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post #1 of 18 Old 09-26-2017, 02:39 PM Thread Starter
ZJmac98
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05 Rubicon Mini Cat Question

I have a been doing a lot of research over the past two weeks and cannot seem to find an answer to my question. My jeep is throwing a P0421 (OBD-II Trouble Code
Technical DescriptionWarm Up Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold). I know I need new cats as I have tried the 02 sensors and that still didn't work and the fact that my jeep has 142k miles. My jeep is a California emissions jeep. I live in a county in Indiana that does not do emissions testing nor do I plan on leaving anytime soon. I am looking at the two different complete y-pipe set ups from magnaflow, but there is a big price difference between the 48 state y-pipe and the california emissions y-pipe.

What is the big difference between the two? A stamp?
Will my CEL go away and everything fit/function properly if i get the 48 state y-pipe even though my jeep has the california emissions sticker on it?

These are the two magnaflow part numbers.

48 state
MagnaFlow Direct Fit Catalytic Converter - 50899

California Emissions
MagnaFlow Direct Fit California Catalytic Converter - 458027

Thanks in advance.

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post #2 of 18 Old 09-26-2017, 03:35 PM
mrblaine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZJmac98 View Post
I have a been doing a lot of research over the past two weeks and cannot seem to find an answer to my question. My jeep is throwing a P0421 (OBD-II Trouble Code
Technical DescriptionWarm Up Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold). I know I need new cats as I have tried the 02 sensors and that still didn't work and the fact that my jeep has 142k miles. My jeep is a California emissions jeep. I live in a county in Indiana that does not do emissions testing nor do I plan on leaving anytime soon. I am looking at the two different complete y-pipe set ups from magnaflow, but there is a big price difference between the 48 state y-pipe and the california emissions y-pipe.

What is the big difference between the two? A stamp?
Will my CEL go away and everything fit/function properly if i get the 48 state y-pipe even though my jeep has the california emissions sticker on it?

These are the two magnaflow part numbers.

48 state
MagnaFlow Direct Fit Catalytic Converter - 50899

California Emissions
MagnaFlow Direct Fit California Catalytic Converter - 458027

Thanks in advance.
There is a TSB that I believe covers that problem that involves the relays for the sensors. See if you can find that and do it first.

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post #3 of 18 Old 09-27-2017, 04:37 PM
WeezyBlue
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My 05 has been throwing a P0431 Warm Up Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold code since I got it at about 30k miles. First quick fix attempt was to replace all the 02 sensors and then I found the TSB. I've been lazy to get it fixed. It's been years.

TSB 25-001-07
OBD Warranty Extension Letter

I never knew the fix was so easy, I've been dragging my feet taking it to the dealership just to get rid of a light. I think I'll rewire this weekend.
Looks like it may be covered for free though, might be worth shooting an email to Jeep before you go to a dealership to see if your VIN is covered.

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post #4 of 18 Old 09-27-2017, 06:41 PM
WeezyBlue
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Ok I got bored so I just went outside and did it. After gathering tools it took about 30 minutes of work.
Jeep fired right up afterward with no immediate codes, will report back after driving it a few days.
This is a pic I snapped of where the wires ended up vs the diagram in the TSB. I tried to pull them through the shortest path for slack to solder.

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post #5 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 12:16 AM
Kolak
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The Magnaflow precat/Y-pipe assemblies for CA emissions have significantly more substrate inside the converters. The late systems are very sensitive in that they throw downstream sensor codes even with new converters if the signal comparison between the upstream and downstream sensors deviates from what is nominal.

I've been down this road before - sold a Magnaflow converter assembly to a CA customer who no longer lived in CA but had CA emissions. It tripped downstream codes and we had to swap it out for the CA version. Also have had the same results with weld-on converters if they are not the CA versions.

It's not worth the risk since there's quite a lot of labor involved in removing and replacing the assembly.

I have great pricing for Magnaflow converters by the way. If you need one please PM me here on the forum or email me at kolak@aol.com and we'll chat.

