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Unread 03-08-2015, 08:01 PM   #1
Denzien
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"zero rust"

Just curious - when you guys see a Jeep advertised as "zero rust", do you assume they actually mean zero rust - or that there simply isn't any rusted through areas, and that the non-galvanized steel will have pervasive and minor rust all over?

Also, is it common and inevitable that water will enter the tub through the body seams, particularly in the front of the wheel wells?

Thanks.

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Unread 03-08-2015, 08:11 PM   #2
shum8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denzien View Post
Just curious - when you guys see a Jeep advertised as "zero rust", do you assume they actually mean zero rust - or that there simply isn't any rusted through areas, and that the non-galvanized steel will have pervasive and minor rust all over?

Also, is it common and inevitable that water will enter the tub through the body seams, particularly in the front of the wheel wells?

Thanks.
To me, "zero" means zero. I have a real problem with that kind of language being used when it's not true. First thing I'd do is ask them to confirm over the phone - then be prepared to control "fist of death" when they make assurances it's true and ya find out it's not when you lay eyes on it.
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Unread 03-08-2015, 08:38 PM   #3
Ken4444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denzien View Post
...when you guys see a Jeep advertised as "zero rust", do you assume they actually mean zero rust - or that there simply isn't any rusted through areas...
If I ever see an advertisement for a CJ that claims "zero rust", I don't believe it. I assume that the seller either a) doesn't know where to look for rust, or b) would claim ignorance about any rust, or c) means that any rusted areas are just surface rust and don't present a real problem.

As with anything in life, let the buyer beware.
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Unread 03-08-2015, 08:56 PM   #4
Denzien
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Yeah, there was so much surface rust on this Jeep that my wife said it was everywhere. Not that it bothered me, mind you - it just confuses me that someone could look at rust and say, "that's not what I would call rust."


Oh well.
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Unread 03-08-2015, 10:02 PM   #5
CJ65
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I would be wary as to what else is wrong. You really won't know til you start turning a wrench on it. Then you will discover the issues and have you doing the whiskey tango foxtrot as to what the previous owners were thinking, and or not disclosing to the next buyer.
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Unread 03-09-2015, 07:29 AM   #6
spicoli69
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At a CJs age, no such thing as zero. Although my CJ is a >1%
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Unread 03-09-2015, 02:39 PM   #7
HackFabrication
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I think CJ's came from the factory with installed rust....
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:04 AM   #8
CJ7VFR
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As others have said, there is really no such thing as a zero rust CJ.

Most people lie about the condition their stuff is in when they are trying to sell it.

Only seeing the thing with your own eyes can determine the actual condition of a vehicle.
You need to be able to poke around under it, lift up the carpets and check the floor boards,
and have a nice magnet with you to see if body panels are metal, or just an entire tub of
Bondo.

It amazes me how much people lie about the condition of their stuff, and will tell you with
a straight face, yeah, its rust free. Or it's in great shape. Or its in excellent condition.

And then you go to see it, and its a total piece of crap. But they will tell you with a
straight face how great it is, even though you show them the rust bubbles and areas
where rust is starting to lift up the new paint they swore was original.

Yes Virginia, there is a Santa Claus (zero rust Jeep). It exists in the minds of every
guy who dreams of finding that still crated up WWII Jeep, never touched by human
hands. It is as real as a summer breeze in winter, and where all the world is puppies
and sunshine.

And then you wake up, get back out to the garage, and work on your own Jeep, and
curse the zero rust you just had to cut out of the floor to be replaced with a new
floor pan....

Jim
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:22 AM   #9
CurtG
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If you define rust with some form of quantitative system, you can get to a place that allows you to evaluate a Jeep's true rust condition.

Lets start with saying there are no CJ's with Zero rust.

Dust rust - That Rust that you can wipe with your hand and leaves rust color on your hand and has a powder like consistency. Only wiping a rag is required to remove most of it and mild sanding to get to bare metal. No bubbles or flakes exist.

Stage 1 rust - Rust that can be felt and sanding is required to remove it. Couse sand paper and wire wheel is needed to get the bare metal.

Stage 2 rust - Wire wheel and some chipping is required to get to bare metal. Base metal does not need to be repaired or replaced

Stage 3 rust - Wire wheel, Chipping and some metal removal is required to repair small areas 1 square foot or less of sheet metal is required. No structural integrity issues, body rust only.

Stage 4 rust - Large portions need to be cut out and replaced to restore to a like new condition. Some structural but repairable issues with frame.

Stage 5 rust - Large portions of body panels and structural issues. Repairs are not economically viable and replacement of components is required.

Stage 6- Its a pile of crapola and your insane for trying! However if you succeed you will be hailed as a Conqueror and beloved by at least one troll on this forum!


These are my opinions and are open to interpretation as you like feel free to offer other definitions. I hope we can get to a place all of us can agree on and use it for our future discussions about valuations of jeeps we want to buy or repair.


Curt
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:42 AM   #10
Jeepn-n-tx
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I like your assessment, Curt.

I don't worry about surface rust. Nor about rust holes in flat panels as I'm comfortable cutting & welding in patches. However, nasty, scaly rust in the seems or in places difficult to repair or replicate .... No go.

I checked out your Jeep in question & the biggest thing was that the rear wheel well seems we're busting all the way around. This means the rust had gotten in btwn the spot welds of the panels & had been there long enough that it was starting to push the panels apart.

As Ken said earlier, I just don't believe listings claiming zero rust. In this case, the seller just doesn't know what he has. Rust wise or Jeep wise.
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:47 AM   #11
WindKnot
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Oh there ARE Jeeps with zero rust; I have the receipts for mine to prove it. Realistically though nobody will buy it for what I put into it. If you see a CJ for sale advertised as "zero rust" and priced north of $20K it could actually be rust free. I'd still check it thoroughly though. I seriously doubt that you'll ever see one at prices "normal" enthusiasts will pay.

When someone says "zero rust", I expect to see VERY little. I also size up the seller and try to determine if he's naīve or flat out lying. There's a difference, in my opinion between "puffery" (We all do that when selling) and selling. Unless you know what you're doing, not all rust is obvious and you have to look for it. But when it's bleeding through paint or bubbling... no, that's not "zero rust".
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:55 AM   #12
Jeepn-n-tx
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Sorry Windknot .... I mistakenly misspoke & missed guys like you and Keith. Hahaha!!! Yes, there are zero rust Jeeps out there. Hahahaha!!!
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Unread 03-10-2015, 06:57 AM   #13
WindKnot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepn-n-tx View Post
Sorry Windknot .... I mistakenly misspoke & missed guys like you and Keith. Hahaha!!! Yes, there are zero rust Jeeps out there. Hahahaha!!!
I'm not worried. I'm also not "normal" But I do agree with your sentiment in that they're out of the ordinary.
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Unread 03-10-2015, 08:48 AM   #14
HackFabrication
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Originally Posted by CurtG View Post
Stage 6- Its a pile of crapola and your insane for trying! However if you succeed you will be hailed as a Conqueror and beloved by at least one troll on this forum!
Not the worse example, but this fits Stage 6:

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Unread 03-10-2015, 09:21 AM   #15
CurtG
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Originally Posted by HackFabrication View Post
Not the worse example, but this fits Stage 6:


We bow to your insanity....
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