miles! The additive package in HOAT type coolants contains small amounts of silicates for added aluminum component corrosion protection. The small amount of silicate found in a HOAT type coolant is significantly less than found in traditional "green" IAT coolant, and not likely to fall out of solution forming the small green globs of snot we all remember when using traditional green Prestone! Most of the coolants in this catagory also meet European "GO5" specs for hybrid extended life coolant. Thats why sometimes HOAT type coolant is also called GO5. The service life for HOAT is also five years or 150K miles.

This modern technology coolant is spec'd by Chrysler for every vehicle manufactured since 2001. It has all of the benefits of a modern technology long life coolant with non of the downside or problems associated with OAT or Dex-Cool type coolants. It is the best choice for coolant in every WJ. Period!! Case Closed!!


Now on to "universal coolants" such as Prestone Any/Make Model and the rest that claim to be good for "everything" ~ Complete BS!! The problem with "universal coolants" is that a single formula cannot meet the conflicting OEM specs for IAT, OAT, and HOAT type coolants. If a universal coolant contains silicates, it does not meet the OEM OAT specification. If it contains no silicates, it can't meet the OEM HOAT specification. And if it contains phosphates or inorganic acid technology ingredients it cannot meet the OEM OAT or HOAT specs. Universal coolants are usually OAT or sometimes HOAT formulas and can be used to top off traditional IAT type coolants but then will not have the longer service life of a modern type coolant. If you do this the coolant should be changed annually.

It is a very, very bad idea to mix OAT type (Dex-Cool or any Prestone "Universal" product) with HOAT type coolant. Sludge will form,and it will be near impossible to get it all out of your engine and radiator!
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:05 PM   #19
flying_bosun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele1221
And girlie question here ....if a radiator is clogged, they can't just unclog or clean it?? The whole thing has to be replaced?? I'm wondering if my drive from NJ to TX is what clogged it to begin with - there were lots of bugs lol
They clog internally, and generally can't be unclogged, I believe.

Edit: this is clogged and an example of what can happen by mixing or using the wrong type of antifreeze/coolant like Dex-Cool.
image-2856235088.jpg
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:09 PM   #20
JBTJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele1221 View Post
lol - no, not Firestone. A local mechanic on South Congress. I just picked up my Jeep - he ended up knocking $50 off for the thermostat ($108 with tax to replace the thermostat). It hasn't overheated since I picked it up, although really haven't driven it around that much - so I'll see. I'll give it a couple of days to see if it happens again and if it does I'll take it somewhere else to get checked. And girlie question here ....if a radiator is clogged, they can't just unclog or clean it?? The whole thing has to be replaced?? I'm wondering if my drive from NJ to TX is what clogged it to begin with - there were lots of bugs lol

I do not think the TJ radiator can be unclogged as it has plastic tanks crimped to the core. It would also take some time for the internals to get clogged up and using the wrong type of coolant along with using regular tap water to fill or top off the radiator. I also don't think your trip caused the problem and it would take an awful amount of bugs to plug up the radiator. Keep in mind that your engine and AC will be working harder now that your environment is hotter and higher in humidity levels compared to NJ.
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:10 PM   #21
threeb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flying_bosun

Originally Posted by 09Hemi on JeepsUnlimited.com:

There are three different types of ethylene gycol coolant;
I may need to read a bit more and do some flushing and hoping.
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:11 PM   #22
amiller
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele1221 View Post
And girlie question here ....if a radiator is clogged, they can't just unclog or clean it?? The whole thing has to be replaced?? I'm wondering if my drive from NJ to TX is what clogged it to begin with - there were lots of bugs lol
When your mechanic said that the system was clogged, he meant internally. There are many passages in a radiator and heater core that can become clogged over time. Kind of like your homes plumbing.. only in a closed loop. When the passages clog up, the radiator cannot do its job of dissipating the heat because the coolant is not being circulated efficiently.
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:34 PM   #23
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u can honestly spend 10 dollars on a thermostat and replace it in 60 seconds if u were racing for fun. (2 bolts with a air wrench, no need to remove hoses or clamps)

i can do my radiator in 60 seconds, 6 bolts with the air wrench, a few clamps, boom done. (i dont have ashroud in the way)

i hope your mechanic threw in a jar of Vaseline with the bill.
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:54 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele1221 View Post
Just heard back from mechanic - tells me that as it turns out it is the radiator, its clogged and he has to replace the radiator - $400 (plus the $150 for the thermostat). Not sure if I should just pull my jeep out of there and get a second opinion or what?!
You are being ripped off by this mechanic, no doubt about it. While there are definite weaknesses with the cooling system on the TJ, parts are 1) cheap and 2) easy to replace. The radiator replacement is a $150 part, 20 bucks for new hoses, a 1 hour job MAX, and that's if it's hot when you start. As others have said, the thermostat is a no-brainer, 6 bucks, 14 if you get the fancy-pants one. This is literally a 15-minute job. I understand mechanics have to bill for their time, the shop and supplies, but this is just highway robbery.
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Unread 06-26-2012, 05:58 PM   #25
silver97tj
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Hi all

I had simular experience awhile back took jeep on a travel, to florida from upper midwest, got there fine, in march. everything fine until may, start of lovebug season and muggy, HUMID weather till oct. Well the jeep starts over heating at random intervals, parts later and two expensive mechanics, nothing. we get a new nieghbor and he comes over and looks at it and drives it and tell me its the radiator, I look all over radiator looks good even look down inside radiator neck, looks good. I learned to trust his opinion and went to napa and bought new one, mind you I had done flush. Napa guy tells me all "those northern cars have sludged up radaitors". Well install went fine and no more parts or overheating. Well I get curious and take apart radiator with sawsall, well top end was clean as a whistle, BUT the bottom part, that you cant see, was all sludged up and accumulated gunk. Just because it looks good doesnt mean that it clean, even if you flush it...................
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Unread 06-26-2012, 10:16 PM   #26
Michele1221
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one last question - if the radiator was clogged, wouldn't my Jeep overheat all the time?? Not only when idle or in traffic?
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Unread 06-28-2012, 08:59 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michele1221
one last question - if the radiator was clogged, wouldn't my Jeep overheat all the time?? Not only when idle or in traffic?
That's what I would think, but I'm not an expert at all. Hopefully someone else chimes in for you.
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Unread 06-30-2012, 11:10 PM   #28
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hey i am kind of having the same problem but i have personally replaced the water pump, thermostat, cleaned the radiator condensator and clutch fan, its still running kind of hot and its mood dependent, do yall have any suggestions for me the only thing i can possibly think of is that i have a decent about of bent fins on the radiator? do yall have any suggestions
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Unread 06-30-2012, 11:29 PM   #29
c69ss396
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My vote is fan clutch also.
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Unread 03-22-2013, 08:10 PM   #30
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Per the 2004 Jeep Wrangler Repair Manual: DIAGNOSIS AND TESTING-VISCUOUS FAN DRIVE-TESTING
"If the fan assembly free-wheels without drag (the fan blades will revolve more than 5 turns when spun by hand), replace the fan drive. This spin test must be performed when the engine is cool."
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