2005-06 Jeep OPDA_CPS_Distributor Failure - Page 160 - JeepForum.com

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post #2386 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 09:35 AM
badtux
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Originally Posted by efm-7 View Post
I thought about this some more and I realized it won't work because of the amount of rotation needed to get a point of reference
Not really, all you need is one point of reference, encounter it twice to get the shaft speed, and then you can generate the remaining signal synthetically using a D-A converter. The two distributors each rotate the same amount in a given turn of the engine, after all -- the bottom end gearing hasn't changed, that would have changed the oil pump speed, which would require a different oil pump, and AFAIK the oil pump didn't change in 2005-2006. One issue is that the pre-2005 sensor isn't very precise, but you can fix that by changing it to an optical sensor. Which Jeep didn't do for 2005 because optical sensors have some decided issues compared to Hall effect sensors for automotive purposes -- they stop working if they get dirty or wet while Hall effect sensors don't care, for one thing, and they're unlikely to last two decades, for another thing -- but since it turns out the distributor is a maintenance item in the 2005-2006 anyhow, replacing optical sensors from time to time beats replacing camshafts from time to time.

That said, I can't help but think that there's a simpler way to deal with this problem...


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post #2387 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 03:17 PM
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I wish there was a simple solution. Sure makes me appreciate parts I once took for granted
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post #2388 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by badtux View Post
And a perhaps more reasonable question, given that some folks have run their entire OPDA filled with oil by merely sealing the top with the same black silicone used to seal the diffs, is: who cares if oil gets past the bushing into the top? Has anybody tried this to see whether a huge amount of oil makes it up there if that seal is taken out?
I like this, as I have just been inspecting and re-lubing(if need be) the bushing manually. 3x it's still been "wet" on teardown, but arctic temperatures are in the wings

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post #2389 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by badtux
Has anybody tried this to see whether a huge amount of oil makes it up there if that seal is taken out?
I proposed reversing the seal a few months back after vertically dissecting my original failed unit, but don't have the tools to remove the upper bushing, flip the seal, and re-press the bushing. I still have a brand new spare that I would volunteer for the project if someone can do it or if anyone wants to pitch in on the funding. I just can't afford to throw any cash into a machine shop to make it happen right now.

For pics of my dissect look to the first few pages of this thread. I still sincerely believe that the seals may be installed upside down from the mfg.

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post #2390 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flying_bosun View Post
I proposed reversing the seal a few months back after vertically dissecting my original failed unit, but don't have the tools to remove the upper bushing, flip the seal, and re-press the bushing. I still have a brand new spare that I would volunteer for the project if someone can do it or if anyone wants to pitch in on the funding. I just can't afford to throw any cash into a machine shop to make it happen right now.

For pics of my dissect look to the first few pages of this thread. I still sincerely believe that the seals may be installed upside down from the mfg.
What would happen if you simply removed that seal and reassembled the unit? I'm trying to picture why that would be any worse than filling the top end w/oil...

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post #2391 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by BillR
What would happen if you simply removed that seal and reassembled the unit? I'm trying to picture why that would be any worse than filling the top end w/oil...
You can't pull the seal without removing the upper bushing first. I think you need some oil flow restriction, but not complete flow elimination that the current seal orientation imposes.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Paul
“Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.”
― Ron Paul
"Did you exchange your walk-on part in the war for a lead role in a cage?"
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post #2392 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flying_bosun View Post
I proposed reversing the seal a few months back after vertically dissecting my original failed unit, but don't have the tools to remove the upper bushing, flip the seal, and re-press the bushing. I still have a brand new spare that I would volunteer for the project if someone can do it or if anyone wants to pitch in on the funding. I just can't afford to throw any cash into a machine shop to make it happen right now.

For pics of my dissect look to the first few pages of this thread. I still sincerely believe that the seals may be installed upside down from the mfg.
Can you give me a link to your dissection pics? I'd like to link them to the first page for reference.

Nevermind I already did under the dissection section!
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post #2393 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:20 PM
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Hello. The guy on post 876 now has over 12,000 miles on his mod, with no leaks since he sealed the OPDA cup and cap with black rtv at 1200 miles. It's taken on one extra quart of oil in 12,000 miles, crank case never became overfull between oil changes and no squeeking/squaking ever. Still no new OPDA or gear. No problems here.
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post #2394 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:21 PM Thread Starter
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Seal pic reposted for ease. This is the factory position of the seal.



In the above position there is no way oil is getting to the top.

If the seal was reversed I would think oil would be allowed to travel up the shaft on the upper bushing. I say this because:

1. We see the oil from the oil cup flow up and out the upper bushing with no pressure.
2. In addition I think the small bits of sludge found in some OPDA's is actually sludge from oil that has bypassed a bad seal.

If this is true if you were to remove the seal nothing will stop to oil from escaping into the upper housing and everywhere. The shaft will carry it up just like it does with the oil cup.

I don't know what would happen if you flipped the seal. I would think a little would dribble out into the upper bushing. Good luck removing the bushing and fishing out the seal in one piece. I think drilling for an oil cup is easier.
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post #2395 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:24 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dproctor0715 View Post
Hello. The guy on post 876 now has over 12,000 miles on his mod, with no leaks since he sealed the OPDA cup and cap with black rtv at 1200 miles. It's taken on one extra quart of oil in 12,000 miles, crank case never became overfull between oil changes and no squeeking/squaking ever. Still no new OPDA or gear. No problems here.
What did the gear look like previous and do you have an updated shot? Have you taken apart your OPDA?
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post #2396 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:29 PM
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What did the gear look like previous and do you have an updated shot? Have you taken apart your OPDA?
Yup, have u? That's important issue.
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post #2397 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:42 PM
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Will try to get a shot for you over the holidays.
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post #2398 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 07:48 PM Thread Starter
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Will try to get a shot for you over the holidays.
Thanks. I'll link to the alternate designs for the "oil bath" version.
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post #2399 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 08:44 PM
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How about adding something to drain the oil from the cup back into the "reservoir" ?



maybe best to have some sort of mesh to remove particulates.
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post #2400 of 5452 Old 12-05-2011, 10:15 PM
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Not a bad idea but not sure how easy it would be to build. Here is part of what I posted last Sept that got no comments. It is basically a hybrid version of dproctor’s build. Less hardware & all you need is to remove the shaft & drill 1 hole. No thread tapping.

If you removed the CPS & the shaft, you could drill the bushing, accessing it through the CPS hole (angling it to the housing “floor”). Then seal the whole thing like dproctor did then fill the top of the housing with oil. That would lube the bushing as long as there was oil in there & you wouldn’t have to worry about oil spilling over the top of the bushing (it would just re-circulate itself). If you didn’t fill the housing too full you hopefully would not need to seal the cap making it easy to check the oil level. If your seal is good that amount of oil should last a long time. My very early ’05 seal is doing great holding oil.

Thoughts?
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