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Member: Specialty Equipment Market Association
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post #6 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 09:14 AM Thread Starter
ZJmac98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeezyBlue View Post
Ok I got bored so I just went outside and did it. After gathering tools it took about 30 minutes of work.
Jeep fired right up afterward with no immediate codes, will report back after driving it a few days.
This is a pic I snapped of where the wires ended up vs the diagram in the TSB. I tried to pull them through the shortest path for slack to solder.
This is great WeezyBlue! This weekend I am replacing a rear main seal so I will be able to get a good look at the upper cats. If they don't look shot then I am going to do the TSB... may need to find a friend that knows how to solder though. I am pretty mechanically inclined but I really don't like electrical. Let us know your results after driving a few hundred miles.
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post #7 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 09:18 AM Thread Starter
ZJmac98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolak View Post
The Magnaflow precat/Y-pipe assemblies for CA emissions have significantly more substrate inside the converters. The late systems are very sensitive in that they throw downstream sensor codes even with new converters if the signal comparison between the upstream and downstream sensors deviates from what is nominal.

I've been down this road before - sold a Magnaflow converter assembly to a CA customer who no longer lived in CA but had CA emissions. It tripped downstream codes and we had to swap it out for the CA version. Also have had the same results with weld-on converters if they are not the CA versions.

It's not worth the risk since there's quite a lot of labor involved in removing and replacing the assembly.

I have great pricing for Magnaflow converters by the way. If you need one please PM me here on the forum or email me at kolak@aol.com and we'll chat.


PM Sent. My dad put the CA magnaflow cats on his TJ a while ago and I could tell a noticeable difference power/smooth running wise between mine and his.
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post #8 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 09:39 AM Thread Starter
ZJmac98
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I am trying to attach an image so lets see if it works. I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.
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File Type: pdf delete.pdf (221.3 KB, 15 views)
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post #9 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZJmac98 View Post
I am trying to attach an image so lets see if it works. I want to make sure I am understanding this correctly.
You've got the PK/WT wires mixed up. If you follow the instruction in the TSB one step at a time it's pretty easy.

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post #10 of 18 Old 09-28-2017, 11:10 AM Thread Starter
ZJmac98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeezyBlue View Post
You've got the PK/WT wires mixed up. If you follow the instruction in the TSB one step at a time it's pretty easy.

Okay that makes sense now. It helps seeing a picture with the wires in color. Thanks again Weezy. I'm going to try to get to this over the weekend.
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post #11 of 18 Old 10-03-2017, 10:35 PM
WeezyBlue
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I've driven 175 miles since rewiring the PDC.
Before rewiring, check engine light was on and testing via the method in the TSB resulted in a flashing MIL indicating the OBD emissions checks were not ready.
After rewiring, the check engine light is gone, and OBD reads ready.

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post #12 of 18 Old 10-10-2017, 09:21 AM
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It's now been 260 miles.
OBD-II still reads ready, but P0431 code has returned.

I remember reading something about a dealership ECU flash to fix this issue years ago, I'm going to try to find that information again.

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post #13 of 18 Old 10-10-2017, 02:45 PM
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How many miles are on your Jeep? It's certainly possible you have a bad converter and thus the P0431.

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Member: Specialty Equipment Market Association
Telephone: 480 998-3661

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post #14 of 18 Old 10-10-2017, 05:09 PM
WeezyBlue
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Originally Posted by Kolak View Post
How many miles are on your Jeep? It's certainly possible you have a bad converter and thus the P0431.
It is a possibility, yes.

The Jeep has been throwing this code since I got it at about 30,000 miles. It comes and goes. It now has 68,000 miles.

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post #15 of 18 Old 10-10-2017, 06:23 PM
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I had a 2004 throw that code. I swapped the O2 sensors and it did not help. I put in the 50-state Magnaflow kit with the 3 cats, cleared the codes, and not only did the code not come back the performance/fuel economy shot up. The mini cat's substrate broke up and clogged the 3rd cat in the back. The Magnaflow kit took about 2 hours to install from start to finish and was easier to put in than the old cat assembly was to remove due to rust and the kit coming in two easier to maneuver parts. If you know how to turn a ratchet, you could do it yourself without too much pain. Be prepared to replace the exhaust manifold nuts (qty 4 6506546AA) and bolts (qty 4 6505754AA.) They will be seized together from the heat and expect the bolt to break with enough torque. If it's seized, no amount of PB or Kroil will help. I had 50% breakage . Regular old grade 10.9 metric M10 nut and bolt hardware from Home Labyrinth will work as well but it is not coated so expect it to rust. (Update: Actually I happen to have one of the bolts at my desk and it's marked 9.8--so the proper spec is M10-1.5 x 45 property class 9.8.)


Check this tread for pics: http://www.rubiconownersforum.com/fo...id-please.html
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